Fares from Frome to the West

[whole diary]

[WSW Frome]

Can the ticketing experts please advise why there is (apparently) no legitimate return fare from Frome to Taunton via Westbury. Such tickets are available to points further west such as TVP or EXD^» (Exeter St Davids - next trains).

Since it would normally be a commonly-used route, especially in earlier years, is this a new restriction with the new Routing Guide or has it existed since Noah was very young. After all surely some residents of Frome may occasionally wish to visit (at a convenient time) the Somerset County Town albeit located on the other side of the County.

Thanks

[LiskeardRich]

Should a resident of Frome wish to visit Taunton the only tickets available require travel and changing via Castle Cary. A anytime return is ^20.40.

Via Westbury would fail the routing guide, due to the additional distance involved in travel.


An anytime from Frome to Westbury and the Westbury to Taunton with splits would be

Frome to Westbury ^4.20
Westbury to Taunton ^24.00

[thetrout]

Frome - Taunton returns are accepted via Westbury

Whilst it may fail the routing guide, RPIs^▸ (Revenue Protection Inspector (or Retail Price Index, depending on the context)) have accepted tickets as there are some journeys Frome - Taunton that are possible via Westbury but not Castle Cary

[SDS]

Frome - Taunton returns are accepted via Westbury

Whilst it may fail the routing guide, RPIs^▸ (Revenue Protection Inspector (or Retail Price Index, depending on the context)) have accepted tickets as there are some journeys Frome - Taunton that are possible via Westbury but not Castle Cary

I do believe there is a local instruction, (not easement as ATOC^» (Association of Train Operating Companies See - here) would get its nickers in a twist).

[thetrout]

I do believe there is a local instruction, (not easement as ATOC^» (Association of Train Operating Companies See - here) would get its nickers in a twist).

From the past 6 years, I have only ever had a problem once using said route. This was on a diverted South West Trains service. Later in the journey the guard returned to apologise as he said the ticket had "Any Permitted" written on it so I was using it correctly.

I agree, whilst it's not specified in the Routeing Guide, it's one of those where when you explain your route/train times, common sense prevails Because of course, if you sit around at Cheltenham Spa Castle Cary station for 2 hours, you may just be asked to leave for loitering

[WSW Frome]

Thanks for the information to date. Nobody yet has answered the question as to why there ARE published fares from Frome to stations further West. I am sure BNM knows the answer but it is probably just one of those old anomalies.

Now the real question is - that should I wish to use the 08.02 FRO^» (Frome - next trains)/08.25 WSB^» (Westbury - next trains) to TAU^» (Taunton - next trains) can I buy an Off Peak Return (Code WG). It would be preferable to do this on line so that I do not have to argue my case but there is no obvious way of doing so since there is no published fare available on National Rail or Mixing Deck sites. This fare is the same price from FRO or WSB.

Any further thoughts?

[WSW Frome]

Of course, I have just realised you can by this Off Peak Return ticket on-line perfectly easily. It is just that the journey option is not shown because it "is not a (formal) permitted route." This is in fact probably the only train where such a ticket is required since all later trains appear to allow the CDR^▸ (Off Peak Day Return [ticket type] (formerly 'Cheap Day')) (W4) price.

[JayMac]

Thanks for the information to date. Nobody yet has answered the question as to why there ARE published fares from Frome to stations further West. I am sure BNM knows the answer but it is probably just one of those old anomalies.

Now the real question is - that should I wish to use the 08.02 FRO^» (Frome - next trains)/08.25 WSB^» (Westbury - next trains) to TAU^» (Taunton - next trains) can I buy an Off Peak Return (Code WG). It would be preferable to do this on line so that I do not have to argue my case but there is no obvious way of doing so since there is no published fare available on National Rail or Mixing Deck sites. This fare is the same price from FRO or WSB.

Any further thoughts?

The only answer I know is the one you've given. An anomaly.

You could ask FGW^▸ (First Great Western) if they will expressly permit what may well currently be a local instruction, by amending the Electronic Routeing Guide to include Taunton as a valid destination via Westbury using the 0802 from Frome. With Frome having such a poor service generally, it does make sense for the 0802 changing onto the 0825 at Westbury to be valid to Taunton, as it is for stations further west.

Without such an easement expressly permitting such a journey, anyone wishing to travel from Frome to Taunton can not do so before 0941 for a 1053 arrival, according to journey planners. That really is poor connectivity for two towns in the same county. Only those who interrogate the system further, as WSW Frome has, will find that the JP allows them to go to Tiverton and beyond, but not Taunton.

Whilst journey planners don't currently allow such a journey, I don't see there being any problem doing it. As SDS says, there may well be local instruction, but if not, it would be very harsh on FGWs part to penalise someone travelling to Taunton via Westbury when it is perfectly legitimate for others to travel to Tiverton Parkway, Exeter and so on.

What also needs fixing for this journey, and the others further west, is the JP only offering the Anytime (SOS/SOR) fare from Frome via Westbury at 0802. You are connecting into an Off Peak (SVS/SVR) service leaving Westbury at 0825. That should be allowed according to the restriction code text. Potential overcharging there.

WSW, I suggest you raise these points with FGW. It may take some escalation before you get a decent answer - fares and their arcane restrictions are little studied by the average Customer Service bod! Let us know how you get on.

[LiskeardRich]

How much extra is a Tiverton ticket? I would probably buy a Tiverton ticket and break my journey at Taunton to be safe without any written confirmation its acceptable to do the route on a Taunton ticket.

[JayMac]

An extra ^9.

Should folk have to pay a premium to be 'safe'?

Not something I'd suggest. You are, in effect, rewarding the TOCs^▸ (Train Operating Company) for their inability to have a fares system that is, er, fair.

[LiskeardRich]

An extra ^9.

Should folk have to pay a premium to be 'safe'?

Not something I'd suggest. You are, in effect, rewarding the TOCs^▸ (Train Operating Company) for their inability to have a fares system that is, er, fair.

Fair enough, I didn't expect such a large difference in price to be honest. My commute is a similar distance to Taunton to Tiverton and its around ^4 return, or as part of a longer journey only ^1-2 difference between tickets with destination of the 2 stations. At those prices I would pay just to avoid the potential difficulties I would expect, but saying that FGW^▸ (First Great Western) staff are much more relaxed with ticketing than those found at other TOCs.

[WSW Frome]

Thanks for the comments but eventually I decided to travel to the West Somerset Railway Gala using the later options, especially as the return journey times to Frome are limited. Therefore I avoided any ticket anomalies and dutifully changed at Castle Cary which is not my normal preference.

The WSR Gala was something of an operating disaster yesterday. More problems than a TOC^▸ (Train Operating Company) on a bad day and poor customer information at least late in the day. I eventually resolved to bus back to Taunton in order to maintain my sanity and keep warm. I therefore only managed a slow single journey with my Rover ticket!

The experts (and I) all agree that travel via WSB^» (Westbury - next trains) is never likely to be a problem. In fact ticket checks FRO^» (Frome - next trains)-WSB (and v/v) are quite rare due to "operating" issues and most RPIs^▸ (Revenue Protection Inspector (or Retail Price Index, depending on the context)) will not know or care about this anomaly. The use of an SVR ticket on the 08.02/08.25 is a recent phenomena since the 08.25 is newer service and seems acceptable as the timing is not fully off peak. It would still be helpful to have the anomaly restriction for journeys to/from TAU^» (Taunton - next trains) via WSB corrected as there are a number of (fast/acceptable) journey options to/from Frome involving WSB changes. An excellent example being the (very important) 12.55 PLY^» (Plymouth - next trains) (at normal times).

Finally should anyone be worried about this restriction, split tickets at WSB would cure the problem but at an additional cost.