On balancing stopping patterns v faster services

[whole diary]

[grahame]

I'm posting "Across the West" as here's a picture relevant to South Wales services, to services to the Cotswold line, and services to the South West too.   Taken on 2nd October 2014 - that was a Thursday morning - on board the "Capitals Limited" on its run into London Paddington where it arrived on time at around 08:54.  The train originates at Swansea, and calls at a number of stations from there to Swindon before running non-stop into Paddington at a peak time.



I was struck by the unusual (for these days) number of unoccupied seats on the train; it's certainly one of the quieter trains into the capital at that time of day, and as we dashed through Maidenhead we saw a sea of people waiting on the relief line platfoms for a service which - by educated guess - could have done with extra seating capacity.

There are discussions in various places (including some of our boards) of running faster services by skipping stops - and my example from the beginning of the month perhaps gives food for thought.  Whilst there is a balance to be had, does skipping stops lead to quieter, and ultimately fewer trains?  Would the good people of the cities of Heremouth or Plymford or south Wales prefer a clockface / hourly service that calls at the likes of Hollerton Junction, Felpersham, Melchester and Toneborough and takes 200 minutes, or a servive that runs every 2 hours, takes 175 minutes, but skips Holerton Junction, Melchester and Toneborough?  Not only does the skip-stop approach reduce the commercial case for a frequent service, but it also withdraws the best London trains from places like Melchester and Toneborough - and it will seriously impact on what might be significant traffic from the cities I mention to those not-insignificant places, with passengers filling seats (and helping keep everyone's fare down) on regional journeys.

Hollerton Junction, mind you, may not be an approapriate place for all the very long distance stuff to stop. Market research tells me that the traffic there may largely be local between Felpersham and the Junction, and that one or other (but not both) is approapriate for the longer distance trains, bearing in mind the regional services.

All food for thought ... logic may suggest certain changes (and we can argue and dicsuss them), but pragmaism should be applied for the next handful of years;  we are going to be in for major timetable and train pattern changes in 2017, and for the most part any changes made on those lines with services which will run onto the electrified GWML^▸ (Great Western Main Line) in the interim will need to be spectacular in the difference that it makes to make the inevitable disruption of yet another change worthwile.   The big decisions, then, are for whan IEP^▸ (Intercity Express Program / Project.) comes in and I'm sure that the experts are studying the details just as us armchair experts are!

[ellendune]

The issue of stopping patterns for services between Bristol (both TM^‡(resolve) and Parkway) and Didcot is that the trains are doing two jobs, they are the local services between the intermediate stations as well as the service to London.

Yesterday I caught to 09:11 Swindon to London.  The train was nicely full on arrival at Swindon.  However a significant number of people disembarked at Swindon so I (but not everyone) was able to get a seat.  At Didcot there was a further movement with most people from Swindon now seated but a larger number of people from Didcot standing.  Further much more major changeover at Reading from where the train was very full. 

If you skip stops you need to provide for this significant volume of local traffic in the Bristol to Reading Corridor.

[Oxonhutch]

One of only two Up services that does not call at Reading, the other being 1P16 the Up Didcot semi-fast HST^▸ (High Speed Train) which skips Reading but calls at Maidenhead, where from personal observation, it appears to Hoover up a platform full. There is also the one down service 1G60 to Cheltenham Spa whose first stop is Didcot in the evening.

I have always wondered if 1L20 (Up Swansea) was a hangover from GWR^▸ (Great Western Railway) / BR^▸ (British Rail(ways))(W) days when it would form the ^white collar express^ non-stop from their homes in Swindon to their desks at Paddington Headquarters before the 9 o^clock start.

[chrisr_75]

I'm stunned there are so many empty seats on that train given what they charge for BGN-PAD^» (Paddington (London) - next trains) on arrivals before 9:30am, I had always assumed those services would be full to capacity, but obviously not! Maybe Mondays when I used to travel would be different?

For a while during the Reading station refurb works, one of the early evening services to Swansea (either 18:45 or 19:15) was first stop Swindon, and didn't it make a difference! Whilst still busy, the train was free of all the crush of Reading/Didcot commuters which made it a very much more pleasant start than normal to a longish journey back to BGN. IMHO^▸ (in my humble opinion) that is how the long distance services should be - covering at least a third of the distance non-stop and then regular stops for set downs towards the end third or so of the journey. Of course, this sort of pattern for long distance services needs to be backed up by a robust commuter service pattern with sufficient capacity - maybe CrossRail will bring this on the London end of the GWML^▸ (Great Western Main Line)?

The was also at one point a proposal for a 19:12 PAD-SWA^» (Swansea - next trains), first stop BPW^» (Bristol Parkway - next trains), essentially as a relief service for the 19:15. The 19:12 made it into the published timetables as I recall - FGW^▸ (First Great Western) had trains, paths, crews etc only for DfT^» (Department for Transport - about) to disallow it 

[eightf48544]

The issue of stopping patterns for services between Bristol (both TM^‡(resolve) and Parkway) and Didcot is that the trains are doing two jobs, they are the local services between the intermediate stations as well as the service to London.

If you skip stops you need to provide for this significant volume of local traffic in the Bristol to Reading Corridor.

I think you've hit the nail on the head we are quite a densley populated small island with relatively small distances between signficant population centres most of which have stations but also act as railheads for the surrounding district. Also we have the major problem of London which is the principle destination for many rail travellers and thus requires many smaller stations to have a through service to London (certainly in peaks) to cater for this flow.

Therefore, trains probably need to stop every 20 miles or less to cater for the local traffic flows and pcik up London bound passengers. However the problem with this is that it slows down the Intercities which really should run 50 miles plus between stops. to give a fast service into London.

The problem is that we have lost so much rail capacity ie passing loops platforms out of use etc. that it is virtually impossible to run both a stopping and IC^▸ (Inter City) service on the same route.

Ideally we need two types of train RB Regional Bus which run say 50 miles and stops at all the local staions and ICs,  which stop less than every 50 mies.

So that the RB starts after IC and runs to the next IC stop where it is overtaken by the following IC. thus givng onward connections to London other major town served by the IC. There are two problems with this service pattern the distances are too small and there isn't the capacity for the ICs to leapfrog the RB on route plus it will deprive many stations of through service to London.

Probably the only way of solving the problem between London and Bristol is to 4 track Didcot to Thingley Junction.  Doulble through Melksham and reinstate the Bradford North Curve then 4 track from Bathampton Jn to Bristol. Plus extra platforms at Bath Chippenham and Swindon.  Thus the ICs would use the mainline whilst the RBs would be routed via Bradford and Melksham and could be overtaken at Bath, Chippenham Swindon Didcot and Reading. Although you'd still have the problem of the ICs stopping 5 times from Bristol to London ie every 20/5 miles.

Or... You build HS^▸ (High Speed (short for HSS^▸ (High Speed Services) High Speed Services)) 4 London Bristol with branch to Cardiff after Bristol (New Severn Tunnel Bristol to Newport) Exeter Plymouth.  
 

[Boppy]

I'm often stood on the platform at Reading when this service passes through.

My view has been that it must be a welcome service for those out west not having to stop at Reading but when I observe it going through I've never seen it that packed with seat occupancy in the 80% area I'd guess.

What I've wondered is can't it sometimes call at Reading to cater for when services from other routes are delayed?  I've been on a packed platform when other services around 8.30 at Reading are cancelled or delayed with the numbers of passengers on the platform at Reading swelling only for this service to pass through causing a great sagging of heads... 

[NickB]

What is the time window that needs to be clear for an hst to carry out a stop and get up to speed again?
So for example if an hst didn't run through a station how long would the following gap need to be before the next run through? 10mins?

[bobm]

While I understand that train often does have some seats available, I should point out it is half term in many places this week which does see a drop in the numbers travelling to work.

There have certainly been fewer on two peak hour trains I have caught this week.

[BBM]

As a regular Twyford commuter I of course welcome the fast services that stop there, but one particular benefit of that is that it frees up space on stopping services for passengers using stations nearer to London. This is evidenced by the various occasions when morning fast services have been cancelled leaving TWY^▸ (Twyford station) and MAI^▸ (Maidenhead station) commuters to pile onto the next available stopping service leaving it too jammed for people at places such as Langley and West Drayton to board.

My own regular train home in the evening is the 1706 PAD^» (Paddington (London) - next trains)-BRI^» (Bristol Temple Meads - next trains) (via Newbury and Trowbridge) which has TWY as its first stop. It does seem to empty quite a lot at TWY but my guess is that it fills up again at RDG^‡(resolve) as it provides part of the scheduled stopping service on the Berks and Hants line. I'd also guess that most PAD-RDG commuters will take either of the preceding 1700 or 1703 non-stop services. However unlike with those two trains, off-peak tickets are valid on the 1706 so I'd imagine that any RDG passengers with daily rather than season tickets will use it instead. I suppose it all sorts itself out in the end.