FGW says no to steam on the Night Riviera

[whole diary]

[bobm]

This news release has appeared on the FGW^▸ (First Great Western) website to rebut suggestions elsewhere that a night time run with Tornado was being planned.

Tornado Steam Engine on Night Riviera Sleeper
Tuesday 18th March 2014

First Great Western supports the use of heritage traction on the national network, including steam, Indeed we are working closely to facilitate one such operation in May, but the challenges that would need to be overcome to use a steam engine with the sleeper are frankly enormous

It would require considerable planning, right at a time when our efforts remain fully focused on getting services back to normal after the flooding and looking after our customers.

We will be doing a number of things to celebrate the opening of the Dawlish line and supporting the return of rail services to and from Devon and Cornwall. A steam hauled sleeper is not one of them however.

Even if it was possible to find a safe way to do it, and this is by no means straightforward, most people on the sleeper want to be in bed. It is not therefore the passenger spectacle that a steam service by day provides. We might well look at a steam service in Devon and Cornwall later this year, but this will not involve the sleeper.

The sleeper is all about giving customers a good night^s sleep, rather than providing an exciting outing in the middle of the night. Not that we oppose exciting outings, we have done more than any other TOC^▸ (Train Operating Company) to support steam runs on our network.

We appreciate this will be disappointing but this is not something we are going to offer on the sleeper train, especially when we are working to get business back to normal.
 
Prior to the sea wall collapse we had been seeing significant growth in passenger numbers on the sleeper, . We will continue to focus our energy on encouraging this important group of customers back to the sleeper when it returns in April. With support from Cornwall Council and the Cornwall and Isles of Scilly Local Enterprise Partnership, we have also secured under this franchise extra seasonal capacity for leisure and business passengers on our Night Riviera Sleeper. This will mean one additional sleeping car and another seated carriage introduced to the service

[SDS]

Plus I bet NeR would not allow it.

[broadgage]

I would agree, that steam is not very suitable for the sleeper.
Not much to see from the lineside as it would be dark for much of the trip.
Those on board would no doubt prefer to sleep than to admire a steamer.
The water stops are likely to be more disruptive than the usual station stops.

I do hope however that one or more steam hauled daytime trains could be arranged.

[TonyK]

Even if it was possible to find a safe way to do it, and this is by no means straightforward, most people on the sleeper want to be in bed.

And I thought they wanted to get hammered in the bar...

[Cynthia]

I would agree, that steam is not very suitable for the sleeper.

Why???  I can remember travelling to Newcaste-upon-Tyne from Swindon in, um, 1958,  on a family outing.  Lovely journey!  Not that I can remember much of it, as once darkness fell I was lulled into my slumbers by all the wonderful sounds of the railway.  Ah!  Those were the days!

[trainer]

Not that I can remember much of it, as once darkness fell I was lulled into my slumbers by all the wonderful sounds of the railway.

I think that's the answer to your question, Cynthia.  Everyone's asleep and to go to all that expensive trouble for a sentimental feeling is probably not the best use of money for the national railway or the heritage people.

[broadgage]

Indeed, steam used to be used for virtualy all trains including sleepers.
But these days steam haulage is rather an expensive undertaking, and it seems more sensible to use it for daylight runs when it may be best appreciated.

I hope that we will see steam on the GW^▸ (Great Western), preferably in the form of a charter to Minehead

[Cynthia]

Yes of course, when I was a little one, it was steam or nothing, so strange to think now that this mode of transport is thought of as a luxury!  I must say, to go off-topic slightly, I'm surprised the green lobby hasn't tried to ban the use of steam engines, as I assume they're pretty dirty machines in terms of CO2 output.

[ellendune]

I must say, to go off-topic slightly, I'm surprised the green lobby hasn't tried to ban the use of steam engines, as I assume they're pretty dirty machines in terms of CO2 output.

Not just CO2, also sulphur and particulates.

Nevertheless the number of steam engines in use does not amount to much in the global sum of things.

[Cynthia]

I must say, to go off-topic slightly, I'm surprised the green lobby hasn't tried to ban the use of steam engines, as I assume they're pretty dirty machines in terms of CO2 output.

Not just CO2, also sulphur and particulates.

Nevertheless the number of steam engines in use does not amount to much in the global sum of things.

The trouble with journeys undertaken on a steam heritage line, they are not really carbon off-set-able (a clumsy term, but can't think of a better one at present!) as the passengers are mostly what I think you call 'bashers'? Just there for the ride.  I noted last year though, that on the West Somerset Line there seemed to be a number of locals using the Line for a specific journey, it being a reasonable distance, from Bishops Lydeard to Minehead.  Similarly, on the North Norfolk heritage railway, there seemed to be some passengers going to Holt (or indeed, Sheringham) for a purpose.  How many other steam lines are being used as regular travel routes, does anyone know? 

[Chris from Nailsea]

The South Devon Railway into Totnes connects fairly easily with 'the big railway', so is used by many wishing to travel rather wider ... 

[JayMac]

I'd argue that the worst carbon footprint for many heritage railways is the fact that the vast majority of visitors have to use road transport to get to the attraction.

In many cases (West Somerset Railway being a classic example) it is so only for want of a permanent connection to the national rail network.

Others are more fortunate. The Severn Valley Railway has just walking distance between its station at Kidderminster and its namesake on the national network. Dartmouth Steam Railway is next door at Paignton.

[Chris from Nailsea]

... and the Bodmin & Wenford ... 

[Cynthia]

I'd argue that the worst carbon footprint for many heritage railways is the fact that the vast majority of visitors have to use road transport to get to the attraction.

In many cases (West Somerset Railway being a classic example) it is so only for want of a permanent connection to the national rail network.

Others are more fortunate. The Severn Valley Railway has just walking distance between its station at Kidderminster and its namesake on the national network. Dartmouth Steam Railway is next door at Paignton.

I had an interesting conversation with the folk running the rail museum at Holt, who were talking about the difficulties of connecting to a main line, I think due to all the safety regulations and other rules, that obviously heritage railways have to abide with as much as any other TOC^▸ (Train Operating Company).  I think the difficulties arise because so many of the heritage railway staff are volunteers, I imagine it must be a nightmare trying to get everyone concerned trained up.

CfN:  Bodmin & Wenford?  That doesn't connect with the main line now, does it?  It was a very short, there-and-back journey last time I was down that way.

[JayMac]

Yep. Cross platform (or footbridge if coming from the Plymouth direction) interchange to the B&WR at Bodmin Parkway.