Great Western Coffee Shop

Beware...<rant mode on>!

So, received my normal "FGW reports no delays" email at 17:00...always a good sign as it means I simply need to do battle with the Tube network on my journey home.  But, surprisingly, no problems with the Tune journey (beyond it being cramped/stifling/sweaty, etc. etc.).

Arrived at Paddington in plenty of time for 18:18....and immediately the sixth sense kicked in as I realised that there seemed to bemore passengers than normal at the stadium.  Sure enough, delays showing on several departures on the board.  Ho, hum, let's take a look at the FGW departure board on the web.....Good news, no delays showing and 18:18 due at Platform 2.  Soon twigged however, as more trains on the Paddington board showed "delayed", that there were problems (although no tannoy calls at this point).  Then noticed the message on the board to say that there were problems with signalling at Slough and that delays were being expected.  fair enough I thought but the website shows my train on time, althoug the board now said 18:18 - delayed.

At around 18:22, web link for 18:18 said that details of the train were no longer available.  H'mmm.  A while afterwards the board showed that it was cancelled.  Bugger!  Never mind, there's the 18:36.....just wait till it appears on the board.  Meanwhile a check on the website shows it as on time (hurrah!).     Tannoy announcements then started to explain about signalling problems in the Slough area and that people should head to Waterloo and take alternate route to Reading, etc......Which doesn't work if you're going to Maidenhead!

Anyway, 18:36 continued to show on the board as delayed and on the web site as on-time until about 18:50 when pretty much all trains magically went from showing as on-time or delayed to Cancelled!  Meanwhile the link to the train's details on the website suddenly switched to 'details of journey no longer available' or something similar.

Waited for 19:18 which showed a by now familiar pattern - on-time on website, delayed on Paddington noticeboard, follwed a while later by cancelled on the Paddington board.  Having now stood at Paddington  for over an hour I went for a stroll (can recommend Paddington Basin!) and returned in time (around 19:30) to discover that there was now a train on platform 9 that would shortly call at all stations in the Western hemisphere, including Maidenhead...that'll do nicely!

Judging by the number of FGW staff who crammed into the driver's cab in the middle of the train (apols, don't know its proper name!) it was obvious that there werer major problems being experienced...and you know, I kind of accept that.  What I struggle to accept is when a web-site says one thing and departure boards say another and when trains appear as on-time, delayed, delayed, delayed, delayed, cancelled....when it's quite obvious that they're simply not going to operate and that the entire system is going to be stuffed for a few hours.

Why can't FGW simply recognise that the supply of accurate information is an important element of the service that they provide?  If there's expected to be no service to Maidenhead for a couple of hours then tell me so I can decide what to do, and plan accordingly.  If they keep saying on-time, delayed, delayed, delayed, cancelled then there's no way for me to plan/re-arrange, etc.   Ditto when a website says one thing and a noticeboard says another!

Grrrrr..

<rant mode off>

No I totally agree.. This happened to me a couple of weeks ago and I spent a good couple of hours stood at Paddington.. I am so glad I had today off.. It's definitely getting worse :-)

That is one of the big weaknesses with the live departure boards. They always assume that a train will start out from its destination on time - until it doesn't.  Now I know at Paddington it wouldn't work because they can swap sets about but on branch lines like Marlow or Henley it doesn't take a genius to work out that if the incoming service is late then the return will be too. Why it cannot program the boards to say "delayed" I don't know.

As to why the two sources of information can't agree is anyone's guess.

None of the three cancellations you mentioned were shown on the FGW network updates page.

Currently on the 11.30 fast train from Paddington. Just stopped beyond Slough. Still delays due to the signalling problems.

Problems must have lasted all evening I guess.

Boppy.

Just got in to Worcester Shrub Hill over an hour late on the 19:48.

Each time this happens I take the train from Marylebone to High Wycombe, then get a bus to either Marlow or Bourne End.  Depending on how well the buses and trains connect, it takes around 2-3 hours.  A nice scenic route if you're not in a hurry :)

Yes it is one of the flaws of NRE's "Live" Departure Boards.

The only one for Paddington that is actually Live is available here: http://www.networkrail.co.uk/pad purely as it's the same information as on  the actual boards at Paddington.

When I last check at 23:30 trains were still being talked past 1 signal on each line near Burnham (that's where my train got stopped anyway)

And in terms of your e-mail, you probably realise anyway, but at 17:00 the service was actually fine..

Still looks bad this morning- seems to be only a half hourly service through Maidenhead.

I'm glad I'm no longer doing the Paddington commute, although the problems were impacting the North Downs Line as well- probably due to misplaced stock & train crew- a lot of the Gatwicks were turning back at Redhill.

FGW have now posted a release on their website. Seems like another cable theft  >:(

I've just looked at Live Departure Boards on the FGW website and it's reporting that this morning's 08:57 stopper to Oxford left Paddington at 09:00, Langley at 09:28, then 'no report' until Maidenhead where it left at 11:12! If this is correct then things still must be horribly wrong at the moment.

EDIT: Looks like the following stopper 30 minutes later was also similarly delayed - it's shown as leaving Slough 09:59, then Maidenhead at 11:42. I was planning on going into Reading on the train shortly but it looks like I'll have to drive in and pay the car parking.  :(

They are with the delays and cancellations list growing ever longer. Not going to bother listing them as there are too many. Check the current running page for the latest info: http://www.firstgreatwestern.info/tgf.php

Last Saturday it was East Coast who were suffering from infrastructure problems. Today it's FGW's turn this coming after a pretty difficult few days. Made all the more annoying by the fact that it's cable theft that is making many people's day a bit of a misery  >:(

Wonder how long before the national media pick up on it. Admittedly the EC has had problems more than once over recent months so that may have made it more newsworthy.

Normally we get contradictory information because of the fractured nature of today's railways. But FGW have managed to contradict themselves on their own website regarding ticket acceptance during the ongoing disruption.

The main message on the website home page says:

"Customers travelling on Advance Purchase tickets, who find that their train has been cancelled or delayed, may travel on the train scheduled before their original journey or on the next available service after their scheduled journey only."

Note that word 'only'. For further information you are directed to FGW's 'Live Updates' page which has the following in regard to Advance Purchase ticket acceptance:

"Whilst the problem has been rectified the extent of disruption means that train services will take some considerable time to be restored to normal. Customers travelling on Advance Purchase tickets who have had their intended journey disrupted by this incident may travel at any time today or tomorrow, Sunday 5th June."


Oh, and the 'Live Updates' page is for some reason not including all individual cancellations. No mention of the xx30 BRI-PAD and xx00 PAD-BRI being cancelled.
 ::)

The lads at Slough had a good time watching the disruption on a bright June evening. WE just had to contend with the Brunel roundabout in Slough which is being dug up and without traffic lights.

I'm just glad I'm not commuting anymore, but commiserations to all those on coffee shop caught up in the chaos, I've been there.

Trains still going slow past my house this am.

Apology from Mark Hopwood that appears on the front page of the FGW website:

Good to see them making more use of the website again. That's the first apology I've seen on there for a while. There was also a news story added last week. Be good if they could add the Summer Sunday Swindon-Weymouth service as a story too.

As an aside on an iPhone Mark Hopeood's letter is chopped off at the bottom and you can't tell who it's from.

All basically saying that none was the fault of the operator.

However, I shall be exploring with FGW what more / better info could hsve been imparted on a more timely basis. A very good point was made earlier about Reading, for example.

Mark Hopwood's apology is welcome, as it his desire to identify, "...what more could have be done to prevent these incidents from happening."

I would also suggest that he looks at the information relayed to passengers. This is one area that gets regularly commented on and criticised here on the forum and elsewhere when these major problems occur. These incidents are never going to be totally eradicated, so whilst it's admirable to re-double efforts in that direction, I'd like to see some of that effort directed toward improving the communication to passengers when things do go belly-up. And front-line staff, let's not forget them. They are often left as in the dark as the passengers!

Cancellations for example: They were all there in the 'staff eyes only' Live Departures, but not all listed on FGW's website or, it would appear, communicated to Customer Services. I know, I called them regarding the 1330 BRI-PAD on Saturday. They assured me it was running. It didn't.

Then there's the contradictory information which I highlighted earlier in this thread. Customer Services told me the front page message was the correct one with AP tickets only being valid either side of a cancelled service and not for the rest of Saturday or all of Sunday as was communicated to passengers looking at FGWs 'Live Updates' page. CS Advisor told me she would bring this to the attention of the relevant person so that the contradictory information was removed. It never was - it stayed there for the rest of Saturday.

Now, I only used the information sources available online and via the 'phone to monitor the situation. These left a lot to be desired. I can only imagine how much worse it was on the ground.

Oh, and the 0845 number to FGW Customer Services gave up on Saturday lunchtime. All you got was a recorded message saying, "Due to unforeseen circumstances we are unable to take your call at present, please try later." Funny that the direct 01 numbers were still working......

In the last five weeks, I have made 14 individual journeys with FGW.  Three of these have experienced a cancellation, two have been delayed.  I thought perhaps my expectation of information relayed to passengers was too high, but fortunately plenty of other people were moaning.

Common complaints at Temple Meads and Bath Spa were: no staff on the platform, no announcements apart from the automated "please wait for further information" and information on the website being different from information on the station CIS.  I thought this type of issue had been addressed in the last 24 months, with new customer service training and investment in passenger information systems?!

At Clifton Down, myself and another person tried using the help point but no-one answered!  Intending to travel up to SVB then back to BRI, I ended up walking down to Temple Meads and postponing my SVB trip yet again!

I lost my cool which resulted in me shouting at a dispatcher on Thursday (which is very unlike me) when he came out with stupid comments like "if you weren't standing in the doorway, I might be able to dispatch the train on time" and "there's plenty of room, move along the train" when we were already squashed in like sardines.  He (being the only staff member on the platform) was trying to fit all the Portsmouth AND Weymouth passengers onto a 2 coach 150 despite a Weymouth service (terminating at Westbury) being due within 10 minutes.

As you can probably tell from many of my recent posts, I've not been very impressed with FGW's handling of customer service issues in the last two months.

Is this an industry wide problem and not just FGW? Too much reliance on automated system which are absolutely useless when things go wrong.

We seem to be hearing this everytime there is a problem on the rail network that the TOCs can't seem to handle things. East Coast took some stick for their handling of things last weekend when the knitting got snagged up.

Maybe having a central control is good at certain times but not at others.

My wife's experience of a weekend trip from Worcester to London confirms further the communication problems that FGW seem to have.
She caught yesterday's 08.39 Worcester Shrub Hill to Paddington (via Cheltenham) which left WSH seven late. By Cheltenham it was approx 30 late with announcements onboard saying this was caused by signalling problems in the Kidderminister (sic) area. This apparantly caused a mix of confusion and hilarity. For those who do not know the train goes no where near the Kidderminster signalling area nor is there acrew change which it could have affected.
The service continued late losing a few minutes on the way to Reading. From there, of course, it suffered considerable more delay. My gripe, as an ex BR Operational Manager, is that all FGW staff involved knew this train was going to suffer much further delay (the trains were queueing up to be given verbal permission to pass reds) and no one thought to tell the passengers this was the case. Do FGW not think? People are travelling for a purpose and if they are given some semblance of accurate information (even if it is no more than " You will be further delayed") they can try and reduce the negative impact the delay will undoubtedly cause. All they got was the on board staff at regular intervals apologising and announcing that the train was now 40mins then 50mins and so on, late. I suspect they knew that
Unfortunately her return trip shone a poorer light on our railways (accepting that the cause of yesterday's problems was out of Network Rail and FGW's hands.)
Arriving at Paddington at 14.10 the train to Hereford (via Cheltenham) was showing as "being prepared". At 14.15 it came up as departing Platform 2. She went over to the platform, showed her ticket to a member of staff at the gate (she did not go through the ticket barriers) and got on the train. At about 14.25 a few passengers around her became concerned and asked others where the train was going. Answer Swansea!!. By now the Hereford train had gone and when the group spoke to staff they received unconcerned and inaccurate information. One said "if it was on the board it must be right" and another said the next train for Worcester would be the train via Oxford and the bus. My wife phoned me at that time and I told her to get back on the Swansea train and change at Bristol Parkway. She advised the others with her of this but, unfortunately, they were told they could not do this and if they did they would be surcharged. My wife thinks she was the only one to "have the bottle" to ignore this completely wrong information. The only mitigating circumstances in this sorry tale were the two on board staff who inspected her tickets who were both aware of the easement and were polite and helpful.
For those of you still reading, this experience has convinced my wife that she does not want to travel by rail again on her own.

There are a few reports around that go into some of the reasons for IT systems (such as the PIS) collapsing when extreme problems arise.  This report is about the last major snow problems but still has some interesting points about what goes wrong behind the scenes...

http://www.rail-reg.gov.uk/upload/pdf/pidd-interim-report-feb11.pdf

Hope it is of some interest.

Paul

Well I was trying to get between Reading and Burnham. These things happen, and cable theft far too often. However, lack of information, rude staff and the general bad attitude from them also happens far too often. I watched them being rude to many people including myself. I asked a question ( after 40mins of no information) in a very polite manor as I appreciate the stress they were under, only to be barked at ^ I HAVE NO INFOMATION^. When I asked him to use his radio to contact control and ask for me and the fellow 30+ passengers waiting, again politely, I was told in a rude manor ^dont tell me how to do my job^. To cap it all off the guy at slough tried charging me extra as my ticket only covered me to Burnham- where no trains were stopping. The quicker we get rid of First the better and I hope they take most of the staff with them. The whole company is rotten as far as I^m concerned.

Well that will be brilliant, all the trained First staff will lose their jobs and several thousand new people can step straight into their shoes and do the job a lot better !!!!

hmmmm - that training that they've had obviously made little impression on some. If they can't, or are unable to apply that, then yes, they are unfit for their job & should be replaced.

I realise what I said may have been a little rude. I know of no other industry where this would be allowed to happen. It^s not the first time I^ve had to deal with rude staff, and FGW seem worse than most. There are some good ones, but mostly they really are bad. I have never been made to feel like a customer and at points even a human being! If I was rude to start with id say I get what I deserve but I^m not.

Looking at the real time PPM (Public Performance Measure) on the internal system FGW are at 93% for the day and at 95% for the last 2 hours (16:03)

It is SET SWT FCC that are having a bad day today all under 85%

Can you try not to put all First staff in the same basket as people worthy of losing jobs please, hardly a nice thing to say.

Thanks.

He did correct himself before you posted, Ollie

hornbeam did - a little bit (have highlighted the bit stands out in bold)


jester hasn't and this is what I was mostly referring to:

I read Jester's reply as tongue-in-cheek and so somewhat supportive of staff - funny how the same post can come across in different ways ... let's ask by p.m.

I've met a couple of real "corkers" in my time ... but that's very occasional and I can't think of any recently.  On the other hand, FGW has some fantastic staff on the job and I / we really appreciate them.   That's not just because some may happen to know me / my forum connections and treat me different - they do it for everyone.   I don't know what's going to happen at franchise change time, but the operational staff are good for the 90% + and, goodness, don't even suggest their wholesale replacement.

I would have read it as tongue in cheek if had left off the final bit about new people coming to do the job better.

Potentially I've read too much into it and that is probably as I see it as aimed at myself or a colleague and don't see the funny side of it.

Must confess Ollie mate, I read Jester's comment as sheer sarcasm - I actually assumed s/he was a FGW employee!

I can see now how the statement is very much open to being interpreted literally though and speaking as a forum moderator, would like to offer my apologies to yourself and any other employees reading this for some of the comments made on this public platform for which I accept partial responsibility.

Frustration sadly often comes out as anger and whilst I'm the first to defend freedom of speech and the right for everyone to express themselves, people do sometimes need a little help in getting across the point they are really trying to make - hence Graham's offer to intervene with a private message or two.

I was caught up in this fiasco (and a 25 min delay going into London am) .  Ended up getting the HEx and a shared taxi to Reading to get round the problem. 

Personally, I thought staff at Padd did a reasonable job of keeping people informed (there was clearly a limit to the amount of information they knew themselves)  although the Tannoy announcements were very hard to hear.  Either the hardware is rubbish or a mumbler has been chosen to be the announcer

Does anyone know if I'll get a refund?

Hmmm - vandalism is usually excluded.

But we all know you're very good at your job Ollie... ;D ;D

Apologies if anyone was upset, and yes it was a little sarcastic. But yes, its unfair to tar all the employees with the same brush. I too have met some great members of staff on a day to day basis, but  'down-feeding' of info sometimes frustrates them and then they may be a bit different.

Thanks for the replies.

I apologise for not taking it how it was intended :)

Ollie,

    I didn^t wish to cause offence.

    Personally over a period of time I^ve dealt with more unpleasant than pleasant staff. This includes gate staff at Reading, Drivers and Reading platform staff. I get annoyed that many times after trying to engage and be friendly I just get meet with a blank face, and if I treated my customers like I^ve been treated I^d have been sacked long ago. It didn^t help that a few months ago when I did complain about a conductor, the reply that came back was a copy a paste job saying how they were sorry how I found the driver rude.

I have also seen firsthand the ^ tough deal with it altitude^ from management. I^m not saying every member of staff is bad, far from it, but what I am saying is my own experiences have hardly been great and I feel the industry as a whole is terrible with customer service. That said, a few customers could do with a change of attitude too. It also seems, no matter who the TOC is, when there is a problem information just breaks down completely.

I have only once had to complain about a member of FGW staff at Reading. That was a few years ago and that was concerning the use of the lift even though I had a valid train ticket. (For those who don't know it is possible to avoid the ticket barrier by using the lifts thus they are monitored by CCTV.)

Other than that I have never had any member of staff be rude to me or to anyone else in my hearing.

Where they do fall down is by omission if you like. When things go wrong they do not seem to have the information to assist. Whether that is because there is no information to be had or they haven't been motivated enough to go and seek it I don't know.

There are bad apples in every barrel but my experience is generally a good one when it comes to FGW staff.

IME the on train staff are usually polite and helpfull, with rare exceptions.
Station staff are often less polite and/or less helpfull, though remember that station staff may not be FGW.

I have however seen numerous examples of unreasonable customer expectations, including "why is the taxi queue so long" and "the beer is too expensive in the station pub, typical FGW rip off"
AFAIK FGW cant control either the supply of taxis or the price of beer, which was reasonable in any case.

As regards delays, information provision could be improved, as could facilities for those delayed.
An unavoidable delay of say an hour, seems much longer on a windswept platform without toilets, shelter, or refreshments, than it does with these facilities.