Daimler/Volvo JV on Hydrogen Fuel Systems for HGVs

[whole diary]

[stuving]

We've had lots of combinations of vehicles and power sources, but not I think hydrogen fuel-cell lorries. But maybe, sometime soon... from Transport Topics:

Daimler Truck AG, Volvo Group Plan Joint Venture on Hydrogen Fuel Systems

Global truck manufacturers Daimler Truck AG and Volvo Group have reached a preliminary agreement on a joint venture to develop, produce and commercialize fuel cell systems in heavy-duty vehicles by the second half of the decade.

The joint venture will operate as an independent and autonomous entity, with Daimler and Volvo continuing to be competitors in all other areas of business. Daimler will consolidate all of its current fuel cell activities in the joint venture, and Volvo Group will acquire 50% in the joint venture for $650 million.

The two have signed a preliminary nonbinding agreement, but a final agreement is expected by the third quarter of this year. The agreement is set to close before the end of this year.

The goal is for both companies to offer heavy-duty vehicles with fuel cells for demanding longhaul applications in series production in the second half of the decade, according to a statement from the companies. In addition, other automotive and nonautomotive use cases are part of the new joint effort’s scope.

“This joint initiative with the Volvo Group is a milestone in bringing fuel cell-powered trucks and buses onto our roads,” Daimler Truck Chairman Martin Daum said in a news release.

“By forming this joint venture, we are clearly showing that we believe in hydrogen fuel cells for commercial vehicles. But for this vision to become reality, other companies and institutions also need to support and contribute to this development, not least in order to establish the fuel infrastructure needed,” Volvo Group CEO^▸ (Chief Executive Officer) Martin Lundstedt said.

Joining forces will decrease development costs for both companies and accelerate the market introduction of fuel cell systems in products used for heavy-duty transport and demanding longhaul applications, the companies said. In the context of the current economic downturn, cooperation has become even more necessary to meet the Green Deal objectives in Europe within a feasible time frame.

The joint venture will include operations in Germany with production facilities in Germany and Canada.
...

[Bmblbzzz]

As an extremely general, rough and uneducated initial response, fuel cell road vehicles seem to make a lot more sense than in rail, due to the impracticality of wiring up more than a very small proportion of roads.

[eightf48544]

Can you get the Horse Power?

[broadgage]

IMO^▸ (in my opinion), Hydrogen power for trucks OR trains is a rather silly idea and arguably more of a political fashion than a sensible engineering solution.

Hydrogen is inherently expensive, bulky, explosive, hard to store and transport, and has little to commend it.

Bulk or long distance transport of goods should be by rail, not road. Preferably by electric railway.
Road transport is often unavoidable for part of the journey, and this part should be by electric road vehicle.
Battery technology has advanced very considerably and is now viable for a daily range of at least 200 miles.

Many urban centers could benefit from trolleybuses for passengers, and the same infrastructure could power electric delivery vehicles thereby not just conserving battery charge, but actually re-charging the battery.
It might be worth equipping some major roads with overhead electrification for both buses and trucks.

Calls for more research into, or tests of hydrogen power is IMHO^▸ (in my humble opinion) often a crafty political way of avoiding doing anything about pollution from road traffic.
"lets ban older and more polluting vehicles" Cant do that it might hit the poor.
"lets ban all fuel burning vehicles" Cant do that, much too radical.

"Call for research into hydrogen" Sounds good, and postpones doing anything much.

[Bmblbzzz]

Road transport is often unavoidable for part of the journey, and this part should be by electric road vehicle.

Which a fuel cell vehicle is – at least in the same way as (but far more cleanly than) a diesel train. 

Battery technology has advanced very considerably and is now viable for a daily range of at least 200 miles.

It's just reaching 200 miles for cars but moving an HGV 200 miles uses much more energy than a car. Perhaps by the end of the decade it will be there.

[stuving]

IMO^▸ (in my opinion), Hydrogen power for trucks OR trains is a rather silly idea and arguably more of a political fashion than a sensible engineering solution.
...
"Call for research into hydrogen" Sounds good, and postpones doing anything much.

Well, Volvo and Daimler appear to think otherwise. It's true their announcement of a JV with target timescale is only of a preliminary non-binding agreement until later this year. But they are going to put their own money into it, not just ask for someone else to fund research. But even then there's a nuance or two.

Toyota are still making HFC^▸ (Hydrogen-Fuelled Car) cars, and BMW have just announced one. But Daimler have just called a halt to their car production, and other makers agree it's just too expensive and inefficient (VW rather scathingly). For further details, this is the press release from Volvo, this one is Daimler's,  and here is an article about Daimler's decision from Elektrek:

Daimler ends hydrogen car development because it’s too costly
Bradley Berman - Apr. 22nd 2020 11:20 am ET

Daimler’s Mercedes-Benz is killing its program to develop passenger cars powered by hydrogen fuel cells. The company has been working on fuel-cell vehicles for more than 30 years — chasing the dream of a zero-emissions car that has a long driving range, three-minute fill-ups, and emits only water vapor. In the end, the company conceded that building hydrogen cars was too costly, about double the expense of an equivalent battery-electric vehicle.

Mercedes-Benz will wind down production of GLC^▸ (Glasgow Central) F-Cell, its only current fuel-cell model. The GLC-F-Cell was developed in a 2013 collaboration with Ford and Nissan.

The idea of the collaboration was to kickstart the production of fuel-cell cars and hydrogen infrastructure. Mercedes-Benz was the only carmaker of the three partners to produce a vehicle in the program.

Mercedes-Benz only made a few hundred examples of the GLC F-Cell because manufacturing costs for the model were so high. The car was used for business promotions but was never offered for sale to the public.

Daimler research boss Markus Schäfer in January said:

    Fuel cells work great. It’s just a cost issue, and it’s all about scaling. We need volume.

Automotive News reports today:

    [Hydrogen fuel-cell cars] are at least twice as expensive to build as an equivalent battery-powered car in the manufacturing. As a result, sales prices are not reflective of the cost.

Other automakers are giving up on hydrogen cars. In November, Honda — a longtime proponent of hydrogen-powered cars — said it would put its fuel-cell program on hold. Volkswagen published its position on hydrogen last month, producing this graphic:



Volkswagen concluded:

    Everything speaks in favor of the battery, and practically nothing speaks in favor of hydrogen.

BMW, Hyundai, and Toyota continue to tout the technology.

Despite Daimler giving up on hydrogen for passenger vehicles, it will continue to work on fuel-cell systems for heavy-duty vehicles. On Tuesday, the German automaker agreed to cooperate with Volvo Trucks on its development. The rationale is that a fuel-cell powertrain is better suited to large trucks, where large battery packs could be too heavy.

The Daimler-Volvo partnership aims to launch a hydrogen-powered, long-haul truck “in the second half of the decade.” However, Daimler Trucks CEO^▸ (Chief Executive Officer) Martin Daum said that the €200 million ($217 million) to be invested by the two companies “definitely won’t be enough” to move the technology into production.

Daum on Tuesday said:

    The GLC car project is nearly done. As we speak, the last GLC fuel cells will be produced and handed over to customers. At the moment, we don’t plan another car.