Oh First Great Western, what shall we do?

[whole diary]

[Lee]

I said earlier that it won't change overnight, nor next week or the week after that and probally not next year either with a change of franchise ownership and those of you on here thinking it will are living in cloud cuckoo land.

I believe that after talking with a few of the Waterloo based SWT^▸ (South West Trains) drivers (a couple of them ASLEF^» (Associated Society of Locomotive Engineers and Firemen - about) militants as well) we have a bloke in charge who was highly thought of at SWT and might even turn this shambles around given the chance, lets ( all of us) hope so! Oh and please remember that He's only been in the job 3 months

As I said earlier in the topic, the main problem is public perception. We forum members who, perhaps, have gained a little more knowledge of how the current situation came about than the average punter know that a) it isnt all FGW^▸ (First Great Western)'s fault and b) it is unlikely to be resolved quickly.

However, with a media frenzy which will soon be fed further by the upcoming MTLS^▸ (More Train Less Strain) action, growing calls from MP^▸ (Member of Parliament)'s for "something to be done" and the fact that passengers see FGW's name on the side of a train service which is simply not delivering, the result is a PR^▸ (Public Relations) disaster of nightmarish proportions.

One that Haines knows he needs to resolve quickly, hence his focus on "customer excellence." Will he get the time he requires? Forster didnt, and many commentators (among them several forum members) spoke highly of her as well.

[devon_metro]

FGW^▸ (First Great Western) need to strike some form of deal, where by they can get hold of lots of units, wether it be class 142s, when trains are busy, people aren't overly bothered what the train is like, as long as it is not falling apart!

Take the situation in Devon, previously we were stuck with 2 or 1 cars, with a few trains strenghned by a 153 at peak. Now we have some fairly permenant 4 car diagrams adding capacity. If FGW could hire some 142s *cheap*, services in Bristol could be strengthened and please the MTLS^▸ (More Train Less Strain) lot and other punters.

[Lee]

Units currently in storage, and (in theory) available to lease :

142071 - Angel Trains, Heaton depot.
142078 - Angel Trains, Glasgow Railcare Works.
142095 - Angel Trains, Heaton depot.
165127 - Angel Trains, Crewe Works.

[devon_metro]

Isn't the 165 from one of the rail crashes?

[Btline]

Units currently in storage, and (in theory) available to lease :

142071 - Angel Trains, Heaton depot.
142078 - Angel Trains, Glasgow Railcare Works.
142095 - Angel Trains, Heaton depot.
165127 - Angel Trains, Crewe Works.

What about Mk 2 carriages? Surely there are more of these in storage, which FGW^▸ (First Great Western) could bring in to strengthen DMUs^▸ (Diesel Multiple Unit) in the Bristol area.

Ok, they may not be perfect. But seats.......

[Shazz]

MK2's can be used on DMU^▸ (Diesel Multiple Unit)'s?

[Lee]

Isn't the 165 from one of the rail crashes?

Could be the one in the quote below, anybody confirm? :

I think any unit would have been demolished if hit at high speed by a loco! remember the remains of the 165 in the Paddington rail crash after the HST^▸ (High Speed Train) hit it??

What about Mk 2 carriages? Surely there are more of these in storage, which FGW^▸ (First Great Western) could bring in to strengthen DMUs^▸ (Diesel Multiple Unit) in the Bristol area.

Ok, they may not be perfect. But seats.......

I have only listed DMU's. Feel free to post a list of other coaches etc in storage.

Moving on :

FGW have 12 more units than the franchise spec

the unit shortage is only because of the franchise spec for less unit's (we've actually got 17 more units than whats in the franchise spec).

Another way of looking at it would be this :

WEST FLEET UNDER WESSEX :

Class 143 - 8 units, 832 seats.
Class 150 - 25 units, 3475 seats.
Class 153 - 15 units, 1125 seats.
Class 158 (2 - coach) - 12 units, 1680 seats.
Class 158 (3 - coach) - 9 units, 1971 seats.

TOTAL UNITS - 69
TOTAL CARRIAGES - 132
TOTAL SEATS - 9083

WEST FLEET - FRANCHISE AGREEMENT BETWEEN FGW AND DFT^▸ (Department for Transport) :

Class 143 - 8 units, 832 seats.
Class 150 - 17 units, 2363 seats.
Class 153 - 10 units, 750 seats.
Class 158 (2 - coach) - 22 units, 3080 seats.
Class 158 (3 - coach) - 1 unit, 219 seats.

TOTAL UNITS - 58
TOTAL CARRIAGES - 107
TOTAL SEATS - 7244

CURRENT WEST FLEET

Class 142 - 12 units, 1452 seats.
Class 143 - 8 units, 832 seats.
Class 150 - 19 units, 2639 seats.
Class 153 - 12 units, 900 seats.
Class 158 (2 - coach) - 20 units, 2800 seats.
Class 158 (3 - coach) - 1 unit, 219 seats.

TOTAL UNITS - 72
TOTAL CARRIAGES - 133
TOTAL SEATS - 8842

CAVEATS :

1)   Class 142 units are assumed to have 121 seats per unit (source - Angel Trains.) I am told that some may have less.

2)   Class 150/1 units are assumed to have 138 seats per unit (source - Angel Trains.) I am told that some have 124 seats per unit.

CONCLUSION :

1) FGW have 14 more units, 26 more carriages, and 1598 more seats in the West Fleet than was set down in the Franchise Agreement.

2) FGW have 3 more units, 1 more carriage, and 241 less seats (best case scenario) in the West fleet than Wessex had.

3) Wessex aimed for around 84% fleet availability, whereas FGW appear to be aiming for around 76%

They havnt done anything wrong according to the legally binding contract they have with the DfT^» (Department for Transport - about).

FGW are in breach of the following sections of the Greater Western Franchise Agreement :

Appendix 11, Part 1, Sections 4.1, 5.12 and 5.14

[Shazz]

They havnt done anything wrong according to the legally binding contract they have with the DfT^» (Department for Transport - about).

FGW^▸ (First Great Western) are in breach of the following sections of the Greater Western Franchise Agreement :

Appendix 11, Part 1, Sections 4.1, 5.12 and 5.14

Don't suppose you have a copy/ theres one online for the franchise agreement?

[Lee]

Don't suppose you have a copy/ theres one online for the franchise agreement?

It can be found in the link below.
http://www.saveseverntunnel.co.uk/First%20Greater%20Western%20Franchise%20Agreement.pdf

[Btline]

No. I meant, for example, to replace a 2 car 150 with a 3 loco hauled Mk2^▸ (Mark 2 coach) carriages.

Then use the 150 to: either provide another service (eg TranWilts shuttle)


     or to add it to another 150 to create a 4 car 150.

Result- more seats.

Again, this is not perfect.

Does anybody know if there are some spares lying around?

[Btline]

I would like to apologise for my rather harsh words earlier on this thread concerning staff. 

I was having a rant, and admit that I generalised too much.

Of course, FGW^▸ (First Great Western) staff have to put up with a lot of stick, and it IS primarily down to management that there are shortages.

I have experienced a lot of very good staff, and I praise the drivers.

Once again, I am sorry for my comments, and will try to control my rant next time.

Merry Christmas 

[devon_metro]

3 Mk2s^▸ (Mark 2 coach) would be a waste. If fGW were to utilise locos and stock, which are very expensive, then they would be on the busiest routes as otherwise it is not fianancially viable.

I can see 67+6mk2s+67 being used well on Cardiff - Bristol - Weston Sm/Westbury

Thanks for posting those figures Lee, an interesting read. Of note - those 142 figures are based on the 3+2 style seating, of which are not used so overall seating capacity is around 100 per unit.

[Lee]

Thanks for posting those figures Lee, an interesting read. Of note - those 142 figures are based on the 3+2 style seating, of which are not used so overall seating capacity is around 100 per unit.

Thanks Liam. As my post suggested, I was wondering about that.

[Timmer]

I would like to apologise for my rather harsh words earlier on this thread concerning staff. 

I was having a rant, and admit that I generalised too much.

Of course, FGW^▸ (First Great Western) staff have to put up with a lot of stick, and it IS primarily down to management that there are shortages.

I have experienced a lot of very good staff, and I praise the drivers.

Once again, I am sorry for my comments, and will try to control my rant next time.

Merry Christmas 

Well done for apologising and I'm sure all the FGW traincrew who post here and visit the coffee shop will appreciate it.

As you can see by the many posts that appear on this site that have been posted by FGW staff, they are about as fed up as the rest of us on how things are at the moment. This is the right place to have a rant but we always have to remember the human element involved and its the set up of this franchise thats at fault. Yes there are those organisations who have to take responsibility and we all know who they are 

[Shazz]

Do MK2's have SDO^▸ (Selective Door Opening) on them? cant remember.

they would be ideal for expansion for pompey > cardiff, but unfortunatly i cant see it happening. Which is a shame.