Who to write to (in First Great Western) regarding IEP?

[whole diary]

[Rhydgaled]

I am looking to write to FirstGW about the IEP^▸ (Intercity Express Program / Project.), since they are supposed to be providing feedback to DfT^» (Department for Transport - about) and Hitachi on the design of the new trains it would be interesting to see what they think of the proposed reduction from 8-coach trains (IC125s) to 5-car IEP units. In particular, I'd like to know whether they have set up a ^Train User Review Group^ as I think was required in the canceled franchise sepecfication, and exactly what one of those is anyhow.

Who should I write to at FirstGW?

[IndustryInsider]

...or you could ask them what they think of the proposed extension from 8-coach 23m diesel trains to 9-coach 26m electric trains or 10-coach 26m coupled bi-mode sets?  Both of which I think will be a far more common sight on most routes and services than 5-car bi-mode ones.

[Network SouthEast]

I suspect standard class passengers will also appreciate the fact that IEP^▸ (Intercity Express Program / Project.) sets will have eight table bays per carriage in standard class. 

You can read more about the spec from the DfT^» (Department for Transport - about) - https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/82840/tts-redacted.pdf Pages 76 and 77 have a bit more detail.

[Andrew1939 from West Oxon]

According to Roger Ford's article in the April edition of Modern Railways, the Greater Western IEP^▸ (Intercity Express Program / Project.) fleet specification has been changed since last Autumn because of the decision to extend South Wales electrification to Swansea. According to RM there will now be 8 x 8-car bi-mode IEOs in the GW^▸ (Great Western) fleet. This wwill certainly resolve some of the Cotswold Line worries as under the previous fleet proposals there would have only been 5-car IEPs in the fleet totally unsuited for peak hour Cotswold Line peak hour services currently run with often full to capacity with 8-car HSTs^▸ (High Speed Train).

[swrural]

Grr!  I haven't got my copy delivered yet.  Could we have an embargo on MR^▸ (Midland Railway) articles until Friday please?   

[ellendune]

Mine came in the post today.

[paul7575]

I suspect standard class passengers will also appreciate the fact that IEP^▸ (Intercity Express Program / Project.) sets will have eight table bays per carriage in standard class. 

The intercity variant had a 50/50 ratio of bays to airline seating in standard class in the 2008 version of the technical spec.   It has often seemed to me since reading that document that quite a few people have pre-emptively made their minds up that the train won't meet the spec before they've even seen one...

Paul

[eightf48544]

The IEP^▸ (Intercity Express Program / Project.) may meet the spec but Roger Ford has pretty comprehensively proved, over time, that it's the wrong spec.

[paul7575]

The IEP^▸ (Intercity Express Program / Project.) may meet the spec but Roger Ford has pretty comprehensively proved, over time, that it's the wrong spec.

I was only referring to the seating and internal layout in the above context...

Paul

[Network SouthEast]

According to Roger Ford's article in the April edition of Modern Railways, the Greater Western IEP^▸ (Intercity Express Program / Project.) fleet specification has been changed since last Autumn because of the decision to extend South Wales electrification to Swansea. According to RM there will now be 8 x 8-car bi-mode IEOs in the GW^▸ (Great Western) fleet. This wwill certainly resolve some of the Cotswold Line worries as under the previous fleet proposals there would have only been 5-car IEPs in the fleet totally unsuited for peak hour Cotswold Line peak hour services currently run with often full to capacity with 8-car HSTs^▸ (High Speed Train).

Andrew I have read the same article and it definitely says that GW will be receiving 5 car Bi-Mode IEPs and 9 car electric IEPs.

In fact, the document I refer to in an earlier post is exactly the same one that Roger Ford references in his modern rail article.

If you read the article carefully, you'll note that he says at the bottom of page 26 the following in the IEP delivery table (my bold)....

Not corrected to reflect change of fleet composition following Swansea electrification decision. Now 5-car Bi-mode and 9-car electric units only.

[swrural]

I've got my MR^▸ (Midland Railway) copy now so you are all not annoying me any more.   

I haven't read RF and his numerous tables properly (yet) but I do not understand why bimodes have to be 5 car and electrics 9 car.  Why can't they all be 5 car or the electrics 10 car (5 times 2)?  Surely that is more flexible?

Is it that a detached 5 car bimode can run on from a big place to a small place, that isn't electrified (yet!)?  However could not late-night all electrics be 5 car and early morning back 5 car?   

[Rhydgaled]

...or you could ask them what they think of the proposed extension from 8-coach 23m diesel trains to 9-coach 26m electric trains or 10-coach 26m coupled bi-mode sets?  Both of which I think will be a far more common sight on most routes and services than 5-car bi-mode ones.

As far as I can tell, your assertion is incorrect. I am going from the September 2012 Modern Railways Informed Sources, where (under the heading: 'IEP^▸ (Intercity Express Program / Project.) - signed and sealed') the planned IEP fleet makeup was published, as follows:

• 5-car bi-mode - 32 diagrams, 36 sets
• 9-car 'electric' - 18 diagrams, 21 sets
• Total 50 -  50 diagrams, 57 sets

I threw together some timetables in Excel and came up with the following rough estimates for numbers of diagrams:
Under-Wires-Service Diagrams

• Oxford - Paddington (hourly) - 3 diagrams
• Cardiff - Paddington (hourly) - 5 diagrams
• Swansea - Paddington (hourly) - 6 diagrams
• Bristol - Paddington via Bath (half-hourly) - 7 diagrams
• Bristol - Paddington via Bristol Parkway (hourly) - 4 diagrams
• Total: 25 diagrams (note this means the above DfT^» (Department for Transport - about) order is 7 'electric' units short)

Beyond-Wires-Service Diagrams

• Weston Super Mare - Paddington via Brsitol Parkway (hourly) - 5 diagrams
• Cheltenham Spa - Paddington (hourly) - 5 diagrams
• Westbury - Paddington (hourly) - 4 diagrams
• Worcester - Paddington (hourly) - 5 diagrams (but some extend to Hereford, so 7 diagrams)
• Total: 21 diagrams (11 fewer than DfT have supposedly ordered, but apart from the Herefords no extensions beyond the regular service are included, since I think Carmarthens, Paigntons and Exeters might as well remain IC125 worked since other services on those routes will be.)

Grand total 46 diagrams versus DfT's 50. Assuming DfT's intentions to send IEPs to Carmarthen, Paignton and Exeter add two or three bi-mode diagrams, there's only one or two 5-car bi-mode diagrams left over to make up 10-car formations, and remember they are 7 9-car diagrams short of being able to run all the wholely under wires services with 9-car units. This probably means ALL IEP services that extend beyond the wires being 5-car throughout, with some under-wires diagrams also being 5-car bi-modes working alone.

According to Roger Ford's article in the April edition of Modern Railways, the Greater Western IEP fleet specification has been changed since last Autumn because of the decision to extend South Wales electrification to Swansea. According to RM there will now be 8 x 8-car bi-mode IEOs in the GW^▸ (Great Western) fleet. This wwill certainly resolve some of the Cotswold Line worries as under the previous fleet proposals there would have only been 5-car IEPs in the fleet totally unsuited for peak hour Cotswold Line peak hour services currently run with often full to capacity with 8-car HSTs^▸ (High Speed Train).

If the fleet has changed to include some longer bi-modes, that'd be helpful.

I would personally say around 11 bi-mode IEP diagrams are needed, each at least 7-cars, for Westburys and Worcesters/Herefords. My opinion is the Cheltenhams and Westons should remain IC125 worked for a few years until wires can be extended to cover them, when the class 43s would be replaced with electric locos and new DVTs^‡(resolve) added on the other end.

Anyway, back to topic, who do I write to?

[Electric train]

The "under the wires" to Oxford assumption you make is the fasts will be IEP^▸ (Intercity Express Program / Project.) units, elsewhere on the electrified network such journeys are done with EMU^▸ (Electric Multiple Unit)'s

[JayMac]

Anyway, back to topic, who do I write to?

Roger Ford?

That's not meant to be facetious. But if his information is correct, rather than journalistic supposition, then he must have lines to Hitachi, DfT^» (Department for Transport - about), the TOCs^▸ (Train Operating Company) involved et al. I suspect though, if he has genuine sources who have given him the heads up on the composition, technical specifications, internal layout and diagrams, he won't be giving up those sources.

It's equally possible he doesn't have any more information than in is the public domain or his sources are only giving the limited current picture. Things can and do change. 

[Network SouthEast]

Once again, please read the document I linked to above. It is the very same document that Roger Ford is commenting about in his recent article.