Changes to the Highway Code

[whole diary]

[bobm]

Whatever next, annual MOT examinations for the horse !

Can see it now: Advisory: Nearside rear horseshoe getting near legal limit 

[Bmblbzzz]

There's been a lot of misleading phrases used in connection with these announcements. One was that "vehicles going straight on would always have priority", implying radical and complicated changes to junction procedures. In fact it refers to the specific case of turning into. but not out of, a side road; the idea is to let pedestrians wanting to cross the road, as well as cyclists going straight on, do so with precedence over the vehicle turning into the side road.

These phrases have appeared in many different places, so it would seem the confusion arises with DfT^» (Department for Transport - about) not journalists. Perhaps it's time we stopped using the word "priority" in traffic situations and adopted more specific words.

Ever the pedant, I can see scope for more confusion - and most people won't bother to ponder what is meant. I've long had the vague idea that a pedestrian already crossing a road had priority and a stronger view that so had a cyclist going straight on.

But will "pedestrians wanting to cross the road" really have priority? If when I'm in a car I'm about to turn left into a side road and I see a pedestrian waiting on the pavement, do I brake to a halt to allow them to cross. I can't see that going down well with drivers behind me!

(A couple of months ago, I was walking along Oxford Road in Reading and paused to cross over the entrance to Waitrose. When driving into the supermarket, I twitch a little about cars close behind as one needs to slow right down to negotiate the 180-degree turn, and I was a little startled when a lady driver turning in to the car park stopped to allow me to cross - with the rear of her car sticking out into the main road.)

Depends how it's implemented. I think the idea is that pedestrians won't "want" to cross the road, they'll simply walk. Like you, I don't think this will work in practice.

[broadgage]

I doubt that the new wording will make that much difference, but even a small change in emphasis is still a step in the right direction. For far too long motorists have believed that they, and only they, have a right to use the roads.

BTW^▸ (by the way), a neighbour of mine regularly uses his horse drawn cart when a riding horse might be more suitable. The reason being that car drivers HAVE to allow space for a large cart, but drive too fast and too close to a horse being ridden.
The cart is also safer after dark as it is equipped with good lights.

[TaplowGreen]

I doubt that the new wording will make that much difference, but even a small change in emphasis is still a step in the right direction. For far too long motorists have believed that they, and only they, have a right to use the roads.

BTW^▸ (by the way), a neighbour of mine regularly uses his horse drawn cart when a riding horse might be more suitable. The reason being that car drivers HAVE to allow space for a large cart, but drive too fast and too close to a horse being ridden.
The cart is also safer after dark as it is equipped with good lights.

I don't doubt that SOME motorists believe they own the road, in the same way as some cyclists and some pedestrians (and some horse and cart drivers I'm sure) leave a lot to be desired in their behaviour, but by no means all in any category.

One of the difficulties with this debate and the issues around it (particularly when it comes to cyclists/motorists) is that it tends to take place with generalisations/absolutes as you've demonstrated, with each side having very little empathy for the other.

[CyclingSid]

Whatever next, annual MOT examinations for the horse !

I think there should be "Poop and scoop" for horses", not sure whether

Advisory: Nearside rear horseshoe getting near legal limit

would apply.

[grahame]

Whatever next, annual MOT examinations for the horse !

I think there should be "Poop and scoop" for horses", not sure whether

I have had it explained to me that horses are vegetarian, and so produce a cleaner and more natural solid waste product than dogs which are supposed to be carnivores but in practice eat a mixture of meat and veg.  I don't recall if that explanation came from a horse rider who may have had an interest in justifying their behaviour - "oy, matey, aren't you going to clean up your sh*t"  or from someone with a more scientific background.

[TaplowGreen]

Whatever next, annual MOT examinations for the horse !

I think there should be "Poop and scoop" for horses", not sure whether

I have had it explained to me that horses are vegetarian, and so produce a cleaner and more natural solid waste product than dogs which are supposed to be carnivores but in practice eat a mixture of meat and veg.  I don't recall if that explanation came from a horse rider who may have had an interest in justifying their behaviour - "oy, matey, aren't you going to clean up your sh*t"  or from someone with a more scientific background.

I'm really enjoying my breakfast! 

[Marlburian]

... I don't doubt that SOME motorists believe they own the road, in the same way as some cyclists and some pedestrians (and some horse and cart drivers I'm sure) leave a lot to be desired in their behaviour, but by no means all in any category.

One of the difficulties with this debate and the issues around it (particularly when it comes to cyclists/motorists) is that it tends to take place with generalisations/absolutes as you've demonstrated, with each side having very little empathy for the other.

As someone who cycled 250,000+ miles, I should be less prejudiced than some about cyclists, but I'm still cross about an incident last week when I was driving with care down a steep hill with a sharp bend at the bottom that I know to be tricky. As I went around the bend, I saw there was a dustcart stopped on my side with operatives collecting and emptying bins. I slowed down and squeezed through carefully, only to get an angry shout behind from a cyclist who had been speeding down the hill. I then had to pause at two road junctions, where he continued his tirade.

He didn't look the sort of person who would entertain these points:

1. He was going too fast to stop safely;
2. Under the imminent guidance, the bin operatives in the road had priority over him (and me);
3. Had there been an oncoming vehicle that entailed my stopping behind the dustcart (and even if I hadn't been there at all), his side of the road would be blocked and there would have been a head-on collision at an impact speed of 35+mph. (And he wasn't wearing a helmet, which is another issue, I know).

I can readily recall other idiocy incidents with motorists and pedestrians - but not with horses and their riders!

(Please forgive my self-indulgence in recounting this incident, but I'm still feeling raw about it.)

[broadgage]

Horses have the merit of having a little commonsense of their own, a trick not yet learnt by cycles.
Horses have been known to find their own way home if the rider falls off, sleeps, or is drunk.
It is alleged that horses regularly used in urban areas can understand traffic lights.
A saddled but riderless horse is a cause for concern since the welfare and whereabouts of the rider are unknown.

[Marlburian]

I've noticed that the horses and their handlers at Little Heath Stables on the edge of Tilehurst are usually treated with respect by motorists. It can't be much fun leading a string of horses along a narrowish lane between the stables and a field.

[stuving]

Horses have the merit of having a little commonsense of their own, a trick not yet learnt by cycles.
Horses have been known to find their own way home if the rider falls off, sleeps, or is drunk.
It is alleged that horses regularly used in urban areas can understand traffic lights.
A saddled but riderless horse is a cause for concern since the welfare and whereabouts of the rider are unknown.

Not too much, though. The one that had a go at my car (many years ago) was not responsible for its actions, according to the law, and neither was its rider.

I did all the right things, slowing right down and into first gear, and getting as far off this very narrow road as I could. It would not have helped if I'd stopped, as the two horses were passing me as fast as I was them. Just when the leading beast got alongside it executed a neat (though perhaps not medalworthy) pirouette and pushed its back end through the side window behind me, and then lashed out with its hooves. "Must have been frightened by a rabbit" was the story; and I suspect it always is. 

[Bmblbzzz]

Horses have the merit of having a little commonsense of their own, a trick not yet learnt by cycles.
Horses have been known to find their own way home if the rider falls off, sleeps, or is drunk.
It is alleged that horses regularly used in urban areas can understand traffic lights.
A saddled but riderless horse is a cause for concern since the welfare and whereabouts of the rider are unknown.

There's a story that when Stroud's Subscription Rooms (a venue for concerts and similar) were being built in 1833-34, a certain local farmer was in the habit of finishing every market day with a pint or several at the Swan, which is still open in Swan Lane just round the corner from the Sub Rooms (unless Covid has forced it to close down). No matter if he could barely stand and it was dark, his horse knew the way home. One particular market day he had better than usual sales to celebrate, so drank accordingly. Unfortunately what his horse did not know and he was too drunk to notice was that Swan Lane was obstructed by scaffolding for the Sub Rooms then under construction. He and his horse trotted up the ramp to the height of the second storey... and straight off the other end. Horse and rider died.

[broadgage]

Poor horse.

[broadgage]

I do however wonder if the report is true, or an early urban myth.

Most scaffolding does not have ramps, but uses ladders and hoists.
Most scaffolding has a rather restricted area and often limited headroom also for work or access, not sufficient to allow easy passage for a horse.
I very much doubt that a horse would enter an unfamiliar structure of its own volition.

Also horses have good night vision and would probably not step of a sheer drop.

[Bmblbzzz]

Perhaps the horse was drunk as well!