BR CHARGEMAN - Meaning and origins

[whole diary]

[vacmanfan]

Does anybody happen to know where this title comes from and what exactly a chargeman did?  Seen a few people on the network still using this outdated name.

Thanks

[stationstop]

Person in charge of platforms.. This is the only context I've seen it used.

[paul7575]

Chargehand (of a gang of workmen) is still fairly common isn't it?  Doesn't the NHS still use Charge Nurse for a male 'sister'?

I think it was/is traditionally a way of denoting the senior man in a team of otherwise equals where the basic requirement was for age and experience, but not necessarily extra qualifications or skills.

It's not that different to 'foreman', is it?

Paul

[eightf48544]

BR^▸ (British Rail(ways)) was very military in it's structure.

Would suggest that a Chargehand would be a Corporal, whilst a Foreman would be Sergeant, whilst an Inspector would be a warrent officer or Junior Leiutenant.

The other way of distinguishing grades was weekly or monthly pay or wages and salaried staff.

Chargehands would probably be weekly paid.

BR may have been considered ovrmanned but like the Army it was the NCOs who ran the show.

The modern railway could probably do with more NCOs as the recent disruptions have shown.

[vacmanfan]

All definitions I've found relate to either - 1. Somebody who would detonate explosives or 2. Somebody who undertakes manual or industrial labour.  Nothing to do with rank.

Would the "Chargeman" been in possession of anything related to explosives, such as detonators?? (I guess probably not)

Does it relate to the charging of anything?  (Not in a fiscal sense)

[paul7575]

The point of your definition 2 is that a person can still be undertaking exactly the same work as the person or persons he is in charge of. Him being in charge is an extra duty or responsibility, but think of it as being a position rather than a significantly higher rank or grade.

I've looked at a few of the online definitions and I think the explosives link is rather exaggerated.

Paul

[inspector_blakey]

My impression is that the chargeman was effectively a station supervisor - "in charge" of a group of station staff.

Not sure if the sign is still there but there certainly was still a door marked "Chargeman" at Cardiff Central a few years ago, and it looked like this was relatively recent.

[broadgage]

Chargeman or chargehand is a term in very general use in some industries and is generaly understood to be a person in charge of a small team of workers, but also taking part in the the work themselves, unlike a foreman who might direct others, but not take much direct part in the work themselves.

A chargeman would normally wear the same type of uniform or overalls as those in their charge, whereas a foreman would normally be differently dressed, for example by wearing a white overall when others wore dark blue, or by wearing a tie when those under the foremans control did not.
In years gone by, foremen in railway workshops and similar places used to wear bowler hats, this would not be normal attire for a mere chargehand.

[Electric train]

I was a workshops grade chargehand at one time, so from expirence.

As eightf48544 said the railways had a military style hierarchy; in BR^▸ (British Rail(ways)) days the workshop grades started at RS1 to RS4 (Rail Shopman )

RS1 an unskilled labourer
RS2 Trades man assistant (Mate)
RS3 Semi Skilled trade (break fitters, CW^▸ (Christian Wolmar (rail journalist)) lighting etc)
RS4 skilled trade (fitters, electricians etc)  

Then there were the WS A to E (Work shop supervisors A to E)
A lowest grade
to
E - I was a WSE and supervised a workshop of 30 from RS1 to WSD  
In reality the WS A and B were difficult to fill because an RS4 with bonus would take a pay cut to the grade of charge hand was used to supervise smaller gangs or teams, charge hands were paid an uplift on their wages and in our workshop they did not have to clock in and out.

It was diffcult for me to move from WSE to Management Grade (MS 1 to 5) on monitory terms top scale MS2 or mid 3 was the closest.

The above structure was similar for Railmen just the name of the role was different, they certainly had charge hands that supervised a small gang with a supervisor having a couple of gangs on his shift