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Journey by Journey / Shorter journeys in South and West Wales / Re: New timetables - Transport for Wales - from 15th December 2024
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on: December 04, 2024, 18:09:40
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With Swansea-Manchester meant to be 5 carriages on most services from the timetable change in a few weeks are TFW confident that they are finally able to deliver this? According to the FAQ▸ 's on the website it sounds like they are.
Also after looking at RTT» it seems the arrival from Manchester loses 3 carriages at Swansea with the 2 car going to West Wales and the 3 car just sits in Swansea for an hour until the next 2 car comes from West Wales. The 0945 arrival at Swansea (from Crewe in this instance) then sits there until the next departure to Manchester at 1054. It appears that the few trains that still go from West Wales to Cardiff the hours they dont go to Manchester will 2 cars throughout which could see 2 cars on some busy Cardiff-Milford services.
I hope the all-day couple/uncouple arrangement works out in practice. A Sprinter covering something would snarl it up! I wonder if there's any scope to swap the arrangement so the 3 car portion goes past Swansea and then ends up on Cardiffs in between. With most other routes in theory going up to an appropriate new baseline train length ( CDF» -HHD 3 car, CDF-MAN 5 car etc) the off-hour Cardiff-West journeys are a bit of an anomoly being stuck with 2 cars. Swapping the arrangement would mean more 3 car (with Standard Plus) diagrams in total, as some will be locked into West Wales cycles at any one time. I can see why the extras aren't attaching/detaching at Swansea - it would otherwise involve having two sets couple/uncouple movements going on at the same time each hour, and either very tight movements or having overlapping layovers, none of which is good for resilience. Maybe once things have settled down the 'extras' could have a separate routine of attaching/detaching a 2 car set at CMN to make 4 cars. Several 153 subs today, it seems, and a 150 on at least one Ebbw Vale diagram, which was doing the stepping-up thing that suggests availability is tight. So I am a bit concerned about how there will suddenly be an increase in availability! Especially with 150s starting to be withdrawn now AIUI▸ . 756s are starting to appear; only 1 diagram on today, as far as I could see, but I wouldn't be surprised if there were a dramatic increase in the next few weeks. That would help to cascade some 150s to the Valleys routes currently operated with 153s, which would then help to cover the SWML▸ locals etc until 197 availability improves. Most of the Pembrokes seem to be 197s atm, for example, so they could be released if covered by 153s per previous plans. I would hope that all diagrams involved in the Manchester-West Wales-Cardiff-West Wales-Manchester workings would be prioritised for 197s. If a Sprinter does happen to end up on a working in an emergency I would guess it would have to work as a 2 car Sprinter throughout the diagram with no split (unless another Sprinter could be found). It would have been better if the 3 car had continued to West Wales and the 2 car sat in Swansea for an hour however i guess there isnt enough capacity with the 3 cars to do that. About 4 of the 'Cambrian' 197s have now entered service and hopefully the remaining 3 cars (currently 2 outstanding) will be in service soon but even with with the extra units they still seem to struggle. Im unsure which working on the Maesteg and Ebbw Vale lines are booked Sprinters or booked 197s. I know the Newport-Ebbw Vales are Sprinters and often seem to be a single 153 (good use of stock when they are short as I think officially they are booked 2 cars) but there are quite a few 150s and pairs of 153s that turn up on Maesteg and Ebbw Vale which makes me wonder if some are booked as such. Personally I think post Dec TT change if they are short of 197s it would be better for Ebbw Vale-Maesteg and Swanline-Pembroke Dock to be subbed for Sprinters before anything else. With the new trains on the Valleys there should be more spare 150s around to hopefully cover and keep the 197s where they need to be. Also I understand the 5th MK4 diagram is supposed to start with the new timetable (0530 Swansea to Manchester etc) so that should free up another 197. Whether it actually happens is another thing.
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Journey by Journey / Shorter journeys in South and West Wales / Re: New timetables - Transport for Wales - from 15th December 2024
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on: December 03, 2024, 21:23:19
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Swanline still not being hourly all day is disappointing however its still a much improved service in the morning and evening peaks. Particularly going in Cardiff direction in the morning.
I have noticed the Carmarthen-Cardiff services that have been cut during the week appear to be running on a Saturday. This is very sensible knowing how busy services are heading towards Cardiff on a Saturday.
With Swansea-Manchester meant to be 5 carriages on most services from the timetable change in a few weeks are TFW confident that they are finally able to deliver this? According to the FAQ▸ 's on the website it sounds like they are.
Also after looking at RTT» it seems the arrival from Manchester loses 3 carriages at Swansea with the 2 car going to West Wales and the 3 car just sits in Swansea for an hour until the next 2 car comes from West Wales. The 0945 arrival at Swansea (from Crewe in this instance) then sits there until the next departure to Manchester at 1054. It appears that the few trains that still go from West Wales to Cardiff the hours they dont go to Manchester will 2 cars throughout which could see 2 cars on some busy Cardiff-Milford services.
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Journey by Journey / Shorter journeys in South and West Wales / Re: 197s now in service
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on: November 17, 2024, 21:16:44
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I think the 197s are more than adequate for long distance travel. The only things that lets them down is not enough carriages. All too often there are still 2 car 197s working from South Wales to Manchester which are full and standing at certain times. When we get the promised 5 car service (which is planned between Swansea-Manchester) things should improve hugely.
The ride quality on a 197 can be a little rough at certain places. Two places ive noticed it are Llanelli to Carmarthen and The Conwy Valley line. Also there is less luggage space and less toilets than the 175s they replaced but overall I do think they are worthy successor to the 175s. The overhead luggage area is much better than a 175 which does compensate a little for less luggage racks than the 175s had.
A good proportion of passengers are making short journeys e.g from one of the towns on the marches to Cardiff, Hereford or Shrewsbury. Some make long distance journeys but we also have the 2 hourly MK4 trains which is an option for long distance passengers with better ride quality, buffet coach and first class available.
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Journey by Journey / Shorter journeys in South and West Wales / Re: TfW June timetable
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on: June 07, 2024, 22:06:13
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Some comments on the new timetable. There are not that many changes to the actual timetable outside of the Valleys/Metro sercices but there seems to be lots of changes to what is booked for certain services.
Nearly everything West of Cardiff now is booked for a 197 (aside from the HOWL which is to remain as 153s long term). Pembroke Dock appears to still be Sprinters but due to switch to 197s anytime now I hear. Even the daytime fishguard boat train and all Swanline services seem to be 197s as of this week according to whats been on RTT» and these were regular Sprinters (not including the 2 Swanline that go to Chester which have been 197s for a while)
A shame so many 197's are still 2 or 3 cars when we were told there would be 5 cars on Swansea-Manchester at least. The 1700 service from Milford Haven is now running all the way to Manchester. A much later through service for passengers West of Cardiff. However in the other direction 1630 is the last service running West of Cardiff and that is the daily MK4 service only going as far as Swansea.
Ive read several complaints online about services from Merthyr etc no longer being direct to Barry Island however to be honest its not that much or a burden to change at Cardiff Central. Ive likewise seen people comment that its good to have a direct service from Caerphilly to Barry Island.
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Journey by Journey / Shorter journeys in South and West Wales / Re: TFW Future Timetable Consultation
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on: April 14, 2024, 22:50:41
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For the Cambrian it also says the removal of four services between Machynlleth and Pwllheli (two in each direction). Im surprised the 158s will still be around into 2025.
I have had a good look at the timings of Swanline and other Carmarthen-Cardiff services, it looks like the hours there is still a service between Carmarthen-Cardiff it does connect with the MK4 going to Manchester (but only just as its 7 minutes which is the minimum for Cardiff). The service from West Wales arrives at xx46 and the Manchesters all seem to depart at xx53. In the hours there isnt a fast service from Carmarthen there is the Swanline which arrives into Cardiff around xx34 and would connect with the MK4. So not to bad but could be better. Plus there is the 2 hourly direct service of course. It would make sense to use that unless one wants to make use of the first class service on the MK4. Looking at the departures from Cardiff to West Wales its even worst than the up journeys. The hour the Swanline runs is also the same hour a service from Manchester runs through to the West - so we have the GWR▸ , TFW fast and TFW stopper all very close together. Then the other hour when there is no fast services to West Wales there is no Swanline either so just the GWR then an hour gap (aside from the Maesteg). It is also odd having a departure to Milford and then very close behind it a departure to Pembroke Dock. Very little terminating at Carmarthen most seem to go through to one of the 3 branch lines. The 1730 Manchester will run through to Carmarthen though which is very welcome as the loss of the 1830 Manchester-Carmarthen (due to a MK4 running it to Cardiff) meant 1530 was the last direct service to Carmarthen and 1630 the last direct to Swansea.
Yes Ebbw Vale and the return of the hourly Liverpools were the only things that went ahead from what was initially planned for the Dec 23 timetable and even they were delayed I think.
Hopefully the extra Tenby services will just be Camarthen-Tenby shuttles and they will be able to cram them into the existing timetable without too many problems. Good point about holding the PMD trains at Whitland if there are delays, enough recovery time at PMD to compensate for that.
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Journey by Journey / Shorter journeys in South and West Wales / Re: TFW Future Timetable Consultation
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on: April 14, 2024, 11:08:50
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I agree, the split doesnt bother me either but from what I hear 197s dont like being split or attached but hopefully that will improve in time.
When the original timetable plans were announced back when TFW first took over the franchise it was said all Swansea-Manchesters would be 5 carriages with less carriages between Swansea-West Wales. Of course when they decided to get more MK4s, keep some of 153s and get rid of the 170s everything changed with 153s and some 197s replacing the journeys the 170s would have done and the MK4 replacing some 197s on the Manchester-South Wales.
it would be far better if the MK4's turned at Swansea every 2 hours rather than Cardiff, especially as now there is a gap between Carmarthen-Cardiff at various parts of the day. They would still have a through service from Manchester-West Wales the other hour. But it feels like Cardiff-Swansea-Carmarthen passengers lose out every other hour with a gap in service and when it does run 2 carriages instead of the promised 5 cars. It seems Cardiff-Manchester is being prioritised over West of Cardiff as usual. Services between Swansea-Cardiff are very busy especially on Fridays and Saturdays - plenty of leisure traffic going to Cardiff for the afternoon/evening from around 10am onwards on these days, I dont think they have finalised the Saturday timetable yet but hopefully when they do they will keep the hourly fast TFW service. Although as you say, if there isnt a train people just wont turn up and will just go for the GWR▸ either side.
When the original plans for the Dec 2023 timetable were released a year or so ago it was said there would be enough 197s to run 5 cars every hour between Swansea-Cardiff, with one hour going through to Manchester with a MK4 Cardiff-Manchester the other hour. In that case there should be a few spare 197s around to ensure some swanline's are doubled up to 4 cars which will be needed given the extra stops at Pencoed etc and less fast services between Swansea-Cardiff.
The plans for Dec 2023 said Maesteg-Ebbw Vale and Cardiff-Cheltenham would all be hourly and have 2 car 197s. Swanline and Pembroke Dock would remain as 153s until the FLIRTS could take over the Maesteg/Ebbw Vale/Cheltenham routes and then those 197s would be used for Swanline and Pembroke.
Regarding the Crewe-Shrewsbury stopper that is a bit of a strange one as around this time last year it was a 197 pretty much every day but apparently on paper it was a single 153. I assume as 197's didnt start running to Cardiff until last Summer and to Swansea/Carmarthen last Autumn it was just an easy route to put a 197 on as resources were so stretched and they were cleared from Shrewsbury to Crewe early on. Apparently now it is booked and usually is a 153. I had heard that the 153s will also be used on the Crewe stopper as well as a few west wales services long term (along with the HOWL) this is going to mean Crewe has to continue signing 153s? As apparently the plan was just Shrewsbury and Carmathen would sign 153s for the HOWL
Yes the merging of Swanline with Pembroke Dock will save diagrams - another reason why hopefully some of them will be doubled up to 4 cars with all these spare 197s - but id be concerned any delays will have a knock on effect. Especially as they have to pass each other at Tenby, one delay is likely to have a knock on effect all day then.
As for the Cambrian i dont really have much knowledge of that line and have never been on it. I have been to Aberystwyth and Barmouth but by road. But from what i hear the main issue with the Cambrian is overcrowded services in Summer when they are 2 cars.
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Journey by Journey / Shorter journeys in South and West Wales / Re: TFW Future Timetable Consultation
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on: April 13, 2024, 22:28:48
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Overall I wonder if this is TfW trying to under-promise so that it can over-deliver later. It could be argued that this is a valid response to recent over-promising, under-delivering, as anyone who has wandered through the underpass at Queen Street will note!
I can't see 1L11 getting to CDF» at 0835 behind that stopper! Especially if it's operated by 153s initially - those timings could only possibly work with a 197, and even then it's tight. Strange that the stoppers are often leaving SWA» 2 mins behind the Londons (and the timings at Llansamlet suggesting this is being maintained throughout that stretch)... have the long 2-aspect sections between Landore and Neath that previously required 5 min headways in the rules been removed? (Not rhetorical - no idea.)
I'm not a fan of the 5 car Manchesters splitting to 2 cars (as per the previous draft) at SWA. Maybe with the recently increased IET▸ presence beyond Swansea the capacity need is better managed, but it's not ideal, as those 2 car sets end up on the journeys that start/terminate at CDF. It's less of a problem on the down where they're generally following IETs, but on the up it's not great, or indeed on the down if IETs are disrupted. There is a general issue with near-hour gaps CDF-SWA (to spell it out, on the main line between Wales's two main cities) - on the down because of the way trains are flighted, and on the up where the newly-proposed gaps arise.
Good to see the increase on the Milfords, but it is at expense of improvements to the Fishguards. Perhaps this is recognising differences in demand, and it also means more Milfords to/from Manchester. The idea would be the previously proposed 2 hourly to each, plus a 2 hourly CMN-MFH shuttle, but that would require another unit & crew.
The evening down Swanline service much is better than in the earlier draft, with existing last train restored. Plus there's an up Swanline leaving SWA around 23:30, a need that is mentioned in local media from time to time; I think in the previous draft that only stopped at main stations.
Interesting to see the Pembroke DOcks and Swanlines merging - perhaps on the basis of feedback from previous draft, noting that PMD was the only Pembrokeshire branch not to have a regular Cardiff service, although it could be argued that the PMDs connnected best with the Londons - and connecting into an IET is perhaps preferable to a through 2 car journey. (Can of worms re IET comfort opened...)
I doubt the 0835 arrival into Cardiff will make the final timetable. With a Swanline arriving 1 minute ahead of it. That is definately going to risk the performance of the GWR▸ . Im also surprised the Swanline's depart 2 mins after the GWR - is that even allowed for them to be so close - they are only 5 minutes behind at Neath which includes stops at Llansamlet and Skewen. It looks far too tight. Im not a fan of the splitting of services at Swansea either. But it should work both ways and any Camarthen-Cardiff services should gain extra carriages at Swansea and then back from Cardiff not just the ones that go to/come from Manchester. The Pembroke Dock-Swanline is a risk given the single line and crossing at Tenby and the impact of Swanline on the main line/arrival into Cardiff. I wonder if its to ensure Carmarthen gets at least 1 train per hour direct to Cardiff on average during the day given some Carmarthen to Cardiff fast services have been axed.
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Journey by Journey / Shorter journeys in South and West Wales / Re: TFW Future Timetable Consultation
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on: April 13, 2024, 12:19:13
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I hope all Swanline is formed of 197s by December! They havent got a hope of keeping to time if formed of 153s
It looks like the consultation is online although I suppose people could write a letter if they didnt want to do it/couldnt do it online. Havent heard of them having public meetings however.
I believe the stations between STJ▸ and Cardiff are related to the Metro which is being kept seperate to the core TFW services.
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Journey by Journey / Shorter journeys in South and West Wales / TFW Future Timetable Consultation
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on: April 12, 2024, 19:59:55
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TFW have a consultation for the future timetable. https://haveyoursay.tfw.wales/strategic-future-timetable-review?fbclid=IwAR1F_zm4kuFzZ7A46IeSr7yjpw7ULTUIJaniOTA0KU57aRLHS3fCneOdrDk_aem_AdmWEoId3Rp5fsisXf-wC-Ru0xrxvH3d0e0mbEPjBbrw8s_BkdDy5LSH1ANJETC3AAQApparently they hope to implement these changes from the December 2024 timetable change. But there is a consulation open until May so things could change, but draft timetables are included. This consultation does not include the Cardiff Metro/Valley routes as these are separate to the rest of the core network but does include Vale of Glamorgan, Maesteg and Ebbw Vale. It seems to me they have backtracked on a lot of the promises made back in late 2022 for the Dec 2023 timetable (most of which were deferred until this December anyway but now they have cancelled may things alltogether). What is particularly disappointing is the lack of hourly Swanline service that was promised, although there appear to be improvements to both the morning and evening timetable with an hourly service from around 6.30am-9.30am in both directions plus extra services in the evening. Also the HOWL has taken a step backwards by going back to 4 trains per day and pretty much the timetable used before Dec 2022. The Cambrian also loses services but I dont have any first hand experience with this route so cant comment. Good to see extra services for West Wales particularly Haverfordwest and Milford Haven and the long awaited hourly all day service between Cardiff-Cheltenham but thats about it! Most surprising of all is a few Camarthen-Cardiff services cancelled entirely (ive spotted at least 2 that dont go Manchester anymore due to the MK4's from Cardiff have been removed alltogether). This results in around an hour gap twice in the morning between Swansea-Cardiff which surprises me. Both the 0853 and 1058 services from Carmarthen to Cardiff are cancelled. Also the 06xx Carmarthen-Manchester will go via the district line. It used to be the service an hour earlier that did that but of course that is now the daily MK4 from Swansea to Manchester (which is actually booked for a 197 at the moment but thats a different story) but running the service that used to pass Neath around 7am via the SDL isnt good news for Swansea and Neath passengers.
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Journey by Journey / Shorter journeys in South and West Wales / Re: Encouraging Occasional Passengers
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on: August 10, 2023, 20:25:01
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I agree about Carmarthen, they often seem to have cancellations due to not enough train crew.
Also ive noticed recently random trains seem to be removed from the timetable, not cancelled just removed as if they were never there. The 1105 Swansea-Cardiff is an example of this. A few weeks ago i wanted to catch it but ended having to get the 1203 fast train instead.
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Journey by Journey / Shorter journeys in South and West Wales / Re: Encouraging Occasional Passengers
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on: August 05, 2023, 18:55:10
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The Royal Welsh Special train being cancelled two days out of four this year was nothing short of shocking! Given the event only runs for 4 days out of 365 train crew should have been prioritised to work these services and all others on the HOWL for these 4 days. Even if it meant cancelling some Carmarthen-Cardiff workings (its not as if unusual for trains to be cancelled on this route!).
Im aware that only Carmarthen train crew can work the South of the HOWL line, so im wondering how its supposed to work when the Royal Special runs. Do Carmarthen train crew travel to Cardiff by taxi or on another service. Its not as if the train crew can change at Swansea like some other workings as the special goes via the district line. Either way they should have ensured this was prioritised for the 4 days.
With the Tenby/Pembroke line being unreliable too it puts me off a day trip there. They really need to sort it out. We said last Summer things would be better this Summer but if anything its even worse!
The 197s coming to West Wales cant come soon enough. Seeing so many overcrowded 150s working from Milford-Manchester is really unacceptable. Its gone on since March. And wasnt great before then. Nearly 6 months of an appalling service!
ive heard the 197s will be running very soon on West Wales services to Manchester/Cardiff. They have already started running Holyhead to Cardiff. The 2 afternoon Swansea/Llanelli-Chester (Swanline) have been split at Cardiff in recent weeks so a 197 can operate East of Cardiff. It was supposed to switch to 197 for the entire service with the May TT change. Not sure what the issue is but hopefully it can be resolved very soon. Getting fed up waiting now!
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Journey by Journey / Shorter journeys in South and West Wales / Re: Manchester to West Wales timetable change from December 2022
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on: April 12, 2023, 12:48:21
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Ive heard that Swanline and Cardiff-Holyhead will be 197s from the May TT change however whether this will be a few diagrams or all of them remains to be seen.
It looks like both the 15xx from Swansea and the 16xx from Llanelli end up going to Chester as they do now. Could this be a sign they will be 197s, or at least 1 of them will be, so the diagram/s end at the depot in Chester. The one that comes down from Holyhead to Llanelli is no longer showing as a through working from May TT change and will start from Cardiff to Llanelli (it still goes via the district line on the down journey). Could be a sign all Swanlines will be formed of 2 diagrams again and no interworking as such with other routes.
Yes looks like the Treherbert closure will free up a few 150s. No doubt needed for some of the former 170 diagrams in the short term with only 3 staying until November when more 197s should be in place by then.
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Journey by Journey / Shorter journeys in South and West Wales / Re: Manchester to West Wales timetable change from December 2022
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on: April 11, 2023, 19:27:58
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Around 6 weeks on and the situation is slowly improving both with the 175s and introduction of the 197s. Although neither is happening fast enough really as there is still an abundance of 2 carriage 150s or 153s on long distance routes. I had the misfortune of having to stand on a 150 the other day for quite a bit of time. There were many people travelling with large suitcases and a 150 is not ideal for large items of luggage with no luggage racks and many suitcases far too large for the overhead racks. A few of the tip up seats were blocked by suitcases and unfortunately there was nowhere they could really be moved to. So not ideal at all. One thing 150 do have in favour over a 175 is if you have to stand on a train you have a bit more space to move around on a 150 than a 175 with the doors in the middle. But a quick look at TFW social media pages on Twitter etc show it wasn't a great weekend on the Marches with lots of complaints and photos of overcrowded Sprinters. The North Wales coast has done a bit better with some 197s doubled up to form 4 cars. Not seen many complaints from there so fingers crossed things are improving slowly.
The 197 introduction seems frustratingly slow! However it is getting better with a few 4 cars now plus it looks like Conwy Valley and Liverpool have their services back now (as 197s). One even made it to the Crewe-Chester shuttle today but only for 1 service, it was switched to a 175 after that (a real waste of resources when many 150s/153s are on long distance, unless there was a good reason for it, like it couldn't venture far from Chester depot!) I wonder when we can realistically see the 197s on services out of Cardiff. I hope something starts to happen when the new timetable happens next month.
Regarding the 170s, more have left TFW for EMR» . But apparently 3 are being kept until November which is a sensible move given the shortage at the moment of suitable trains. Even if all 175s are back by May, it will take the pressure off a bit with those few extra 170s.
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Journey by Journey / Shorter journeys in South and West Wales / Re: Manchester to West Wales timetable change from December 2022
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on: March 18, 2023, 20:59:40
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I think the problem is Chester depot cant cope with maintaining the 197s and 175s. It was inevitable there would be a transition phase between the 2 fleets but unfortunately the decision to concentrate the 197s in the North initially has resulted in the Marches being the big losers, at least until enough Cardiff and Carmarthen can be trained on 197s.
Having now been on a 197 from Chester to Manchester earlier this month, we are definitely in for an improvement once they are fully rolled out in the South. A big upgrade on every type of Sprinter and also preferred them to the 175s.
The only reason i think the 175s could go sooner is because they will be gone by December anyway. If they can hang onto some 170s for a bit longer and also get as many 197s onto the Marches as possible from May they may be able to just about cope. Time will tell I guess. All TFW have said it the 175s are out of service for safety checks, i think they provided an update earlier this week saying the same thing about more trains than usual needing repairs etc.
Also I agree about the 158s. Ive always rated them very highly, especially since ATW▸ did their big refurbishment of them around 2010/2011 but I also liked them before that and also liked the Wessex trains version of them. Infact before the 175s had their refurbishment when TFW took over the 158s were my favourite of the ATW/TFW trains, we just didnt get them often enough on the Marches due to them being tied to the Cambrian/Birmingham/Holyhead services.
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Journey by Journey / Shorter journeys in South and West Wales / Re: Manchester to West Wales timetable change from December 2022
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on: March 18, 2023, 19:41:36
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Well over two weeks later and still only around 3 or 4 175s in service. It will be interesting to see what happens. Will they be repaired and cleared for service or they might they just scrap them and manage with the combination of 158s, 153s and 150s on the Marches until the 197s are there. It seems by cancelling a number of services in the Valley's and West Wales, cutting back Shrewsbury-Birmingham to Wolverhampton, bus replacement on the Conwy Valley and cancelling the relatively new Newport-Cross Keys and Chester-Liverpool services they have freed up enough Sprinters to just about cope. Fortunately some services on the Marches are 158s but a good proportion are 150 and 153s which arent great.
Interestingly yesterday one of the 4 175s that was actually in service did a HOWL service from Shrewsbury to Swansea before returning to Chester on the 1505 Swanline/Chester service. Assume this was a stock movement as there wasnt a sprinter available in Shrewsbury. A sprinter then got swapped at Swansea and did the HOWL whilst the 175 did the Chester service.
Todays Railways magazine says TFW are in talks about keeping some 170s for longer. From May 175s were meant to go on the Maesteg to Cheltenhams with 150s I think on Ebbw Vale to compensate for the loss of all the 170s. Could this be a sign that TFW would rather keep the 170s a bit longer and get rid of the 175s? Nothing set in stone of course!
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