Great Western Coffee Shop

Lets have comments please.

This is how I understand things are.

Let's say I go to Derby Station make all arrangements to Travel 2 days later, on the 08.28 XC from Derby to Exeter St David arr 11.46 then transfer with asssistance to the 12.09 Exeter to Bodmin Parkway due 13.48

I've paid ^70.30 for a Railcard discount open ticket, however on my journey West, at Exeter I'm not allowed to board the 12.09 but am put on the 12.45 to Plymouth arr 13.43

I can't then leave Plymouth untill 19.00 arriving Bodmin at 19.35 almost 6hours late.

What is my SIN?

XC Only ticket

No it's a fully open ticket! Valid all TOC'S

Odd, got me baffled as you didn't travel on fgw

Yep got me stuck on that one, as pointed out, ^70.30 is the Anytime Single fare..so I'm stumped.

What do you mean you weren't allowed to board? Were there RPIs at every door? Why didn't you get on?

I'm guessing that the assistance bit is a clue, although I'm still a bit stumped about exactly what's going on!

Your original train so packed you couldn't get on so had to wait for next one?

And then miss the 3 following HSTs to Penzance?

your on a mobility scooter!

Smokey, I don't think we've got the full story from you. I think you're being economical with the facts - and I'm going to be similarly economic with any opinions I express. It looks rather to me that something went wrong - I don't know what it was - and it impacted your journey, but it would be foolish for me (or anyone else with only the selection of facts you've chosen to give) to say if it was right, wrong, reasonable, unreasonable, major travesty or storm in a cuppa!

i'm 99% sure my answer was correct, XC will carry mobility scooters, FGW dont!

Ooh that didn't occur to me, but that does make sense for a reason.

I agree with vacman - I think that's the answer.  There, that's the remaining 1%!

CfN.  ;) :D ;D

That's the Issue as I understand it FGW have banned carrying Mobility Scooters But XC and other TOC's will carry them.

This should be sorted out by ATOC.

They're not banned, but must be collapsed and loaded into the gurds van by the user or their carer, most of these scooters are too heavy for the ramps and therfore the TOC's that do take them risk being heavilly sued if anything happens!

Where do you wish to put them on a HST

Can you even get through the door?  Would you be willing to sit in the luggage/guards van

and no, I'm not being confrontational .............. my mother is disabled so I ,know what its like to travel being disabled but dis-abled means LESS ABLED  you cannot expect to do everything you want to do when you want

In 8 years of FC FGW travel I have seen 1 disabled FC pax  but there is a space there just in case

You cannot lay this at ATOCs door, I'd suggest.

FGW's HSTs are 35 year old, XC's Voyager's conform to a totally different set of accessibility standards.  But even the TOCs that do accept mobility scooters have to have some sort of size/weight limit.  I suppose that could be standardised, but only as required to fit the RVAR compatible rolling stock, no greater.

Paul

XC policy on wheelchairs and mobility scooters from the DPPP:

All our trains can carry manual or powered wheelchairs, but these need to be within the following dimensional and weight limitations:
Summary of wheelchair accomodation limitations
Dimension   Value
Width   700 millimetres
Length (including footplates)   1200 millimetres
Height (including customer)   1350 millimetres
Weight (including customer)   300 kilograms
Unfortunately many of the larger powered scooters cannot be conveyed on CrossCountry due to their weight, dimensions and manoeuvrability. However users of models with a small triangular footprint may be able to obtain access. You should seek advice from the JourneyCare reservation service. Users with models which can be folded down into lightweight manageable components may take their scooter onto the train as luggage. Customers or a travelling companion will need to be able to carry the folded scooter on or off the train.

Seems to me a fundamental question needs to asked when people buy mobility scooters - 'Will you ever want to take this on a train?' 

Nearly all the debates I've seen in various forums about 'wheelchair bans' seem to end up actually involving large scooters.

Paul

Surprised you can get a scooter on a Voyagers.  there is seldom room for standing passengers. 

The "scooter bans" seem to me to be reasonable.  Either it is because the doors are too small, there is no space or because access involves using a ramp which is too steep (most scooters are not safe on more tha a 5% slope as stated in their instruction booklet)

Disabled access should be about making an effort to accomodate people, not any vehicle that they may choose to use. Able-bodied people face restrictions on what they can carry on board (limits on bikes, large cases etc) which are imposed fopr very similar reasons of safety and practicality.     

AIUI, everyone who uses a scooter could use an electric wheelchair or a smaller scooter.  Not ATOCs fault if the customer chooses to buy the "wrong scooter". 
 

I'm trying to think of a precedent for ATOC sorting out an issue and failing...

Passengers are not allowed to travel in the guards van, basicly scooters must be folded and taken as luggage.

Going back to my original post. I never said I'd made this journey!
I'd become aware of a passenger being sent a long distance by Taxi with his Mobility Scooter (paid for by FGW) after being carried by both XC & FGW services down into the west somewhere.

(S)HE couldn't make his return journey because the Station Staff RIGHTLY pointed out that such scooters are not carried. (unless folded, and that customer was Unable to stand unaided let along take a Scooter to bits.)

OK, I understand that Wheelchairs & Electric Wheelchairs (up to a Size limit) ARE carried by all TOC's but there NEEDS to be a clear ALL TOC Ruling on Mobility Scooters, and yes if they have to be folded put in the Brake Van FINE, but how many Mobility Scooter uses are capable of doing that!

Simples answer really. If the disabled person had of phoned ahead to make advance arrangements, then a member of staff could have been prepared with a wheelchair to aid them onto and off the service so that the mobility scooter could be folded away and stored appropriately. I admit this is not the most fair and conveniant of situations but at least there are things in place to cater for such problems IF staff are made aware

Really folding scooters and putting them in "the Brake Van" is an option only available in HSTs, DVTs and the few loco hauled trains hired in. As such 'vehicles' are likely to be quite heavy and rather bulky where could they be accommodated in units (including Voyagers which have no storage area, well storage for catering supplies!).

Even folding bikes are now restricted to those with wheels under 20" in diameter. Bromptons are OK, of course!!  ;D