Consultation inputs sought - electrification disruption around Bath, 2015

[whole diary]

[ChrisB]

This is for the tunnels I believe

[Tim]

I tend to agree with Graham on his comments on stopping diverted services at Melksham.

It seems a shame to undermine a growing level of patronage there.

I also think it is a shame that the opportunity isn't being taken to put back the third side of the Thingley triangle to allow a Chippenham- Bath train to run via Melksham without a reversal.

For such a short bit of track you would mitigate the delays during the closure of the tunnel, provide an on going diversionary route when the tunnel is closed in future and (perhaps in compensation for suspension of Melksham stoppers during the summer works) Give more options for transwiltshire / Bristol metro services.  For example coupled with reopening a platform at Chippenham you could run a Bristol Metro route Temple Mead-Keynsham-Oldfield Park-Bath Spa- Corsham-Melksham-Chippenham thereby drawing Wiltshire into the Bristol hinterland. 

[Red Squirrel]

I tend to agree with Graham on his comments on stopping diverted services at Melksham.

It seems a shame to undermine a growing level of patronage there.

I also think it is a shame that the opportunity isn't being taken to put back the third side of the Thingley triangle to allow a Chippenham- Bath train to run via Melksham without a reversal.

For such a short bit of track you would mitigate the delays during the closure of the tunnel, provide an on going diversionary route when the tunnel is closed in future and (perhaps in compensation for suspension of Melksham stoppers during the summer works) Give more options for transwiltshire / Bristol metro services.  For example coupled with reopening a platform at Chippenham you could run a Bristol Metro route Temple Mead-Keynsham-Oldfield Park-Bath Spa- Corsham-Melksham-Chippenham thereby drawing Wiltshire into the Bristol hinterland. 

After a bit of staring at maps and head-scratching, I conclude that you must mean the missing chord at Staverton.

Actually I wonder what purpose the chord at Thingley served - though given that it was opened during the war and closed before 1960, I presume it had something to do with munitions and the various facilities buried round Box.

[grahame]

After a bit of staring at maps and head-scratching, I conclude that you must mean the missing chord at Staverton.

Actually I wonder what purpose the chord at Thingley served - though given that it was opened during the war and closed before 1960, I presume it had something to do with munitions and the various facilities buried round Box.

There was a major freight depot / yard at Lacock, just to the south of Thingley, and freight from there feeding into the MOD areas around Box tunnel. The chord also allowed freight from that yard to have a good route in from and out to the Bristol area.

Restoring the chord at Bradford Junction was in the Network Rail electrification proposals at one stage, just as the extra platform line at Westbury was in the Reading program. Both would have been potentially beneficial spinoffs of their programs, and undoubtedly would have / will help as works happen. However, both were "nice to do" options and were naturally removable as the projects were pared down.  The cynic may wonder if they were initially included, indeed, to allow negotiating space.

Looking ahead to either curve being re-instated in the future, I have to admit to being of two minds.  I can see use for both / either of them, but I can also see a danger in that if local passenger services on the TransWilts were split to go two ways at one end of the line or the other, we could end up with two services both with a frequency below the minimum needed to attract general growth.

[Tim]

I did mean the cord at Staverton / Bradford junction not Thingley.  My mistake sorry.

Having now looked at a map, I see that Thingley junction is east of Corsham so that a Corsham stop couldn't be included on a Chippenham-Bath route via Melksham.

I take Graham's point too.  Re-instatement of Staverton cord could lead to more services stopping at Melksham but it isn't really a "Transwiltshire" project.  Depends where Melksham wants to be directly connected to -  Bath and Bristol or Bradford, Trowbridge etc. 

I imagine it gets political at this point.  Complicated too.

[eightf48544]

I am beggining to think that small schemes like reinstating Bradfrod North curve and electrfying Bath to Thingley Junction via Melksahm and Bedwyn via Westbury would provide a far more resiliant and and useful railway  rather than HS2^▸ (The next High Speed line(s)).

Other schemes that spring to mind are Okehampton Bere Alston how long is Dawlish going to last? Connecting Birmingham Moor Steet to the Camp Hill line to give Birmingham another Suburban link. East West which does appear to be going ahead. Uckfield Lewes to relieve the Brighton main line.

In my neck of the woods reinstate Bourne End High Wycombe, just think of the connectivity with the Bicester link West Bound on East West and via Clayton junction to Milton Keynes and Bedford maybe Cambridge. This links the principle towns of North and South Bucks/Berks/Oxfordshire Milton Keynes Aylesbury Bicester Oxford High Wycombe Maidenhead and Slough.

Woodhead maybe as part 1 of HS3 but needs to serve Sheffield Midland.

Build all new stations on two track mainlines a 4 tracks with platform loops.

Schemes like this would seem to me to add far more useful services than HS2 and serve a greater population than HS2 which bascially only serves about 6 destinations.

As to whether reinstating the Bradford curve is a Transwilts project I would have thought an  hourly service from (Weston) Bristol to Swindon(London?) via Melksham together with a Swindon Salisbury Southampton would be very much a Tranwilts project.   

[ellendune]

I am beggining to think that small schemes like reinstating Bradfrod North curve and electrfying Bath to Thingley Junction via Melksahm and Bedwyn via Westbury would provide a far more resiliant and and useful railway  rather than HS2^▸ (The next High Speed line(s)).

Other schemes that spring to mind are Okehampton Bere Alston how long is Dawlish going to last? Connecting Birmingham Moor Steet to the Camp Hill line to give Birmingham another Suburban link. East West which does appear to be going ahead. Uckfield Lewes to relieve the Brighton main line.

In my neck of the woods reinstate Bourne End High Wycombe, just think of the connectivity with the Bicester link West Bound on East West and via Clayton junction to Milton Keynes and Bedford maybe Cambridge. This links the principle towns of North and South Bucks/Berks/Oxfordshire Milton Keynes Aylesbury Bicester Oxford High Wycombe Maidenhead and Slough.

Woodhead maybe as part 1 of HS3 but needs to serve Sheffield Midland.

Build all new stations on two track mainlines a 4 tracks with platform loops.

Schemes like this would seem to me to add far more useful services than HS2 and serve a greater population than HS2 which bascially only serves about 6 destinations.

As to whether reinstating the Bradford curve is a Transwilts project I would have thought an  hourly service from (Weston) Bristol to Swindon(London?) via Melksham together with a Swindon Salisbury Southampton would be very much a Tranwilts project.   

The services you suggest seem really good, but none of them will add capacity to the West Coast Mainline, the Midland Main line or the East Coast Mainline - which is what HS2 is all about. 

Similar improvements on these routes would still not address the basic problem - they are full!

And those 6 destinations - they seem to have a population far in excess of the whole of the South West of England!  And they are already connected to other places as well.