The Class 180s air con

[whole diary]

[James]

The 1808 from Reading, is very hot, with no windows. Does the air con normally work on these units?

[IndustryInsider]

Does the air con normally work on these units?

Yes.  Too well normally.

[James]

Does the air con normally work on these units?

Yes.  Too well normally.

Ah ok cheers, reason why i ask is because i heard some sort of ventaliation system on the ceiling of the Class 180 coach C blowing air through, and i wonder if it was hot air rather than cold air, if so what system is the air con linked up to draw in this hot air?

Apart from that a bit unusual to see a Class 180 working a Semi fast service calling at Twyford, Maidenhead, Slough, Hayes, Ealing Broadway and Paddington.
On the plus side at least the driver or guard (dont know which) have some useful info to passengers about 'If you travelling to London Paddington, you need to deboard here and travel on the other fast services as this particular one, the one i was on would take 54minutes instead of 30 minutes' although people didnt look that bothered about the announcement... Strange. Maybe there wanted a stuffy hot train who knows 

[IndustryInsider]

Ah ok cheers, reason why i ask is because i heard some sort of ventaliation system on the ceiling of the Class 180 coach C blowing air through, and i wonder if it was hot air rather than cold air, if so what system is the air con linked up to draw in this hot air?

The system is all one big system which either heats, cools or vents air depending on what temperature the sensors in the carriage are recording.  If those sensors are faulty, or the cooling/heating elements are faulty it might lead to a hot coach, but this is quite unusual in a Class 180.

Apart from that a bit unusual to see a Class 180 working a Semi fast service calling at Twyford, Maidenhead, Slough, Hayes, Ealing Broadway and Paddington.

Make the most of it as it's reverting to a Turbo as of Monday until at least December.

[James]

Oh good, the return of the lovely turbo. I foresee cold conditions on the trains if the weather changes.

Thankyou, i now have a better understanding of air con system. However this heat on Class 180 was at the beginning of service so goodness knows how hot it got in the end...

[ChrisB]

The system only works while the engine is running.

So if it's at the start of the day / been laid up during the day etc, it will start out warm, until the circulation gets going.

I understand that there is a legal H&S^▸ (Health and Safety) requirement on forced air circulation in sealed coaches - so many litres of air per minute need to be forced through - or at least be designed to do so. This can be heated / cooled by use of thermostats as required.

[James]

The system only works while the engine is running.

So if it's at the start of the day / been laid up during the day etc, it will start out warm, until the circulation gets going.

I understand that there is a legal H&S^▸ (Health and Safety) requirement on forced air circulation in sealed coaches - so many litres of air per minute need to be forced through - or at least be designed to do so. This can be heated / cooled by use of thermostats as required.

Only when the engine is on? so you're telling me that the adelante's air con only works when that happens, that's ridiculous really. What did FGW^▸ (First Great Western) do to improve the adelantes apart from the door fixing and engine fixing? Did it not look at a system of air con that operates also when the engine is off, or is that due to cost? If it is cost then provide windows as on the turbo's

Well had the 1808 been severely overcrowded then it would have breached that H&S requirement, or tho tbh maybe we need to give FGW a break so they can look into the air con again. Always a third chance... and do those thermostats work not when i have been on them.
Sorry for the heavy questioning but this does need action taken on all the 180's that have the air con that fails.
P.S i bet people missed the regular turbo train on the 1808 yesterday 

[ChrisB]

James, I think you are old enough to think things through?

How would you power the aircon when a disel engine is switched off? Where is the power going to come from?

[James]

James, I think you are old enough to think things through?

How would you power the aircon when a disel engine is switched off? Where is the power going to come from?

Well ChrisB, thats simple erm...
Lets be realistic ok, if a electric switch was provided on its know for the aircon (without needing to start the engine, my gosh look at how much fuel you could save) then it could operate that way, or is that too technical and costly for fgw...

[ChrisB]

On its know?

[James]

Oh my gosh, right lets be simple so you can understand....
If a wire was connected too all the coaches of the train and onto the air con with one switch in the cab for air con only (as on aircraft and cars) then it should work. Are you really telling me that no trains have this function?

[grahame]

James - I don't think you've answered ChrisB's point about where the power to operate the air conditioning would come from if the engines weren't running.   Lights are all well and good from limited batteries, but aircon would drain them very quickly indeed with little effect.

"On its know" confused me too - I think you meant "on its own" - and that was clarified by your later post. But it wasn't that it needed simplifying for the rest of us - rather than it needed clarifying.

[IndustryInsider]

The power to air-condition a whole train is quite a lot.  180s generally have very good air conditioning which starts working fully within a couple of minutes of the engines being switched on.  It is very rare to have passengers on board whilst the engines are switched off on a Class 180 anyway, so the whole argument is pretty academic.  HST^▸ (High Speed Train)'s are no different - if the carriages aren't getting a supply from one of the power cars with its engine switched on then there is no air-con after a very short while.

If there is an air-conditioning fault, inform the train manager who might be able to get it working by resetting the system and if not it can get booked in for repairs at the end of service.  If you can, try a different carriage, or even the other end of the carriage you are in - like the Turbo's there are more than one thermostat in each carriage, so the temperature can be noticeably different in each end of the carriage.  In rare cases when the heat is exceptional then that carriage or the whole train may need to be taken out of service.

[James]

James - I don't think you've answered ChrisB's point about where the power to operate the air conditioning would come from if the engines weren't running.   Lights are all well and good from limited batteries, but aircon would drain them very quickly indeed with little effect.

"On its know" confused me too - I think you meant "on its own" - and that was clarified by your later post. But it wasn't that it needed simplifying for the rest of us - rather than it needed clarifying.

Cheers Grahame. I hope ChrisB understands were i am coming from then from the latter post i made.
Just surprises me that no alternative is provided to power the aircon other than the engines... maybe like i said before ' this needs looking more into.'

[James]

The power to air-condition a whole train is quite a lot.  180s generally have very good air conditioning which starts working fully within a couple of minutes of the engines being switched on.  It is very rare to have passengers on board whilst the engines are switched off on a Class 180 anyway, so the whole argument is pretty academic.  HST^▸ (High Speed Train)'s are no different - if the carriages aren't getting a supply from one of the power cars with its engine switched on then there is no air-con after a very short while.

If there is an air-conditioning fault, inform the train manager who might be able to get it working by resetting the system and if not it can get booked in for repairs at the end of service.  If you can, try a different carriage, or even the other end of the carriage you are in - like the Turbo's there are more than one thermostat in each carriage, so the temperature can be noticeably different in each end of the carriage.  In rare cases when the heat is exceptional then that carriage or the whole train may need to be taken out of service.

Yes thank you for that, tbh Coach C was over the heat marker, and i was going to tell someone but was in a rush, but nevermind, maybe its sorted out now you never know