A Weird Ticket Split - Is it Valid?

[whole diary]

[thetrout]

Tomorrow I plan to do the ATW^▸ (Arriva Trains Wales (former TOC^▸ (Train Operating Company))) Premier Service from Newport (Gwent) - Wrexham General (Don't Ask!)

The ticket I am going to buy is Frome - Shrewsbury First Anytime Single and Shrewsbury - Wrexham First Anytime Day Single

If I decide I want to use the FOS ticket to Newport where it is valid via Hereford for Shrewsbury (AFAIK^▸ (as far as I know)).

Can I buy a FSR^▸ (First Scot Rail) from NWP - Cardiff Central and use the FRO^» (Frome - next trains) to SHR^» (Shrewsbury - next trains) First Anytime Single as far as Newport. Break the journey there and then use a new FSR ticket from NWP to CDF^» (Cardiff - next trains).

Now the further problem is. Could I board the 18:21 service from Cardiff (My Wrexham Train) and use the return portion of the FSR and then present the rest of the FOS to continue on the same train to Shrewsbury?

So Basically I'd be presenting the TM^‡(resolve) with:

• Return Portion First Off Peak Return: Cardiff - Newport
• Partially Used First Anytime Single: Frome - Shrewsbury
• First Anytime Day Single: Shrewsbury - Wrexham

Do you think they'll get a little upset at the NWP - CDF trick? I don't really see it as a trick to be honest, as the original FOS isn't valid for double backing via CDF AFAIK. Or can anyone suggest a better solution?

Thanks

TT

amended train time. Actual train was 18:21 NOT 17:21 - thetrout

[JayMac]

Sorry TT but I can't really make head nor tail of that!

If you haven't already bought tickets then can I suggest getting Standard Class ones only. Reason being you'll not have much in the way of 1st Class accommodation between Frome and South Wales unless you plan to go via Bristol Parkway or the short hop on a HST^▸ (High Speed Train) from Bath to Temple Meads.

Then, at either Newport or Cardiff you can buy the 1st Class upgrade for the WAG^» (Welsh Assembly Government - about) Express to Wrexham (The 1821 off Cardiff. Is that the service you plan to catch, rather than the 1721?) You might even be able to buy this from the Frome ticket office if its open when you set off!

With railcard the upgrade will be ^24.75. Same price from either Newport or Cardiff. A bargain as you not only get 1st class but a slap up dinner as well.

The upgrade fare is called: PCU  ATW^▸ (Arriva Trains Wales (former TOC^▸ (Train Operating Company))) PREM UPGRDE and is routed: 00044  ARRIVA TRN WALES

http://brfares.com/#faredetail?orig=CDF^» (Cardiff - next trains)&dest=WRX&rlc=DIS&rte=44&ldn=0&tkt=PCU


As to the tickets you wish to use. As long as together they cover the entire journey you are making and the trains you wish to use call at the split points than I see no problem. If you are using a 'return' portion having not used the 'out' that is also fine, as long as you retain the 'out' and don't subsequently try to use it after using the 'return'.

[inspector_blakey]

Assuming I've understood you correctly, that should be no issue at all assuming the train in question calls at Newport and Shrewsbury. You've effectively broken your Frome - Wrexham journey at Newport, then gone to Cardiff and back before resuming.

However, have you checked the standard class fares for the journey in question? ATW^▸ (Arriva Trains Wales (former TOC^▸ (Train Operating Company))) offer a "flat" first class supplement, and given that you won't find much in the way of FC^‡(resolve) between Frome and Newport (or between Shrewsbury and Wrexham...?). It's a ^32.50 supplement between Cardiff and Shrewsbury, which can be paid on-board, if that works out cheaper for you and you can cope with the odd short hop like NWP-CDF^» (Cardiff - next trains) in standard.

[thetrout]

Sorry Gents...

Basically you are both on the money... I have a bouncing headache so please excuse me.

Assuming I've understood you correctly, that should be no issue at all assuming the train in question calls at Newport and Shrewsbury. You've effectively broken your Frome - Wrexham journey at Newport, then gone to Cardiff and back before resuming.

That is exactly what I wanted to do - The WAG^» (Welsh Assembly Government - about) Express does call at both NWP and SHR^» (Shrewsbury - next trains) as well as WRX

Then, at either Newport or Cardiff you can buy the 1st Class upgrade for the WAG Express to Wrexham. You might even be able to buy this from the Frome ticket office if its open when you set off!

With railcard the upgrade will be ^24.75. Same price from either Newport or Cardiff. A bargain as you not only get 1st class but a slap up dinner as well.

The upgrade fare is called: PCU  ATW^▸ (Arriva Trains Wales (former TOC^▸ (Train Operating Company))) PREM UPGRDE and is routed: 00044  ARRIVA TRN WALES

Thanks for that. The reason I was going to buy the FRO^» (Frome - next trains) - SHR FOS was because I couldn't find the prices for the supplements anywhere. However the FOS between FRO and SHR is ^57.60

The ATW website said the upgrade was between ^30 and ^50 but offered no definitive price. The insult to injury which I actually found rather offensive as silly as that sounds was when I went into their website the message starring my in the face

"Avoid a Fine or Prosecution" and the usual info about Penalty Fares and buying the appropriate ticket.

Except they didn't even list the correct price. BNM has helpfully provided me the price which in actuality with my railcard is cheaper than the ^30 lower option

As I was already going to have the FRO - SHR and the possibility of spending the afternoon in Cardiff. I was going to buy an FSR^▸ (First Scot Rail) from Newport - Cardiff so I could board the WAG straight away in First at CDF^» (Cardiff - next trains).

Does that make better sense? sorry

[JayMac]

Sorry Gents...

Basically you are both on the money... I have a bouncing headache so please excuse me.

I've now got a bit of headache as well, trying to work out the best fares for your needs. 

[thetrout]

I've just looked at the prices again to look at your suggestions and I've discovered something I'm rather annoyed about.

With railcard the upgrade will be ^24.75. Same price from either Newport or Cardiff. A bargain as you not only get 1st class but a slap up dinner as well.

What about if I explained (badly ) the following:

SDS NWP - WRX = ^32.60 (Inc Railcard Discount)
Prem Upgrade you suggested = ^24.75

Total: ^57.35

FOS NWP - WRX = ^50.10

So the supplement works out more expensive from NWP? It does for Cardiff as well: Where the FOS is ^54.65 and the upgrade + an SDS = ^61.00

(The 1821 off Cardiff. Is that the service you plan to catch, rather than the 1721?)

That's the badger... I'd amend that now. Thanks for spotting that

[thetrout]

I've now got a bit of headache as well, trying to work out the best fares for your needs. 

Thats how I gave myself the headache lol... That and dealing with TalkTalk on the phone. But that gives even the most healthy and calm natured person a headache!

[JayMac]

A knotty problem, not helped by my slightly inebriated state.

Leaving aside the trip between Newport and Cardiff, it does appear that the savings are marginal between 1st Class all the way and Standard with the upgrade:

Frome - Shrewsbury 1st Anytime Day Single (FDS) ^57.60
Shrewsbury - Wrexham FDS ^7.40
Total: ^65.00

Buying the Standard Class fares and then the upgrade:

Frome - Shrewsbury Anytime Day Single (SDS) ^34.60
Shrewsbury - Wrexham General SDS ^5.15
WAG^» (Welsh Assembly Government - about) Express Upgrade Newport/Cardiff - Wrexham General ^24.75
Total: ^64.50

[thetrout]

Agreed. As I forgot to add in the split price between SHR^» (Shrewsbury - next trains) and WRX I have come up with the following:


NWP - SHR

SDS: NWP - SHR ^23.75
PREM 1st Supplement: ^21.45

Total STD Class Ticket + Upgrade: ^45.20
FDS: NWP - SHR: ^43.50


CDF^» (Cardiff - next trains) - SHR

SDS: CDF - SHR ^26.35
PREM 1st Supplement: ^21.45

Total STD Class Ticket + Upgrade: ^47.80
FDS: CDF - SHR is the same at: ^43.50


Based on an Off Peak Single Frome - Wrexham via Hereford at ^44.20 + Newport - Wrexham Premier Supplement at 24.75 you're still looking at ^68.95

However according to brfares.com Here and in detail (Frome - next trains)&dest=WRX&rlc=DIS&rte=200&ldn=1&tkt=SVH" target="_blank">Here There is a ^32.25 Fare from Frome - Wrexham Off Peak Single set by Virgin West Coast which even allows via London Travel. Looking at that fare we're talking:

FRO - WRX ^32.25
NWP - WRX Premier Supplement: ^24.75

Total: ^57.00 which is cheaper than all the other options here so far.

But FGW^▸ (First Great Western) WebTIS is not showing that ^32.25 fare. I'll check the Ticket Machine at FRO when I get there tomorrow AM at 00:19