Is a dictatorship or a democracy better for improving public transport?

[whole diary]

[ellendune]

I have said elsewhere within this noble coffee shop that there is a reason why the former dictatorships in Europe enjoy more comprehensive public transport than here. We should really enjoy our democracy and the power it gives to the common man to object to things we don't like, without risking being taken out and shot.

I didn't think France had been a dictatorship very recently.

There are many examples of Infrastructure work in post-war Germany. I think the reason they have not had the same problems is a sense of the of public good over the wishes of the  individual.

Netherlands also has good public transport infrastructure without the problems. 

Are we too much a nation of individualists rather than a community?

[chuffed]

Hear hear! Always enjoy reading your view of events. A man after my own heart !

[TonyK]

I didn't think France had been a dictatorship very recently.

I forget that Napoleon predated the railways...

[eightf48544]

Noy sure about France being adictatorship but they seem able to build LGVs^▸ (Large Goods Vehicle in the UK^▸ (United Kingdom), or Lignes à Grande Vitesse (high speed rail lines) in France, depending on context) almost where they want. Look at the fuss the residents  of Amiens made when they were BYPASSED by LGV Nord.

Can you imagine any town in the UK clamouring to be on HS2^▸ (The next High Speed line(s))?

[swrural]

Noy sure about France being adictatorship but they seem able to build LGVs^▸ (Large Goods Vehicle in the UK^▸ (United Kingdom), or Lignes à Grande Vitesse (high speed rail lines) in France, depending on context) almost where they want. Look at the fuss the residents  of Amiens made when they were BYPASSED by LGV Nord.

Can you imagine any town in the UK clamouring to be on HS2^▸ (The next High Speed line(s))?

I thought Birmingham was.

[TonyK]

The mention of Amiens reminded me of something I learned whilst on that very same French holiday, whilst also reminding me that although Napol^on Bonaparte did indeed rule before railways were invented, he was not the only Emperor of France.

My acquaintance began his journey at Morlaix station, which has a line to Paris. Morlaix is completely dominated by a magnificent viaduct, built in the early 1860s. The railway was originally planned to pass a few miles to the south of the town, where the lie of the land meant that the line could head for the Atlantic coast without such a structure. But the worthies of Morlaix petitioned for it to cross through the town, despite the cost of the viaduct. This request was granted, much to the chagrin of other towns, now deprived of this vital artery. It's not what you know in historic French railway building, it's who you know, and what you can pay him. The ruler who granted the request was Emperor Napoleon III, who overthrew his own presidency by way of a coup d'^tat (or whatever the French call it), giving him 19 years in charge as Emperor. Although on the liberal wing of the roll of totalitarian despots, he nonetheless shipped political opponents to penal colonies such as Devils Island, manipulated elections, censored the press, and marginalised Parliament. So my view that good public transport needs a strong dictator is in part vindicated.

I shall read up on Dutch history, and also see if Louis-Napol^on Bonaparte has any descendants in Oxfordshire and environs who might want a job. Contemporary French high speed railway construction is helped by the amount of free space in the country compared to the UK^▸ (United Kingdom). It has more than twice the area of the UK, with roughly the same population, but with a much higher concentration in metropolitan areas. A high speed line thus attracts less opposition than would its British counterpart.

[JayMac]

a coup d'^tat (or whatever the French call it)

*like*

Reminded me of a Minder episode when Arthur and his second sidekick, nephew Ray Daley, were stuck in France and looking for a place to stay overnight. Arthur asked Ray; "What's French for 'en suite'? 

[swrural]

Street View gives a magnificent view of it, thanks BNM. (Google Earth / Maps Morlais Brittany)

[paul7575]

Noy sure about France being adictatorship but they seem able to build LGVs^▸ (Large Goods Vehicle in the UK^▸ (United Kingdom), or Lignes à Grande Vitesse (high speed rail lines) in France, depending on context) almost where they want. Look at the fuss the residents  of Amiens made when they were BYPASSED by LGV Nord.

Can you imagine any town in the UK clamouring to be on HS2^▸ (The next High Speed line(s))?

I thought Birmingham was.

In the Sheffield area, I believe the local politicians are agitating about the rumoured decision to have an HS2 station at Meadowhall rather than in the city centre...

Paul 

[eightf48544]

Back to the original topic (boring). Just got Febs Today's Railways Europe there's an article about eeh dual gauge train ferrry terminals at Sassnitz on Rugen. 1457 and 1520 (Russian gague). It was built in DDR days on vacant land. The comment goes on that it was a nature reserve but there weren't many protests. I wonder why!

Apparently the 1520 was to allow the Red Army to bring troops and equipment in rail wagons to be transfered to standard gauge wagons. It recent use has been to evacuate the Red Army on re-unification and to deliver Stadler EMUS. These apparently arrive by sea and are transferred coach by coach by road to the 1520 yard made up into a train and then put on the train ferry