Advance fare increase with new timetable?

[whole diary]

[SDS]

There has been no notice of any fare increases and as such I suspect the super cheap advance quota (DBS^» (Deutsch Bahn Schenker - UK^▸ (United Kingdom) website)/DCS/DDS/DES) haven't been released or more likely the lower advance fares have had a zero quota allocated to them.
The DLS/DKS^▸ (Door Key Switch)/DHS/DFS/DAS^▸ (Driver Advisory System) maybe the only fare bands with allocated seats at the moment.

Edit:
The first journey details you mention on 9th May and 12th May are DDS and DCS ticket types.
The second journey details are DAS and DKS.

[chrisr_75]

There has been no notice of any fare increases and as such I suspect the super cheap advance quota (DBS^» (Deutsch Bahn Schenker - UK^▸ (United Kingdom) website)/DCS/DDS/DES) haven't been released or more likely the lower advance fares have had a zero quota allocated to them.
The DLS/DKS^▸ (Door Key Switch)/DHS/DFS/DAS^▸ (Driver Advisory System) maybe the only fare bands with allocated seats at the moment.

Edit:
The first journey details you mention on 9th May and 12th May are DDS and DCS ticket types.
The second journey details are DAS and DKS.

Could you explain what these ticket types are?

Unless it is simply a case of advance fare release being delayed, it seems there has been a sudden and marked change in their fare strategy on this route and at this time of day, so I have every intention of seeking an explanation about this from someone in a suitably informed position.

I don't think I would ever describe any of FGW^▸ (First Great Western) tickets as 'super-cheap' at the times I travel!!

[grahame]

Could you explain what these ticket types are?

It's a very brave person who tries ;-) ... but you will find them all listed and with links to terms ad conditions at:

http://www.brfares.com/#!fares?orig=PAD^» (Paddington (London) - next trains)&dest=BGN

London to Bridgend Singles ... there are over 40 different fares listed.  What the lost of fares won't tell you is what the allocation algorithms are.  And bear in mind that they don't show how you can get these tickets at a lower prices if you're lucky enough to be eligible for a rail card, or are a child or part of a group of 3 or 4 people.

P.S.  - I suspect that you know most of what's at http://twcrp.info/bestfares - our "getting the right fares" FAQ^▸ (Frequently Asked Questions) for the TransWilts line, but it ports quite well to elsewhere ... may be worth a look.

Edit to add P.S. and to fix link

[SDS]

You'd be very lucky to find out what the actual allocations to the ticket types listed are (Commercial sensitivity, apparently, you see). Ticket offices do not see how many seats are available, or not available, just that its available. It has been known for the availability to change in that split second between searching and attempting a reservation.


I would class the DES 1ST ADVANCE SINGLE at ^37.80 / ^40.60 as super cheap!!!

[warrej]

I've found the same thing on the route/times I travel.  Std class NTA^» (Newton Abbott - next trains)->PAD^» (Paddington (London) - next trains) on 0631 has been around ^31-^45 mark for years (recently ^37).  It is now ^75, or if I'm lucky ^55!  I also travel back on the 1945 from PAD and have noticed across the board increases in fares for STD and 1st advance ticket prices.  After putting up with a couple of months of driving back and forth to Tiverton Parkway at my own expense due to the disruption at Dawlish, it does seem a bit of a kick in the teeth!

Can anyone shed any light on the apparent increase in ticket prices S.Wales > London which appears to be related to the new Summer timetable?

I've checked my usual weekly trip, booking with advance first tickets for the following journeys:

PAD > BGN 9th May d15.45 & BGN > PAD 12th May d8.01, total ticket price ^111.10

PAD > BGN 20th June d15.45 & BGN > PAD 23rd June d7.56, total ticket price ^212.80

Anyone know why there is such a huge difference in ticket prices? I've checked for various dates travelling at the same times and found a similar difference so I'm sure this can't be a simple supply & demand issue - the later journey is about as far in advance as tickets can be purchased so advance availability should be good & Standard class tickets have also jumped up for the same journeys, from ^80.60 to ^109.50. Prices are as of about 1pm today (10/4/2014).

Would be interested to know if anyone else has noticed this on other routes, if anyone has any information from FGW^▸ (First Great Western) about planned or sanctioned fare increases or if this is a result of the way in which advance tickets are released for sale.


title changed to reflect question more accurately

[chrisr_75]

You'd be very lucky to find out what the actual allocations to the ticket types listed are (Commercial sensitivity, apparently, you see). Ticket offices do not see how many seats are available, or not available, just that its available. It has been known for the availability to change in that split second between searching and attempting a reservation.


I would class the DES 1ST ADVANCE SINGLE at ^37.80 / ^40.60 as super cheap!!!

After I thought about this I did wonder if a freedom of information request might reveal the advance ticket allocations (on balance a commercial argument for withholding this information doesn't make sense as FGW^▸ (First Great Western) operate essentially in a monopoly position, partic on S.Wales to London routings) but I'm not sure how far the definition 'public organisation' reaches into the rail sector, although the fact the TOC^▸ (Train Operating Company)'s receive vast subsidies to run some services might be an influencing factor - in an ideal world I'd like to think I have a right to know where my tax contributions are going...!

The cheap advance tickets you mention as of mid-May only appear to be available on journeys either in the middle of the day or at a time when all the interesting inebriated people are out and about, the former sadly isn't an option when you're commuting to work and the latter really isn't a very pleasant way to end the week!

[John R]

 The cheap advance tickets you mention as of mid-May only appear to be available on journeys either in the middle of the day or at a time when all the interesting inebriated people are out and about, the former sadly isn't an option when you're commuting to work
[/quote]

Given the purpose of advance tickets is to fill seats that otherwise wouldn't be taken at higher fares, then I'm not sure FGW^▸ (First Great Western) would be that happy if they thought many tickets were being used that way.

[JayMac]

After I thought about this I did wonder if a freedom of information request might reveal the advance ticket allocations (on balance a commercial argument for withholding this information doesn't make sense as FGW^▸ (First Great Western) operate essentially in a monopoly position, partic on S.Wales to London routings) but I'm not sure how far the definition 'public organisation' reaches into the rail sector

All TOCs^▸ (Train Operating Company), except East Coast which is currently publicly owned, are exempt from the provisions of the Freedom of Information Act. Though, even East Coast will not release details of Advance fares allocations due to commercial sensitivities. They have been asked in the past and such information has been withheld under Section 43(2) of the Freedom of Information Act.

One such request can be read at the following link:

https://www.whatdotheyknow.com/request/tickets_3

[chrisr_75]

Given the purpose of advance tickets is to fill seats that otherwise wouldn't be taken at higher fares, then I'm not sure FGW^▸ (First Great Western) would be that happy if they thought many tickets were being used that way.

Completely understand this, my issue is the fact that prices have suddenly jumped up in both first & standard (or should that be the number of advance fares allocated has fallen) when I fail to see that there has been a rapid rise in demand, especially when you consider that standard will have more seats available in the not too distant future...advance fares have been continuously available on the services I frequent for over 18 months, so why should this suddenly change?!

[ChrisB]

I think its well discussed on here the increases being seen across the rail network(s) over the last year or so? Not exactly surprising that availability of the cheapest fares is droping drastically

Also, FGW^▸ (First Great Western) are taking full risk on their business having come out of Revenue Support

[JayMac]

Also, FGW^▸ (First Great Western) are taking full risk on their business having come out of Revenue Support

So the profit and shareholder dividend has to come solely from their own coffers and not the taxpayer. Equally any losses will be born solely by the company. Makes it much more understandable why they are heavily increasing the price/drastically reducing the availability of Advance Purchase fares.

It'll be interesting to see what they do with unregulated walk-up fares in January next year. They've pretty much kept these unregulated fares rises pegged to the same percentage as those that are regulated by Government in the past few years.

[chrisr_75]

Also, FGW^▸ (First Great Western) are taking full risk on their business having come out of Revenue Support

So the profit and shareholder dividend has to come solely from their own coffers and not the taxpayer. Equally any losses will be born solely by the company. Makes it much more understandable why they are heavily increasing the price/drastically reducing the availability of Advance Purchase fares.

It'll be interesting to see what they do with unregulated walk-up fares in January next year. They've pretty much kept these unregulated fares rises pegged to the same percentage as those that are regulated by Government in the past few years.

That sounds like the most plausible reason for this "increase" and is also a positive in that they'll also have to accept liability of the risk of people decamping to other forms of transport and the consequent loss of revenue. I wonder how many people will ultimately be put off using FGW as some of the increases are close to 100%...it all strikes me as taking advantage of a virtual monopoly position and also contrary to what a public service should provide, but there we go...!

[bobm]

What hasn't helped in this case is we are looking at, in the main, on-line fares.  Here there has been a double effect - the withdrawal of the 10% web discount and a rise in the base price  or change in the allocations.

It might have been better, from a marketing point of view, if the two had not happened at the same time.

[chrisr_75]

I hadn't noticed that the 10% online discount had stopped, not that it made the slightest difference to the actual price paid when it first appeared (if my memory serves me right, each fare type went up a few pounds when the online 10% 'discount' first came along), so in effect that was just a means to disguise another 10% increase!

[Sleepy]

Perhaps FGW^▸ (First Great Western) are worried lots of two together railcards are going to be used over the summer ?