Reducing the buy-on-the-day cost

[whole diary]

[grahame]

In answer to a grouch at the fare to Melksham for a visitor proposing to come here on the only train tomorrow with a connection from London Paddington ... I am posting here as - although it's something of a repeat - it's updated with the new super off-peak fares.

Paddington to Melksham Fares, 11th September 2009

From Paddington on the 17:45 train, change at Swindon, Melksham 19:10.
Single fare - 64.00 (Paddington ticket office or ticket vending machines)

or (this option wasn't shown on the journey planner)

From Paddington on the 17:30 train, change at Swindon, Melksham 19:10.
Book a single to Didcot and a Super off-peak single, Didcot to Melksham.
24.00 + 8.80 - total fare 32.80 (tickets both sold at Paddington ticket office)

Note - the split fare is only valid on trains that stop at Didcot, so may not be used on the 17:45 train. There is no need to step off and then rejoin the train there.

[paul7575]

And that demonstrates another aspect of FGW^▸ (First Great Western)'s 'super off peak' changes.

At least 'big bad SWT^▸ (South West Trains)' only brought in super off peak fares on journeys TO Waterloo. FGW must have decided there are  problems with capacity in both directions? Is this true?

Paul

[super tm]

They could not do that.  Prices from London are about half the prices too London.  Sensible set up by BR^▸ (British Rail(ways)) given that the flow into London is so much greater that out of London.

Consequentially when privatisation came about the protected fare from London was about the same price as a cheap day return any way so cheap day returns from London could not have been put up as they would then cost more than the standard day.

Cheap day return to London were about half the price of the standard day so plenty of scope to increase them 

Also FGW^▸ (First Great Western) fares are valid for one month.  So if you try and increase them London bound only sites such as these will soon advise people to buy tickets from London and save money so both directions have to be increased to prevent this happening 

[Mookiemoo]

They could not do that.  Prices from London are about half the prices too London.  Sensible set up by BR^▸ (British Rail(ways)) given that the flow into London is so much greater that out of London.

Whoa!

London is not a black hole - unless it is expanding infinitely, what goes in, must come out

[Tim]

London is not a black hole - unless it is expanding infinitely, what goes in, must come out

But the morning peak is narrower than the evening peak.  Almost everyone starts work at 9am, but in the evening some people leave at 5pm, some at 6, some later, some go for a pint or meal first and leave the city later.  The morning peak is always the worst. 

ticket restrictions in the morning are more justfied on teh grounds of preventing overcrowding.  Evening restrictions look a bit more like proferteering by forcing folk onto higher priced tickets.  On some flows out of London the first off-peak train is the busiest of the whole evening.   

[Btline]

I think that evening restrictions on Off Peak tickets should be removed.

In many cases, I expect people decide to buy an Anytime ticket, and then decide they might as well travel in the morning peak as well to make the most of their day.

I prefer the Chiltern system. Off Peak has no evening restrictions, and a SINGE morning one (arrive after 10 am) - better than FGW^▸ (First Great Western)'s myriad of different times for Off Peak Day and Off Peak; Super Off Peak has a single morning (arrive after 1.45 pm) and a single afternoon (don't leave between 3.20 - 8 pm). This system allows for a day trip on an Off Peak ticket, and even cheaper travel if you are staying in the capital for a few days and staying clear of the peak flows.

[devon_metro]

But then you'd have mass hysteria when commuters couldn't get a seat because there were leisure passengers on board too!!!

[Btline]

But then you'd have mass hysteria when commuters couldn't get a seat because there were leisure passengers on board too!!!

But as Tim says, often the first Off Peak train is often busier! The evening peak is a lot more spread than the morning, and having complicated and unfair restrictions either puts people off the railway, or forces them to buy an Anytime ticket, which causes problems on the already busy morning peak.

And in my experience from Marylebone, it is the commuters who are the ones in the know, who go through the barriers before their train is announced to look at the screens ready to start their run. It's the family with children who stay at the cafe under the departure board who are then taken aback by the crush once the train has been put up. (remember there are no train announcements at Marylebone, although rumours suggest Phil may be coming as Chiltern have put him at both Aylesbury stations... )

[devon_metro]

You are missing a fundamental point. Commuters fill the trains at peak hour, using peak tickets, what benefit would FGW^▸ (First Great Western) have by lowering the price?

[Btline]

You are missing a fundamental point. Commuters fill the trains at peak hour, using peak tickets, what benefit would FGW^▸ (First Great Western) have by lowering the price?

I don't see how this point is related. No-one is suggesting prices are lowered. Commuters either have Anytime tickets (becuase they are travelling in the morning peak anyway) or season tickets.

[John R]

You are missing a fundamental point. Commuters fill the trains at peak hour, using peak tickets, what benefit would FGW^▸ (First Great Western) have by lowering the price?

I don't see how this point is related. No-one is suggesting prices are lowered. Commuters either have Anytime tickets (becuase they are travelling in the morning peak anyway) or season tickets.

The evening HSS^▸ (High Speed Services) services out of Paddington are already rammed with season ticket holders and those on anytime fares. It would be even worse if off peak ticket holders were allowed to use them.

I don't believe anyone buys an anytime ticket and then decides to travel in the morning peak to make the most of the day. They buy an anytime ticket because they have to travel in the peak.       

[moonrakerz]

Slightly related point:-
I went to London yesterday on the first train from Bath that I could get a cheap advance ticket on. I got into coach H, a good 90% of the seats had reserved tickets on them - however by the time we got Paddington only about 30% of these seats were actually occupied. Coach G didn't look any busier.
I came back to Westbury, late evening, very quiet. Same again though, far fewer passengers than reserved tickets.

Did all these people buy First Class tickets - then decide not to travel ? - strange ! Surely the point of buying advance tickets is to save money, not waste it.

[JayMac]

We could all pile on to NatEx coaches (maybe not from Melksham though!) No myriad peak/off peak restrictions with them!!