Title: Ukraine railways (merged posts) Post by: Chris from Nailsea on October 12, 2010, 18:29:32 From the BBC (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-11522009):
Quote At least 42 people have been killed and nine people hurt in a collision between a train and a small bus in eastern Ukraine, officials say. The incident happened near the town of Marhanets, south of the main regional city of Dnipropetrovsk. The inter-city passenger bus tried to cross the track, ignoring the warning of an approaching train, reports said. Some of the injured are in a critical condition and the death toll could rise. Railway officials said all the casualties were on the bus. The ministry of the interior said the train had dragged the bus for 30 metres after the collision. "The driver of the bus broke traffic laws by driving through a red light before colliding with the train," a spokeswoman for the regional traffic police told the Agence France-Presse news agency. "It's utter carnage there." The Transport Minister Kostyantyn Yefymenko is quoted in several Ukrainian news agencies recounting what survivors have already been saying to investigators. "The bus was standing still," said Mr Yefymenko, "and the driver was standing near the bus, then he got in and started driving right before the locomotive." This, he said, was despite passengers warning the driver that the alarm lights were flashing. President Viktor Yanukovych has ordered law enforcement agencies to carry out a detailed investigation to establish who was responsible for the accident. But the Prime Minister Mykola Azarov said he thought authorities should install automatic crossing gates anyway. "It is not worth saving on human lives," said Mr Azarov. Ukraine has a bad safety record due to the poor condition of many roads and drivers who regularly flout the rules. The president conveyed his condolences to the relatives of the victims and has declared Wednesday a national day of mourning. Title: Ukraine railways (merged posts) Post by: Bmblbzzz on November 12, 2020, 09:42:55 In a forest park near Kharkiv there is a narrow gauge, but "full size", railway run by children/teenagers as platform staff, signallers, driver's assistants etc. The railway is 3.6km long with two stations, called imaginatively Park and Forest Park, and one intermediate platform. It has two trains, each with a diesel locomotive and consisting of six carriages. One of the sets of carriages was built in Poland, the other I think is of Soviet construction (with the Polish one being of similar age).
The children's railway was opened on 8 November 1940 and normally runs throughout the summer (I think from 1 April to end of September). For its 70th anniversary, a museum was opened. And the purpose of the railway, apart from being an attraction in the park, is to train and encourage interest among children in railway careers. That's the essence of what I was able to glean from this website https://www.pz.gov.ua/dept/100062?lid=2 using my rusty Cyrillic and knowledge of other Slavonic languages. If you run it through google translate you'll probably be able to correct some mistakes I've made! (https://www.pz.gov.ua/dept/dosug/img/mju_11.jpg) (https://www.pz.gov.ua/dept/dosug/img/mju_02.jpg) Title: Re: Railway run by children, Ukraine Post by: broadgage on November 12, 2020, 13:29:57 Interesting, I presume that the actual driving is done by adults, but there is no real reason why sensible children cant perform most other roles.
A lot of maintenance and repair work could be done by older children, but I suspect that the more dangerous worshop machinery and hazerdous chemicals are restricted to adults. Signalling is presumably interlocked to protect against human error. And we should remember that within living memory, that 14 year olds worked on UK railways, they were called apprentices and not children then. It is alleged that rural signal boxes where left in the charge of the signalmens children at times, at least up to the last war. Title: Re: Railway run by children, Ukraine Post by: Bmblbzzz on November 12, 2020, 17:36:23 Yes, the driving, if I understood correctly, is done by adults but the children ? and they're teenagers really ? act as "driver's assistants" which presumably is something like an apprentice.
On the general subject of child labour, I've been reading Mary Beard's SPQR, in which she says of child labour in the Roman Empire that it was universal and not regarded as any sort of problem, in fact it would not even be recognised as a category. And she adds in parentheses that even today it's almost exclusively a Western concept. Title: Re: Railway run by children, Ukraine Post by: grahame on November 12, 2020, 20:17:10 Yes, the driving, if I understood correctly, is done by adults but the children ? and they're teenagers really ? act as "driver's assistants" which presumably is something like an apprentice. On the general subject of child labour, I've been reading Mary Beard's SPQR, in which she says of child labour in the Roman Empire that it was universal and not regarded as any sort of problem, in fact it would not even be recognised as a category. And she adds in parentheses that even today it's almost exclusively a Western concept. People respond to how they are treated from quite an early age and by holding back on letting young people take responsibility for things those older haven't the courage to trust them with. I am not advocating sending 6 year olds up chimneys or 8 year olds down the mines but I do support giving young people responsibility; yes, I did the "with my own children" test for that - really proud when they stepped out, worked in a none-exploited way, planned, travelled, cooked for themselves (very occasionally showing they know how to clean their rooms too). When we had a team working for us ... my goodness, the young ones could run rings around me on most of the hotel things; proud, very proud, of them. The biggest problems - and we had a number over the years - were "helicopter parents", where I have a number of tales I could tell. Many parents in the UK, and many organisations, could do well with giving more real responsibilities ... sadly, there are rules around that hold back and frustrate the bright and keen ones. Title: Re: Railway run by children, Ukraine Post by: Jamsdad on November 13, 2020, 15:50:50 Interesting!
There is another "childrens railway" in Budapest. This was set up Hunarian Railways as `sort of training railway for youngsters aspiring to work on the railway. I visited it a few years ago. it was staffed by children but the drivers were adults. I think it was "One engine in Steam" so the chances of a collision were very low! A very enjoyable afternoon trundling through the Hungarian countryside as I recall. Title: Re: Railway run by children, Ukraine Post by: Surrey 455 on November 13, 2020, 20:58:32 I am sure that I saw one of these railways featured on either Tony Robinson or Chris Tarrant's railways programmes. I can't find anything on Google to confirm this though.
Title: Re: Railway run by children, Ukraine Post by: infoman on November 14, 2020, 16:44:18 When I was in Lviv a few years ago,what an experience the short bus trip was.
The driver could drive the bus, talk on the phone, listen to the radio, issue bus tickets and take monies and give change. Title: Re: Railway run by children, Ukraine Post by: RichardB on November 16, 2020, 12:03:00 Interesting! There is another "childrens railway" in Budapest. This was set up Hunarian Railways as `sort of training railway for youngsters aspiring to work on the railway. I visited it a few years ago. it was staffed by children but the drivers were adults. I think it was "One engine in Steam" so the chances of a collision were very low! A very enjoyable afternoon trundling through the Hungarian countryside as I recall. I've been on the one in Budapest too. It's easy to get to from the City Centre. A nice thing to do. Title: Re: Railway run by children, Ukraine Post by: Worcester_Passenger on November 16, 2020, 14:24:45 Agree about the one in Budapest. It's supposed to be the world's largest Children's Railway - 11.2 km long. Definitely not "one engine in steam" when we visited - two trains, one of them steam-hauled.
And the southern terminus is a short walk from the upper terminus of the Budapest Cog-wheel Railway, a rack line. Which, when we visited, was operating as rail replacement buses. Budapest's public transport is diligently signed in both Hungarian and English, but the rail replacement bus was, alas, only in Hungarian. Fortunately I read Bus fluently. Title: Re: Railway run by children, Ukraine Post by: Trowres on November 16, 2020, 22:04:13 I am sure that I saw one of these railways featured on either Tony Robinson or Chris Tarrant's railways programmes. I can't find anything on Google to confirm this though. The Budapest one was featured in the 1980 series of Great Railway Journeys, in an episode called Changing Trains. This episode was also notable for featuring the APT. Title: Re: Railway run by children, Ukraine Post by: johnneyw on November 16, 2020, 22:33:33 The Budapest one was featured in the 1980 series of Great Railway Journeys, in an episode called Changing Trains. I wonder if any of the young staff in that episode are now parents of the current crew? Title: Re: Railway run by children, Ukraine Post by: Timmer on November 22, 2020, 21:03:43 Scary, just been watching Travelman 48 hours in Budapest on Dave and what should appear but the railway run by Children.
Title: Ukraine railways (merged posts) Post by: grahame on February 24, 2022, 18:39:36 From WikiPedia (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ukrainian_Railways)
Quote Ukrainian Railways (Ukrainian: Укрзалізниця, Ukrzaliznytsia) is a state-owned joint-stock company of rail transport in Ukraine, a monopoly that controls the vast majority of the railroad transportation in the country.[nb 1] It possesses a combined total track length of over 23,000 km, making it the 13th largest in the world. Ukrainian Railways is also the world's 6th largest rail passenger transporter and world's 7th largest freight transporter. We have a thread running (here) (http://www.firstgreatwestern.info/26027) in our "And Also" (http://www.firstgreatwestern.info/b45) area for frequent posters on wider issues in Ukraine, where every member who has posted a number of times on public tops is welcome to contribute. Here on the main public forum, in "The Wider Picture Overseas (http://www.firstgreatwestern.info/b52), members are welcome to post on public transport issues that they feel may be of interest from around the world - and that includes from Ukraine. I hope that we have nothing to report which is directly or indirectly a report of war and its effect, but should such things need reporting, please do so. Title: Ukraine railways (merged posts) Post by: stuving on September 14, 2022, 11:06:30 MSF have used trains to move patients out of overloaded hospitals in the east of Ukraine from early on. But they needed to move patients needing higher levels of care, so with Ukrainian Railways they designed and built a new train. As reported, it took just 23 days to build a train with ICU beds, and a generators and oxygen generator on board!
Quote People referred on the train are mostly either long-term hospitalized patients or recent war-wounded who need post-operative care following traumatic injuries. Of more than 600 patients transported and cared for on MSF’s medical train over two months, 355 were injured as a direct result of the war. The overwhelming majority of these patients suffered blast injuries. And 11 percent of war-related trauma patients were younger than 18, and 30 percent older than 60. (https://img.msf.org/Doc_Prod/TR1/4/1/0/f/MSB127237.jpg?d63790727202) The medical team inside the ICU of the MSF medical train monitor and stabilize a seriously war-wounded patient during the journey from Pokvrosk, eastern Ukraine to Lviv, in western Ukraine. The journey took approximately 20 hours. Further reports from MSF on their web site (https://www.msf.org/war-ukraine), for example from April (https://www.msf.org/you-have-medical-train-i-have-patients-you), and a longer article in the latest issue of their magazine Dispatches (https://msf.org.uk/sites/default/files/2022-09/48078_54971_MSF%20UK%20Dispatches%20Magazine_WEB.pdf). Title: Re: MSF hospital trains in Ukraine Post by: broadgage on September 14, 2022, 12:27:23 Very impressive, in particular the amount of space available if compared to the hospital trains of the last war. Standard looking wheeled hospital beds rather than fixed bunks. On board oxygen production rather than being reliant on cylinders of limited capacity.
And how many hospital trains does the UK have available in case of war or other emergency ? Title: Re: MSF hospital trains in Ukraine Post by: IndustryInsider on September 14, 2022, 12:48:24 And how many hospital trains does the UK have available in case of war or other emergency ? None. But as we demonstrated with the nightingale hospitals during the pandemic, if there was an major emergency then I’m pretty sure we could convert an existing train in a similar amount of time. That’s if such a facility was needed, as the transportation distances for the wounded would be far less than what the Ukrainian’s are facing. Title: Re: MSF hospital trains in Ukraine Post by: Witham Bobby on September 14, 2022, 12:50:13 Very impressive, in particular the amount of space available if compared to the hospital trains of the last war. Standard looking wheeled hospital beds rather than fixed bunks. On board oxygen production rather than being reliant on cylinders of limited capacity. And how many hospital trains does the UK have available in case of war or other emergency ? Built to a much bigger loading gauge than British coaching stock And I don't think there's much spare coaching stock anywhere in the system these days. Unless you count heritage railways and the Royal Train Title: Re: MSF hospital trains in Ukraine Post by: TaplowGreen on September 14, 2022, 16:58:34 Very impressive, in particular the amount of space available if compared to the hospital trains of the last war. Standard looking wheeled hospital beds rather than fixed bunks. On board oxygen production rather than being reliant on cylinders of limited capacity. And how many hospital trains does the UK have available in case of war or other emergency ? Under what scenario could hospital trains possibly be needed in the UK? Title: Re: MSF hospital trains in Ukraine Post by: grahame on September 14, 2022, 17:23:43 Under what scenario could hospital trains possibly be needed in the UK? The art of thinking about the unthinkable? From rail.co.uk (http://www.rail.co.uk/rail-news/2015/dunkirk-75-years-on/) Quote A look at the Dunkirk Dynamo rail operations 75 years ago How the railways evacuated 300,000 troops from Channel Ports The United Kingdom and France have just celebrated the 75th anniversary of ‘The miracle of Dunkirk’, the evacuation over several days of 300,000 troops from the British Expeditionary Force (BEF) in France back to the English Channel ports. But what part did the railways play in this epic event 75 years ago? To start with, the BEF was conveyed under planned arrangements to the Channel Ports for embarkation by train as were nine Ambulance trains out of the 25 such trains that existed at that time I dread to think of wounded troops returning in the future ... Title: Re: MSF hospital trains in Ukraine Post by: broadgage on September 14, 2022, 18:18:18 AFAIK, the only other trains with on board oxygen production equipment are those used on this extreme altitude line in China, https://www.railway-technology.com/projects/china-tibet/#:~:text=With%20its%20highest%20point%20at,plateau%20railway%20in%20the%20world. (https://www.railway-technology.com/projects/china-tibet/#:~:text=With%20its%20highest%20point%20at,plateau%20railway%20in%20the%20world.)
In that case the oxygen is not for hospital purposes but for ordinary passengers to breath, as the air is too thin to reliably sustain life. A fit person could survive, but not the average rail passenger. Title: Re: MSF hospital trains in Ukraine Post by: broadgage on September 14, 2022, 18:25:36 Very impressive, in particular the amount of space available if compared to the hospital trains of the last war. Standard looking wheeled hospital beds rather than fixed bunks. On board oxygen production rather than being reliant on cylinders of limited capacity. And how many hospital trains does the UK have available in case of war or other emergency ? Under what scenario could hospital trains possibly be needed in the UK? Terrorist nuclear weapon used in London or other major urban center. Very large scale terrorist attack with thousands of casualties. Large natural disaster such as flooding worse than the East Coast floods of 1953, with hospitals in worst affected areas under water. Title: Re: MSF hospital trains in Ukraine Post by: Bmblbzzz on September 14, 2022, 20:09:53 23 days! In Britain they wouldn't have got to GRIP level 1 in that time!
Title: Re: MSF hospital trains in Ukraine Post by: TaplowGreen on September 14, 2022, 20:20:20 Under what scenario could hospital trains possibly be needed in the UK? The art of thinking about the unthinkable? From rail.co.uk (http://www.rail.co.uk/rail-news/2015/dunkirk-75-years-on/) Quote A look at the Dunkirk Dynamo rail operations 75 years ago How the railways evacuated 300,000 troops from Channel Ports The United Kingdom and France have just celebrated the 75th anniversary of ‘The miracle of Dunkirk’, the evacuation over several days of 300,000 troops from the British Expeditionary Force (BEF) in France back to the English Channel ports. But what part did the railways play in this epic event 75 years ago? To start with, the BEF was conveyed under planned arrangements to the Channel Ports for embarkation by train as were nine Ambulance trains out of the 25 such trains that existed at that time I dread to think of wounder troops returning in the future ... I think one thing you can be pretty sure of is that their return wouldn't be by sea to the Channel Ports in future. Title: Re: MSF hospital trains in Ukraine Post by: stuving on September 14, 2022, 22:32:19 23 days! In Britain they wouldn't have got to GRIP level 1 in that time! That was my first thought. Except... If you have your mind concentrated by something is big, scary, and previously unimaginable as Putin's malign scheming has visited on Ukraine, I think you'll be surprised by what you can achieve. We all know when that last happened here, and some pretty amazing things were done in response - not least in keeping the railways running. While the railways' culture may now be less can-do than it was before that war, I don't see why the response would be so much different today. Title: Ukraine railways (merged posts) Post by: infoman on January 22, 2023, 06:44:09 shown on Sky news at 06:39am ish on Sunday morning how the engineer keeps those big engines going.
Should be on i-player some where. Title: Re: Sky news item on Ukraine trains Post by: ChrisB on January 22, 2023, 17:44:02 No it isn't as Sky News isn't a BBC channel, nor does Sky have any equivalent for Sky News.
Title: Re: Sky news item on Ukraine trains Post by: infoman on January 22, 2023, 19:04:46 What are you on about?
If you don't like my posting/s don't read them 45 "looks" and one negative comment,I rest my case. Suggest you put me on your ignore list, if this facility is available on this message board. Title: Re: Sky news item on Ukraine trains Post by: ChrisB on January 22, 2023, 20:58:41 I read your post which referred to this piece being on i-player.
That is a BBC product which only has BBC content, not Sky. So I was advising others from trying to find it, not commenting on your info Title: Re: Sky news item on Ukraine trains Post by: grahame on January 22, 2023, 21:42:54 Suggest you put me on your ignore list, if this facility is available on this message board. There IS an ignore list on this forum, though it only works for personal messages. Just five members have it as anything other than blank in their profiles, and all of them are long gone. So no-one ignores anyone these days. Probably should not disclose such data, but love it - Utopia !? Edit to add - just noticed that one of the five is just set to ignore himself. Ah - I smiled; love the sense of humour there. Title: Ukraine railways (merged posts) Post by: infoman on February 21, 2023, 18:45:49 feature on BBC1 points west at 18:40pm on tuesday.
available on i-player for 24 hours only. Would any one know how much of the rail lines/bridges/ have been damaged in Ukraine Always think of my trip to Ukraine in the summer 2012 from the border with Poland at Przemyśl to lviv and onto kiev Title: A Year of War in Ukraine: The New Railway Age Post by: CyclingSid on February 21, 2023, 18:45:59 Partly written as a result of President Biden's recent train trip
https://balkaninsight.com/2023/02/21/a-year-of-war-in-ukraine-the-new-railway-age/ (https://balkaninsight.com/2023/02/21/a-year-of-war-in-ukraine-the-new-railway-age/) Plans to overcome the difference in gauge Quote The plans are to build the new high-speed link on the existing Warsaw-Lviv-Kyiv route, adapting it to the European gauge width of 1435 mm in order to carry trains moving at speeds of up to 250 kilometres per hour. although I don't think it will be in time to materially affect the current conflict.And the Presidential train https://gdb.rferl.org/01000000-0aff-0242-f5f0-08db138eafa3_w1023_s.jpg (https://gdb.rferl.org/01000000-0aff-0242-f5f0-08db138eafa3_w1023_s.jpg) https://gdb.rferl.org/01000000-0aff-0242-e30c-08db138c570f_w1023_s.jpg (https://gdb.rferl.org/01000000-0aff-0242-e30c-08db138c570f_w1023_s.jpg) Title: Re: Ukraine rail engineers at Lydney Post by: CyclingSid on February 21, 2023, 19:00:33 I am not sure Ukraine Railways would say, and Russian figures couldn't be trusted.
BBC news https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-gloucestershire-64706057 (https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-gloucestershire-64706057) Basically an updated version of the Bailey bridge. Title: Re: Ukraine rail engineers at Lydney Post by: Electric train on February 22, 2023, 07:05:56 There have been internal requests to identify any redundant equipment that has no future operational use that could be released to assist the Ukraine
Title: Re: Ukraine rail engineers at Lydney Post by: TaplowGreen on February 22, 2023, 09:46:15 There have been internal requests to identify any redundant equipment that has no future operational use that could be released to assist the Ukraine Could they use Mick Lynch for anything? Title: No P-codes in Ukraine ? Post by: Clan Line on February 22, 2023, 10:53:06 (https://i.postimg.cc/hGqtLFhy/2023-02-22-09-09-12.jpg) (https://postimages.org/)
Today's Telegraph Title: Re: Ukraine rail engineers at Lydney Post by: eightonedee on February 22, 2023, 17:17:47 Quote Could they use Mick Lynch for anything? I thought he was a prominent apologist for Putin. They may be tempted to answer something impolite - or worse. Title: Re: Ukraine rail engineers at Lydney Post by: TaplowGreen on February 22, 2023, 20:41:53 Quote Could they use Mick Lynch for anything? I thought he was a prominent apologist for Putin. They may be tempted to answer something impolite - or worse. That's true. The Leadership of both the RMT and ASLEF (for some reason) seem to be notable for the Putin apologists amongst them. Title: Ukraine railways (merged posts) Post by: eXPassenger on February 24, 2023, 16:48:24 When Alexander Kamyshin, has finished his job of moving VIPs he may be the ideal candidate for head of GBR.
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2023/feb/24/how-ukraine-railways-keeps-people-and-presidents-moving Quote ‘Rail Force One’: how Ukraine railways got Joe Biden safely to Kyiv Alexander Kamyshin, head of the service, doesn’t get much sleep, but his team coordinated the president’s visit without a single leak Alexander Kamyshin, the head of Ukraine’s railway company Ukrzaliznytsia, doesn’t get much sleep at the best of times. On Sunday night, as Joe Biden was being ferried into Ukraine in a 10-hour night journey from Poland – in a carriage now known as “Rail Force One”, he got almost none. Along with others involved in the secret operation to bring the US president to his meeting with Volodymyr Zelenskiy, Kamyshin watched the progress of the train in a command centre. A handsome bearded man sporting a hipster-ish braid of hair that falls over the shaved sides of his head, Kamyshin is deliberately vague about many of the details. But in the past year, his dedicated team has brought in world leaders, VIPs and diplomatic missions on an almost daily basis as part of a programme called “Iron Diplomacy”. Security is everything, he told the Guardian in an interview at Kyiv’s main railway station. “We have not had one leak. There have been no photographs from train attendants. We respect the confidence of the delegations. “It’s not a challenge. It’s our job that we do every day. Imagine,” he says with smile, “the president of the United States coming to a war-torn country by train. “The challenge is treat the delegations properly because, like Biden, they spend more time on the train than they do in Kyiv. He spent 20 hours on the train and four hours in Kyiv. Everyone knows Ukrainians are brave. We also want them to know that we are welcoming.” ... Title: Ukrainian Railway photo essay Post by: Bmblbzzz on April 20, 2023, 11:20:08 Quote (https://i.guim.co.uk/img/media/e9f3a5ec14e620a4bfaf1c8ada0d122d474c85e7/0_0_6686_4462/master/6686.jpg?width=1900&quality=85&dpr=1&s=none) https://www.theguardian.com/artanddesign/2023/apr/20/iron-people-ukraines-railway-network-in-a-time-of-war-photo-essayTwo institutions have played a crucial role in thwarting Russia’s plan to conquer Ukraine. One is the Ukrainian army. It successfully defended the capital, Kyiv, and has recaptured large swathes of territory seized last year by Moscow in the north-east and south. Another counteroffensive looms. The second – surprisingly, perhaps – is Ukraine’s railway. Edit to make the picture fit on (my) screen! - grahame Title: "How Ukraine’s Trains Are Adapting to War" Post by: Mark A on September 02, 2023, 18:12:54 A sobering read.
Mark https://foreignpolicy.com/2023/08/27/ukraine-railway-infrastructure-war-russia/ (https://foreignpolicy.com/2023/08/27/ukraine-railway-infrastructure-war-russia/) Title: Re: "How Ukraine’s Trains Are Adapting to War" Post by: Bmblbzzz on September 03, 2023, 21:12:38 Interesting and, yes, sobering, on many levels.
Title: Re: "How Ukraine’s Trains Are Adapting to War" Post by: Bmblbzzz on September 05, 2023, 18:07:50 Gotta say I'd probably quite like an Ukrzaliznytsia hoody or t-shirt, if they were available in the UK. Well, they probably are available in some form, but I wouldn't buy one cos the funds probably wouldn't go where they should. Perhaps the Coffee Shop should send an intrepid explorer to Ukraine to buy a load and bring back. Or perhaps not.
Title: Re: "How Ukraine’s Trains Are Adapting to War" Post by: TaplowGreen on September 05, 2023, 20:18:49 Perhaps something for Messrs Lynch and Dempsey to consider given their own views on the Russian invasion of Ukraine & the company the latter has been known to keep.
Title: Article: 'A train journey through Ukraine' Post by: Mark A on February 25, 2024, 11:09:31 It's less than forty eight hours since, in the UK's west country, rail services came to a halt as a result of the discovery of a large and malevolant device, a gift from fascism, dropped among Victorian terraced housing just a few generations back and overlooked during what may have been a night of far greater chaos. With this in mind it was unsettling to come across a long read about a rail journey across the width of Ukraine, the people met along the way and reflect on how close all this is, how fragile our politics.
Mark https://www.theguardian.com/world/2024/feb/24/a-train-through-ukraine-a-journey-into-the-stories-of-two-years-of-war (https://www.theguardian.com/world/2024/feb/24/a-train-through-ukraine-a-journey-into-the-stories-of-two-years-of-war) This page is printed from the "Coffee Shop" forum at http://gwr.passenger.chat which is provided by a customer of Great Western Railway. Views expressed are those of the individual posters concerned. Visit www.gwr.com for the official Great Western Railway website. Please contact the administrators of this site if you feel that content provided contravenes our posting rules ( see http://railcustomer.info/1761 ). The forum is hosted by Well House Consultants - http://www.wellho.net |