What are your chances of getting the cheapest tickets

[whole diary]

[basset44]

Hi All,

Couple of weeks ago I asked about travelling from Cardiff to Bournemouth either via Reading or Swindon, and thanks to Bignosemac who explained that the National Rail site was showing the wrong fare and apart from advances the cheapest off peak return was ^50.

At about the same time I think once again Bignosemac put a link on this site about a new rover ticket from Swindon.

Anycase looked at that site and found the Freedom of Severn & Solent 3in7 and I thought if I settled for Swindon but not going through Reading this would be great plus .

So I decieded to wait and buy this on Friday I went online and checked the National Rail timetable and low and behold it shows this fare of ^42 for FSS ticket and stating it could only be brought a couple of days in advance.

So today I went to Cardiff Central and thought I do a little customer test at the ticket office

I asked for the cheapest ticket from Cardiff to Bournemouth travelling late morning on Monday and coming back either

Friday or Saturday. I was asked via Salisbury ( Has if I suppose to know what that means) so I said yes and was told
^50. I said is that the cheapest and was told yes. I then asked about the Freedom of Severn rover and it took the ticket salesperson a little while and she said oh yes that would be okay provided I left after 9.30, I said I did tell you late morning. I was then sold the FSS ticket for ^42. I was told it was valued for 3 days travel on the trains and 7 days on the Bus? This confused me cause I cant find any info on what Buses does anybody know?

Why did that option not come up? Or is it me being cynical and thinking they were trying to get the most money?

Now I have this ticket and dont mind a bit of traveilling was thinking of going via Taunton and Castle Cray down has I not in any hurry to get to Bournemouth what is anybodies advice

Thanks

Basset

[Southern Stag]

It won't come up when the ticket office staff enter Cardiff to Bournemouth because rover tickets have to be issued in a different way, it relies on the member of staff knowing about rover tickets to know whether it would be the cheapest option or not. The bus thing would be the ticket office staff getting confused with the Wales rovers, which allow 4 days rail travel and 8 days bus travel within the defined area. The Freedom of Severn and Solent rover doesn't include any bus travel.

[Btline]

Barely any FGW^▸ (First Great Western) staff know about this ticket. I travelled from Worcester to Weston, the ticket office at WOS^» (Worcester Shrub Hill - next trains) had no idea what it was (ok LM^▸ (London Midland - recent franchise), but still in the route of the ticket, so the staff should know), and neither did the THREE FGW guards I had en-route. I showed them the print out from the NR^» (Network Rail - home page)+FGW website and they all spent ages looking through their machines. The Weston ticket office did manage to sell me one, but it took a while.

The ticket can be bought on the day of travel, no need to buy in advance, I think you've been misled there.

During my week of travels, ALL other guards and gateline staff looked completely stunned by the ticket and "had never seen one of those before". Not a singe one knew what "FOSS^▸ (Freedom of Severn & Solent Rover)" was. I had no troubles though.

My advice to you is to get the code for the ticket from the NR website and tell that to the guard on the train. They will then be able to find the ticket.

[JayMac]

You are correct bassett44. The cheapest ticket for your needs, after explaining the journeys you planned to make, was indeed the 3 in 7 Freedom of Severn and Solent Rover (FOSS^▸ (Freedom of Severn & Solent Rover)). That is, if the clerk had abided by impartial retailing rules, what you should have been sold.

It is no surprise however that the FOSS rover ticket was not offered by the ticket clerk you encountered. Despite the promises made by ATOC^» (Association of Train Operating Companies See - here)'s Ticketing and Settlement Agreement that the cheapest ticket to suit the customer's needs should be sold, this is at the mercy of how well trained the ticket clerk is, and how well set up that clerk's Ticket Issuing System is. The system is mostly at fault although some blame also needs to laid at the feet of those responsible for training ticket clerks. Most clerks will only learn of these things through trial and error or by encountering a customer who is already armed with the knowledge of what they need.

As an aside. Don't be fooled though, even armed with some knowledge you can still encounter staff who will refuse to sell you the ticket or fail to give the correct advice because their computer says "no". I asked at a ticket office the other day what the the Off Peak Day Return validity was from Chippenham to Oxford (not via Reading). I was told "after 0930." I queried this and the clerk was adamant, "All Cheap Day Returns (sic) are after 0930." Taking the advice would've meant my arrival into Oxford at 1114 would actually have been over 30 minutes later than allowed. When I asked if she could check the actual restriction code text, the response I got was that her computer's journey planner always gives the right answer! Well it didn't. The correct answer is that an Off Peak Day Return from Chippenham to Oxford is valid from 0915 meaning I should be able to catch the 0925 and, after changes, arrive in Oxford at 1041.

Back to the OP^▸ (Original Poster / topic starter). Another fault in the system is that National Rail Enquiries (NRES^▸ (National Rail Enquiry Service)) will offer the fare for the 3 in 7 FOSS when making an online enquiry, but when you click through to a retailer the option to buy the rover disappears and only point-to-point tickets are available.

I've just tried to replicate bassett44's journey on NRES. Cardiff to Bournemouth out on Monday after 0930, return on Saturday. NRES correctly offers the FOSS rover as the cheapest walk-up fare and suggested to me London Overground as a retailer! I refreshed the page and it suggested First Hull Trains!!. A further refresh and I'm directed to First ScotRail!!! Needless to say, none of those retailers can sell a FOSS rover. Bonkers.

So the answer appears to be..... if you want accurate impartial advice and the chance to buy the cheapest ticket for your needs then don't rely on the industry to provide it to you.

[JayMac]

To add....

bassett44. If you want to travel via Taunton and Castle Cary on your trip between Cardiff and Bournemouth then that is perfectly acceptable with a 3 in 7 FOSS^▸ (Freedom of Severn & Solent Rover) rover. You can go all the way to Weymouth if you so desire!

With the FOSS rover you have unlimited travel after 0900 across the area of validity for any journey(s) you wish to take on each of the 3 days you make use of the ticket.

The area of validity is as shown on this schematic map:

[JayMac]

Barely any FGW^▸ (First Great Western) staff know about this ticket.

In the interests of fairness, the OP^▸ (Original Poster / topic starter) was attempting to purchase the FOSS^▸ (Freedom of Severn & Solent Rover) rover at Cardiff Central, a station managed by Arriva Trains Wales. So no fault in this instance should be laid at FGW's door.

My earlier comments about the system as a whole being somewhat at fault hold true though.

[eightf48544]

Wow what a fantastic value ticket just wish I lived in the area.

hinking about i might be able to use one as I'm possibly going to Gloucester and back to Bristol, The infill will be a narrow boat. As the  boat trip is weather dependant 3 journies in 7 days would give me the flexibilty i need.

I could presumably get a Taplow Swindon odd peak (split at Didcot?) for the infill, although last time I did it I got incredibly cheap 1st Advanced

Being cynical I wonder if TOCS don't want to sell it as it's too good value.

[Southern Stag]

FGW^▸ (First Great Western) are one of the better TOCs^▸ (Train Operating Company) for promoting Rover tickets. They have just produced a new Rover leaflet which is rather good and should be available at staffed stations, it's a shame they removed the Rover information from their website when it was redone. Taplow-Swindon tickets would be fine, if you split at Didcot and use the rover, as well as the Taplow-Didcot and Didcot-Swindon tickets on the same train the train doesn't even need to call at Didcot.

[Btline]

I would agree that FGW^▸ (First Great Western) are good at promoting rover tickets. However it is clear that staff are not told about them.

To be fair I had the same experience with the Kent Rover with SET^▸ (Super Express Train (now IET))/SN. Everyone was bewildered by the ticket. I'm sure it's the same across the UK^▸ (United Kingdom).

In Scotland, they are well known. In Wales, the ATW^▸ (Arriva Trains Wales (former TOC^▸ (Train Operating Company))) guard didn't know that a Rover was cheaper than a return along the HoW^‡(resolve) line (neither did I, a fellow commuter pointed this out - it still took the guard ages to find the ticket on the machine).

All ticket office staff should know about all Rovers from that station (and perhaps any neighbouring ones plus major touristy ones). All guards should know about all relevant Rovers on their routes. Sorry if it seems that I'm ranting at staff. I do appreciate how complex the system is, but in any other profession would not this lack of knowledge be unacceptable?

[Milky Bar Kid]

Btline, staff are told and are regularly kept up to date with rover ticketing for your concern.

[6 OF 2 redundant adjunct of unimatrix 01]

They can also work well as a part time off peak season ticket where one is not available

[Btline]

Btline, staff are told and are regularly kept up to date with rover ticketing for your concern.

If that's true why did 3 guards not know what a FOSS^▸ (Freedom of Severn & Solent Rover) was?

[Milky Bar Kid]

Depends on where these guards cover etc, you cant expect everyone to have all the knowledge surely?

[JayMac]

Depends on where these guards cover etc, you cant expect everyone to have all the knowledge surely?

But you did just say that staff are kept up to date with rover ticketing. 

[Btline]

Depends on where these guards cover etc, you cant expect everyone to have all the knowledge surely?

I would expect the all staff in the FOSS^▸ (Freedom of Severn & Solent Rover) area to have at least heard of the FOSS rover! Otherwise, IMO^▸ (in my opinion) they are not trained sufficiently to be running the trains. Ok, perhaps it's difficult to find in the machine, but to not know what it is is completely unacceptable.