Dry toilets, oh the mess!

[whole diary]

[Dark Star]

As a newbie, I hope this is in the right place, forgive me if it's not.

I'm no fan of first group, but since 2006 first great western have fitted more seats to HST^▸ (High Speed Train) cars, what else did first do?
They remove the toilet from coach A and one from coach H, and then wonder why toilets run dry, which off course means blocked and stinking toilets, not nice.

Of course seasoned travellers know this horrible fact, but to add insult, first have also withdrawn watering equipment at Exeter St David's and also Plymouth, did you know that?
With more passengers travelling, trains should be watered more often not less.  well I'm fed up with dry toilets on fgw trains, anyone know the contact details for Reading area environmental Health?
Time to make a phone call.

Dark Star.

[sprinterguard]

I'm no fan of first group, but since 2006 first great western have fitted more seats to HST^▸ (High Speed Train) cars, what else did first do?

In an ideal world every HST would be 4 around the table in a low density layout. In reality, every inch of space is needed for seating on a railway with increasing passenger numbers.

I think the refurbishment positives far outweigh the negatives, but that is just my opinion.

[bobm]

I have travelled just over 20,000 miles so far this year - much of it on FGW^▸ (First Great Western) HSTs^▸ (High Speed Train) and I must admit I have found far fewer faulty toilets than in the past, but then perhaps I have been lucky.

I am surprised the watering facilities have been withdrawn at Plymouth given that a number of services start/terminate there. 

How much water does an HST coach carry and how much water does each "flush" use - anyone know?

[CLPGMS]

From my observations, the most likely toilet to run dry is the one at the Coach A end of Coach B.  FGW^▸ (First Great Western) converted the one toilet in Coach A into a storage area when it was decided to remove the buffet car and use a trolley for refreshments instead.  Passengers in Coach A who require to use a toilet naturally go to the nearest one in Coach B.  Now that decision regarding buffets has been reversed and all HSTs^▸ (High Speed Train) have at least a mini-buffet in Coach F, can anyone explain why the toilet in Coach A cannot be reinstated?

[IndustryInsider]

Cost?  It can also be useful as a storage area for certain equipment trolleys which are still in use on some of the shorter distance routes, such as Oxford-London HST^▸ (High Speed Train)'s.  Though certainly not essential any more, so they would be more use converted back to toilets.

[Southern Stag]

I am surprised the watering facilities have been withdrawn at Plymouth given that a number of services start/terminate there. 

It's actually a rather minimal number of trains which start/terminate at Plymouth. At the moment only 1 train each weekday turns around at Plymouth, the 1106 from London to form the 1500 return service. Outside the High Summer it is 3 services. Other services continue to Penzance where there are watering facilities or go ECS^▸ (Empty Coaching Stock) to/from Laira depot, again where toilets can be watered.

[Super Guard]

There are only 2 services a day that terminate/start at EXD^» (Exeter St Davids - next trains).  The 0546 EXD-PAD^» (Paddington (London) - next trains) (formed off 2145 PAD-EXD), and the 1955 EXD-PAD (from 1636 PAD-EXD).

I have never known a problem with the 1955 running out of water, especially as it is a lightly used service.  The 0546 does occasionally have toilets that run out, but then, does 1 service a day justify the equipment expense?

[bobm]

I am surprised the watering facilities have been withdrawn at Plymouth given that a number of services start/terminate there. 

It's actually a rather minimal number of trains which start/terminate at Plymouth. At the moment only 1 train each weekday turns around at Plymouth, the 1106 from London to form the 1500 return service. Outside the High Summer it is 3 services. Other services continue to Penzance where there are watering facilities or go ECS^▸ (Empty Coaching Stock) to/from Laira depot, again where toilets can be watered.

Would XC^▸ (Cross Country Trains (franchise)) services, including their HST^▸ (High Speed Train) sets, avail themselves of the facilities at Plymouth Station if they were available?

[smokey]

I was at Newquay recently, on a London bound HST^▸ (High Speed Train) and found some Dry toilets on the HST before Plymouth (where I left the train) one in coach B and also one in coach E, I wonder how many were dry by London, as once 1 runs dry the remainder get hammered.

But is this the way to treat you most important customers of the year, lots of Holiday makers who may be making there ONLY FGW^▸ (First Great Western) trip off the year?

Do FGW want them back next year, and what do they say to family and friends,
"Great Holiday, but the train was distgusting"

So why have FGW stopped watering trains at Newquay?

I think it stinks.  

[Lee]

I have never known a problem with the 1955 running out of water, especially as it is a lightly used service.  The 0546 does occasionally have toilets that run out, but then, does 1 service a day justify the equipment expense?

I will often pick the 1955 if I'm travelling back from a day on the Devon & Cornwall network, precisely because it's a lightly-used service, providing an excellent opportunity to set up my laptop on the table nearest the buffet and write up my thoughts or catch up on my e-mails.

I cant say I've ever seen the water run out on it either.

[John R]

But is this the way to treat you most important customers of the year, lots of Holiday makers who may be making there ONLY FGW^▸ (First Great Western) trip off the year?

i suspect we could have quite a debate as to whether any business would regard their most important customers as those who make one purchase a year against those who make repeat purchases throughout the year.

[dog box]

The capacity of the roof tank is approx. 160 Gallons, toilets do run dry but its not as often as you may think , one possible reason is the toilet flush control looks like one of those modern wave your hands in front button when what you have to do is actually press the button hard, people wave there hands in front the toilet doesn't flush and they assume there is no water left.
exactly the same situation occurs with the taps, people wave there hands under the tap when you need to hold you hand steady under it...I am not saying there aren't dry toilets and faulty taps but I reckon 75% of so called faults are due to the above

[Gordon the Blue Engine]

I'm a bit surprised by the view that it's OK if toilets run dry sometimes.  The Newquay service is a good example: presumably the train is watered before it leaves Padd, and then does a return trip to Newquay before it's watered again.  So is it FGW^▸ (First Great Western)'s planning assumption that it's OK if the toilets run dry on the return service?  And it's OK if the carriage cleaners then have an even more unpleasant job than usual by having to clean the unflushed toilets for the next trip? 

Incidentally, I think another reason for toilets running dry is faulty flush valves that may in extreme cases just manage 1 flush of 160 gallons. 

[Southern Stag]

I am surprised the watering facilities have been withdrawn at Plymouth given that a number of services start/terminate there. 

It's actually a rather minimal number of trains which start/terminate at Plymouth. At the moment only 1 train each weekday turns around at Plymouth, the 1106 from London to form the 1500 return service. Outside the High Summer it is 3 services. Other services continue to Penzance where there are watering facilities or go ECS^▸ (Empty Coaching Stock) to/from Laira depot, again where toilets can be watered.

Would XC^▸ (Cross Country Trains (franchise)) services, including their HST^▸ (High Speed Train) sets, avail themselves of the facilities at Plymouth Station if they were available?

I doubt it, I don't believe XC services were watered at Plymouth when the facilities were available. They certainly don't use the facilities at Penzance for their weekly HST run there. And the toilets on that service are rather disgusting, going York-Penzance-Leeds without being watered. XC HST sets have fewer toilets than FGW^▸ (First Great Western) sets to start with as well.

[eightf48544]

Interesting thread, just a thought, wonder what the Public Health Officials would do if passengers reported to them dry toilets next time they encountered one!

Feel a little sympathy for the TOCs^▸ (Train Operating Company) as a minority (?) of  passengers don't seem to be either very tidy or a respector of the toilets. Is it a chicken and egg situation the TOCs give us the toilets we deserve!