Great Western Coffee Shop

One for the silver surfers out there who fancy a rail trip around Ireland.

Iarnrod Eireann and the Irish tourist board have just launched a scheme giving foreign visitors over 66 free travel on all IE and Dublin Dart services, matching a scheme for Irish residents. It's a one-year trial for the moment.

Irish Times story here http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/ireland/2010/0317/1224266441900.html

Details of how to sign up for the offer are here http://www.discoverireland.com/gb/ireland-plan-your-visit/facts/golden-trekker/

I spotted this on the Discover Ireland website.  Seems as though they are trying to attract the "more mature" tourist!


http://www.discoverireland.com/gb/ireland-plan-your-visit/facts/golden-trekker/

Looks like the Irish Government have agreed it's closure! IE are blaming low passenger numbers, well if you only run one train each way per day then people won't use it!

Looks more like the Service can be withdrawn but the line will have to stay????

Mind there are Lines in Ireland that are still OPEN but have been lifted.

From CIE website Saturday 18th September is final day.  :'(

Buses from Monday 20th  >:(

One of the problems with the line was too many manned level crossings.

Agree with vacman only one train a day is not going to encourage much usage.

Me too.

On this side of the water there are 2 trains per day to Fishguard Harbour connecting with the ferry to Rosslare. One of these is in the middle of the night (because the ferry is) so likewise there is effectivly only 1 service for locals to use, which is not very likely to attract said locals. However there are a number of passengers on it, which I suspect is thanks to it connecting with the ferry. I've never set foot on the ferry but a few family members considered a trip to Dublin a while back (which never happened) but I researched the similarlly infrequent service on the Irish side and if I remember right it fails to make any connections (at least with the day ferry) so passengers have a train to Fishguard connecting with a ferry to Rosslare then are left to find car hire/bus/taxi. If Irish Rail actually timed their infrequent service to meet the Fishguard ferry then they may find some passengers.

Not 100% surprised that NRES are still showing the Rosslare to Waterford train at 07.00 Next WEEK.

Four weeks since the Rosslare Waterford passenger sevice was withdrawn and NRES still show the 07.00 Rosslare to Waterford TRAIN.  ;D

from http://www.forgottenrelics.co.uk/tunnels/ireland/index.html

It always struck me (but as an outsider) that this line was such a logical part of the network that it really should not be lost ... has it indeed been mothballed / retained so it could be brought back?    In general, when I last looked any connections at Rosslare to and from Dublin [trains to and from boats] were - err - purely accidental.

Interesting photos there. That tunnel (Snow Hill) is immediately on the west bank of the Barrow railway bridge, Ireland's longest rail bridge.

In an ideal world there would be through trains Rosslare-Waterford-Clonmel-Limerick-Galway.

One of the conditions of suspending the South Wexford rail service imposed by the National Transport Authority (NTA) on Iarnr^d ^ireann (Irish Rail) was that the line be maintained.

There is a robust maintenance programme to ensure the line remains serviceable. This entails the likes of hedge cutting, weedspray and track inspection. In comparison to previous suspensions/closures where lines were generally allowed to become overgrown this set a precedent.

The first few miles of the line out of Waterford city remain in use by several freight trains a week travelling to/from Belview Port (Belview Port is located not much more than a mile west of Snow Hill Tunnel).

The South Wexford line proved invaluable towards the end of 2011 when the Rosslare-Dublin line was severed near Dublin due to flooding in that it allowed rolling stock which would otherwise have been isolated on the Rosslare-Dublin line to go for routine servicing.

Towards the end of this September Railtours Ireland will operate their first ever rail land cruise. It is understood, subject to permission from Iarnr^d ^ireann, this will traverse the South Wexford line:
http://www.railtoursireland.com/train-tour/The-Ireland-8-Day-Rail-Land-Cruise-and-Castle-Tour/st2014/
 (http://www.railtoursireland.com/train-tour/The-Ireland-8-Day-Rail-Land-Cruise-and-Castle-Tour/st2014/)

There are a suite of documents on the NTA website about the South Wexford line including the maintenance contract:
http://www.nationaltransport.ie/public-transport-services/rail/contracts/service-changes/waterford-rosslare-reports/ (http://www.nationaltransport.ie/public-transport-services/rail/contracts/service-changes/waterford-rosslare-reports/)

The Rosslare-Wexford-Wicklow-Dublin line is very scenic as is the Waterford-Clonmel-Limerick Junction line. The South Wexford line is too - while the countryside that the replacement bus route passes through is pleasant the route followed is nowhere near as scenic (or as short) as the rail route.

The current edition of a local newspaper, the Wexford People, reports that the line from Enniscorthy to Rosslare could be at risk of closure.

Extract from article below

Dark days in the Emerald Isle.

Isn't one of the problems that the trains no longer make good connections with the ferries at Rosslare?

Also I believe Rosslare to Waterford line is mothballed and Waterford to Limerick Junction OOU so there is no way by rail from the South West.

Waterford to Limerick Junction was, I recall, closed for a while but there are now 2 trains each way per day:
http://www.irishrail.ie/media/12-waterfordlimerick250920131.pdf?v=gc3u1co

Waterford to Rosslare has indeed been reduced to an engineer's siding.

Whereas connections at Fishguard to and from boats are good, a cynic might tell you that at Rosslare they're designed to fail.  I'm sure that's not quite the case, but I've certainly been put off travelling that route by the absence of a train connection off the afternoon boat from Fishguard to get me into Dublin in the late evening.  Reading more informed commentary here, I now understand that the issue is that Rosslare is on the very end of a long line south from Dublin which is very busy as you get closer to the city with single track capacity issues up there  between Greystones and Bray, and then there are long single track lengths further south too. "More important to look after daily commuters than those remaining ferryists who can't afford a car, and are too awkward to to fly" perhaps?

P.S.  I think it changed / good northbound evening connection for the high summer this year - just not advertised - or was I dreaming?

OK - it is better at the moment

Boat from Fishguard at 02:45, 06:15 to 07:20 at Rosslare, 10:15 into Dublin
Boat from Fishguard at 14:30, 18:00 to 18:35 at Rosslare, 21:44 into Dublin
(previously was 18:00 to 05:35 at Rosslare, 08:46 into Dublin.  May revert at end of summer  :'( )

Train from Dublin at 16:37, 19:25 to 21:00 at Rosslare, 00:15 into Fishguard
Train from Dublin at 18:38, 21:28 to 09:00 next morning at Rosslare, 12:30 into Fishguard

Looks like 3/4 sailings have something approaching connections then, just the 21:28 arrival for a 9am sailing that is totally hopeless.

In addition to those of us taking the train to Rosslare there are a cohort who "park & sail" or are driven to the port and avail of SailRail onwards. SailRail wins over the private car in many instances particularly for a solitary traveller. For example between fuel and fare a trip from Co. Wexford to the Thames Valley/London will amount to several hundred euro whereas a SailRail advance return is just ^92. Secondly driving a car is essentially "down time" and one cannot do any work beyond thinking and listening to the radio. The train & ship option allows meaningful work by way of taking out a laptop or bundle of papers. On the trains here and on the ship there is free wifi. When wifi becomes universal on First Great Western and when it's rolled out on Arriva Trains Wales it will enhance the appeal of the SailRail offering for cross-channel passengers. A third consideration is that the rail timings are quite competitive. Granted a motorist will get to depart the port sooner than a SailRail passenger but this will be negated by the need for a rest break en route/possible congestion. Even the standby SailRail fare is only fractionally higher (^6/^7) whereas air fares can go sky high close to/on the travel date. Waterford Airport offers no flights to London and has no public transport connectivity bar a rural community bus one day a week. Even travelling by air it is necessary to factor in the cost of transport at both sides to make a fair comparison with the train & ship option. The cost of baggage on a flight can be a deciding factor for many. A concluding factor is that modern progressive economies such as Britain and Ireland need a balance in the transport mix rather than over-reliance on one node or mode.

The evening train ex Rosslare will revert to 17.55 from Monday 1st September. A problem is that the window of time between the arrival of the ship (18.00) and train departure is quite tight even in optimal conditions. From the ship coming to a standstill to arriving in the terminal building takes around ten minutes minimum (it's a fair walk along the enclosed elevated walkway between ship & terminal). Sometimes there are security/immigration checks prior to leaving the secure area on the first floor. Some passengers may need to collect baggage. Then there's the walk from the terminal to the station taking the best part of ten minutes. Add in some rain or heavy baggage and it can be seen that even in best conditions (Stena Line generally run a very punctual service) it's a bit of a rush. The connection into and out of the night sailings are much better and allow that necessary "wriggle room" (19.25 train arrival for 21.00 Fishguard sailing; 07.20 train departure out of 06.15 ferry arrival [02.45 ex Fishguard]). It should be noted that the ferry terminal building at Rosslare Europort is closed during the night so an overnight wait will entail accommodation in the village of Rosslare Harbour (there are a number of hotels and B&Bs).

Around a seventh of the length of the South Wexford (Rosslare Strand - Waterford) line is in regular use (several times a week) by freight trains travelling as far as Belview Port from the Waterford city direction. The key traditional catchment area of Rosslare are cities like Cork, Limerick and Waterford as well as towns across the region like Clonmel and Dungarvan. The bus services from Rosslare are not integrated with the onward rail services from Waterford (both the line via Clonmel to Limerick Junction for connections to the south & south west plus the line going north from Waterford via Kilkenny city to Carlow and Kildare). The Waterford-Clonmel-Limerick Junction line was temporarily closed (with replacement buses operating) between October 2003 and September 2004 while repairs were effected to Cahir Viaduct. The line was never out of use (OOU). If anyone comes across any publications stating this please drop them a polite line as it is a serious disservice to have misinformation like this circulating. In more recent years the line has seen significant expenditure with the majority of the permanent way now being continuous welded rail (CWR). It retains semaphore signalling though and the line limit is 50mph. InterCity railcars (ref: http://www.irishrail.ie/about-us/fleet) are the usual rolling stock on the line and the same trains form Dublin-Waterford/Waterford-Dublin trains earlier or later in the day.

From the BBC (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-35292165)




Edit note: Topic heading slightly amended, purely for clarity. CfN.  :)

The National Transport Authority, along with Iarnród Éireann (Irish Rail) and the Minister for Transport, Tourism and Sport Shane Ross, has launched a process of consultation around the Rail Review 2016 Report, which inter alia proposes the closure of several lines as a possible measure to plug the funding gap that has arisen. 

The Rosslare-Gorey section of the Rosslare – Wicklow - Dublin line and the entire Waterford – Clonmel – Limerick Junction line (continuation of the Rosslare - Wellingtonbridge -Waterford line which was suspended in 2010) are mooted for possible closure as are two lines elsewhere in the country.

The consultation remains open till close of business on Wednesday 18th January 2017 and the report and consultation document can be accessed at:
https://www.nationaltransport.ie/consultations/consultation-on-rail-review-2016/  (https://www.nationaltransport.ie/consultations/consultation-on-rail-review-2016/)

Some of my personal thoughts on this are that the report appears to make zero effort to suggest measures to grow business as an alternative to closure yet detailed rail replacement bus timetables are provided! For instance the Waterford – Clonmel – Limerick Junction line is not bookable online and is the only one on the island of Ireland devoid of a Sunday service. Yet large sums have been ploughed into the line in very recent years such that virtually all of the line is now continuous welded rail and the modern InterCity units are now the norm on the line. This route needs to be operated as a through Waterford - Galway service as current connections are very poor/slow:
http://www.irishrail.ie/media/12_waterfordclonmellimk_valid_from_20.11.2016.pdf (http://www.irishrail.ie/media/12_waterfordclonmellimk_valid_from_20.11.2016.pdf)

Past closures/suspensions have not yielded exciting savings and even if all four line/line sections mentioned in the report are closed the savings are still rather meagre as there will still be a cost for maintenance and replacement public service obligation (PSO) buses.

Separately extensive efforts are being made to grow railfreight so in the instance that Rosslare-Gorey is closed to passengers that should not mean that any future freight flow is also condemned.

In my view CIÉ's "heart" has never been in rail in the South East of Ireland.

Yikes - this is potentially highly significant ... Thank you for bringing this to our attention. Oh - my - god.  What a mess (as least that's how it comes across from the report ...).   I've started a rather longer comment I'll post in the morning.

A few further pertinent facts:

Of the four lines/sections suggested for closure viz (in order of risk):
1.   Ballybrophy – Roscrea – Nenagh – Limerick
2.   Waterford – Clonmel – Tipperary – Limerick Junction
3.   Ennis – Gort – Athenry
4.   Gorey – Enniscorthy – Wexford – Rosslare Strand & Rosslare Europort
it is apparent that both lines 1 & 2 are at a higher risk of potential closer than 3 & 4. Of the Rosslare line the report states “Similarly the Gorey to Rosslare line closure would impact on a large number of passengers.” (p. 43)

Then there is the million euro question as to whether any meaningful effort has ever been made to automate the numerous staffed level crossings on the two County Tipperary lines (1 & 2 in list) or seek funding for same.

Next there’s the curious situation of PSO bus routes (i.e. subsidised with public monies) introduced during this year on which certain journeys are timed at more or less the same time as rail services…

Bus route 355: Waterford – Carrick-on-Suir – Clonmel – Cahir (reconfigured route 367 bus route but extended beyond Clonmel to Cahir). Operated by Bus Éireann.

Bus route 387: Rosslare Europort – Rosslare Strand – Killinick – Wexford (brand new route). Operated by Wexford Local Link.

Granted both routes serve a number of villages which are no longer on the rail network like Kilsheelan near Clonmel and Killinick (just off the N25 Rosslare-Wexford road) which had a station on the Rosslare-Waterford line till the 1970s.

The report is bizarre in many respects even referring to long closed lines no longer in the company’s ownership.

Closure makes little financial logic because both the revenue and subsidy is then lost. Furthermore redundancy also has to be paid out and headquarters/centralised costs are unchanged but are spread out over a smaller network.

An important and related aspect is that Irish Rail wish to abandon the Rosslare-Waterford line:
http://www.irishexaminer.com/ireland/iarnrod-eireann-seeks-to-permanently-axe-10-closed-lines-430881.html (http://www.irishexaminer.com/ireland/iarnrod-eireann-seeks-to-permanently-axe-10-closed-lines-430881.html)
The report refers to the fact there is no funding provided for maintaining structures like bridges on closed and abandoned lines and Rosslare - Waterford would broadly fall into the former category.

On the plus side things may not be as dire as they seem as an additional €31 million euro subvention for public transport was announced in October and some of this will go to Irish Rail.

And it should be noted that SailRail traffic to/from Rosslare even on a quiet day can contribute around 100 passengers onto GWR.  I’m reluctant to mention figures because they in fact fluctuate considerably  – last week coming through Fishguard at night I was one of only around ten heading east but approximately fifty were heading for Rosslare and beyond. Of course the salient point is that with easier booking facilities and better promotion this traffic could be noticeably increased for everyone’s benefit particularly during the summer.

But they I though they had only relatively recently re-opened Ennis to Athenry?

It would be sad if it were to close. I have only been to Rosslare once (OK, twice including the return trip) which was on a whim. Mrs FT, N! had spotted a cheap offer in the Bristol Post which included GWR from Temple Meads and ferry to Rosslare. We made no other plans, deciding to play it by ear. There were two trains at platform, and we simply got on the first one to leave. We stayed in Wexford, where the Intercity train runs along the main road for a short distance, like a very big tram, and used the train again during our stay to get to Gorey, for the beach. Had the other train been the first to go, we would have stayed in Waterford. The train manager remembered us from our first ride three days previously.

I hope it survives, and I hope it is promoted better than at present. It could prove to be a false economy to close the line.

Thank you for bringing this to our attention.  What a mess the report describes.

I've visited Ireland quite a number of time as regular members will know, and commented (maybe on my blog rather than here) that it's a country that feels like England did a generation or two back - in the time of my youth.  And a generation or two back we had the Beeching Report and its consequences here in Great Britain.

Figures quoted in the report of a shortfall of up to 491 Euros per passenger journey on one line are frightening, as is a main line terminus with just 50 passenger journeys in a day. And I do recall making a journey to that terminus (and reporting on it here) where I was the only passenger left on the train by the time it got there.

But the Beeching Report, and the background work on individual lines, has been found by time to be overdone in terms of what it claimed for savings, biased and scanty in its reasearch, excessive in what it calied should be done, and pessimistic for the future, and significant in what it didn't say.  Whilst certain closures probably were sensible, many of them weren't and indeed quite a number didn't happen - alas not because of the cases being looked at, but because of the politics and local mobilisation (or lack of it) in areas served line by line.

There are differences to Beeching though.   For one, the trains and lines in the paralous operational financial mess aren't in bad shape - a lot of money has been spent on them in recent years, with lots of continuoisly welded rail and rather nice trains providing the services, even if operational costs remain higher than perhaps need be.   For another, Ireland's already had its major clearout of lines so perhaps I should be comparing to the Serpell report rather than to the Beeching report.

For reference, here are links to the Beeching and Serpell reports, and also to our own mirrors of the Irish report and consultation document in case it's no longer available on thri site after the consultation ends.

http://www.railwaysarchive.co.uk/documents/BRB_Beech001a.pdf
http://www.railwaysarchive.co.uk/documents/BRB_Beech001b.pdf
http://www.railwaysarchive.co.uk/documents/DoT_Serpell001.pdf

http://www.savethetrain.org.uk/iereport.pdf
http://www.savethetrain.org.uk/ieconsult.pdf

Support graphics to give readers a quick intro / picture:

(http://www.wellho.net/pix/irish_hitmap.jpg)

From the "Annual one-day census of passenger numbers" for 2015:
(http://www.wellho.net/pix/irish_smallstations.jpg)

Operational cost report - figures quotes elsewhere including keeping the lines open are much much higher!
(http://www.wellho.net/pix/irish_savings.jpg)
 
My analysis and thoughts to follow in next post ...

Really four targets?

Have Gorey to Rosslare and Ennis to Athenley been included in the report consulation as decoys to draw the fire of those who object to those lines?   Are the real targets the closure from Limeric to Ballynrophy and perhaps from Limeric Junction to Waterford?    You'll note that I'm writing here mainly about the Rosslare line, and in doing so am I falling into the trap that the author of the consultation really only want to close two lines but I (and others) won't say much about those two being much smaller - so they'll go "as they don't have as much support" ... and with both sides able to claim a victory - "We save Rosslare" and "We managed to get rid of Roscrea"?

Wexford

Wexford (town) has a population of over 20,000 and is an intermediate station between Gorey and Eniscorthy has around 11,000 ... both are served by the line between Gorey and Rosslare, and neither of those two stations appears in the low usage list.  Yet they seem to have been left off many / most of the maps that accompany the report, even though it shows Wicklow with a population of just uner 15,000 (on the section to be retained). 

Short cutting

Whilst cutting the Rosslare service back to Gorey (population 9,000) from where it's currently viable northwards, will it still remain viable without throgh traffic from the South?  It's not pure population that counts - I think there is some commuter traffic to Dubin from as far south as Gorey, but not beyond so you end up, potentially, with a single-traffic-source line and not a more general line as you have at present, with a much more marked peak and an an increased imbalance for furure use of resources.   And I don't see people getting onto a coach as Rosslare Europort, Rosslare Strand, Wexford or Enniscorthy and then changing to a train at Gorey for the rest of the ride to Dublin - they'll want to stay on the coach if they travel this way at all.

1 day survey

We are warned in the UK that train overcrowding figures are taken for a single day and really can't be used to draw any conclusions.  Yet the passenge numbers for smaller stations in Ireland are also just one day, so do they tell us anything useful?    And I recall faut beng found in some of the Beechin Report's figures because figures were gathered over a highly selective week.  I have my doubts as to how much can be read into the passenger census data supplied.

Inappropriate service - e.g. two trains a day

I recall we had just 2 trains each way per day on the TransWilts until 2013 ... and that made marketing the line very difficult. And it was doubly so because the trains we had weren't right for daily commuter flows which can be the bread and butter of a line.    Our service was that much less useful because of dreadful connections at junctions.

I see similar situations on all the lines up for consulatation.   From Galway to Waterford - a natural through journey taking in two of the lines - you have a choice of 2 trains a day - at 06:20 or 13:45.   Both involve changing at Limeric and Limerick junction - on the first you arrive at Limeric an hour and 20 minutes before leaving the junction, and on the second that stretches to three hours and a minute.  In the reverse direction, the 07:20 off Waterford dumps you at Limeric Junction at 09:00 and you can enjoy both the junction and the city before continuing onwards at 14:20.  Local commutes into Waterford with first train in at 11:26 and last train out at 16:25 ...

Clonmel (population 18,000) and Tipperary (population 5,000) each have but 2 trains each way per day - and it's the same train - where a train every 2 hours would be possible using the same set - and perhaps meeting a whole number of other potential flows.  Between these two, they have pretty much the same population as Melksham where our increase from 2 trains each way by a factor of 4 has increased our passenger numbers by an estimated factor of 12.

The day boat from Fishguard arrives into Rosslare at 18:00 and if you're lucky and its on time, you'll be able to see the last train of the day - the 17:55 - pulling out for Dublin.  If you don't want to spend the night in Rosslare, you can catch the 02:30 boat from Fishguard which arrives at 06:30 and will connect into the 07:20 train - but that's hardly a pleasant tourist trip with two nasty nighttime interchanges.

Taking the boat out? The 09:40 train from Dublin - the first of the day - arrives at Rosslare at 12:26.  The 09:00 boat has long since gone. The 21:15 boat heads out just before the train arrives from Dublin at 21:28 ... the previous train reaches Wexford where it terminates at 20:12 (and you could probably make the conection by road) otherwise you're on the 16:37 from Dublin, 19:25 into Rosslare.

Fishguard

I would estimate that around 70 journeys per day are made on foot via the Rosslare / Fishguard ferry service, with perhaps 35 to 40 on the Irish side and 60 to 65 on the Welsh side transferring to and from the rail connections.   In Ireland, there are more bus / coach services at Europort to places like Waterford (train service withdrawn a few years back!) and indeed to Wexford and Dublin which make the rail journety number on that side lower (they rather force people to the buses if you look at issues with train connections!).

BUT ... remove the train service to Rosslare and you'll reduce foot passenger numbers on the boat and decimate the Fishguard service; remember that the 35 to 40 on the Irish side are hardened rail users already and most won't switch to the coach from Gorey.  So that's a prediction of a loss of 11,000 to 12,000 passngers per annum on the boat, and on journeys by rail to and from Fishguard Harbour Station if the Irish train goes.

Mothballing

The Rosslare to Waterford stretched moved from a fully useful train service to a parliamentary service to an engineering siding / mothballed line and now there's a suggestion it be abandoned.  With the longest rail bridge in Ireland on this section, being maintained in working condition but without income to fund that maintenance, you have something that doesn't look sane for the long term.  And because of that glaring absurdity, anything less absurd will have an easy passage to being the current way it's done, even if that's catastrophic for the long term.


CBT / TWSW / RailFuture for Ireland? / ACoRP / RDG / Rail Users Ireland

A question - who is there in Ireland who represents the rail industry and the passengers?   I'm coming to this post blind, not aware of any Transport User's Consultative Committees, Community Rail organisations, Railfutures or TravelWatches.   Are there passenger / rail user groups for the lines / towns concerned and any co-ordination of thoughts, responses and requests around these groups?   How well informed are uses, potential users and businesses that can or could be effected by closures as to what's going on?

Consultation on what?

There seems a disjoint between the quetions asked and the subejcts being reported on.   Perhaps that allows the "we have consulted" box to be ticked and "we got no objections to xxxxx" during consultation to be truely stated in some cases because opinions simply weren't sought and few people thought to write in the extras.  I'm afraid I'm a cynic, but being so because of the lessons of history.

Buses

Comment is made elsewhere that buses now run at similar time to trains on some of the routes.   Where both are being subsidised the question needs to be asked "is this intended to be permanent", but at the same time it could simply be an agreement between the public transport providers that they have both identified the time that people want to travel.   Frankly, that latter I doubt;  having a ready-runnning bus smooths the way to explain a train removal, and perhaps reduces political pressure to retain the train by convining those people who decide, but never use either, that there's a reasonable alternative and they should mute their objections.

Plan B?

Even the Serpell Report has plans A though D, with the least bad plan loosing just a couple of lines.

Where is the current marketing and information systems to grow some or all of these lines out of trouble?   To modernise the crossings and reduce future costs in that way?   I have plenty of thought how it could be done ...

In summary

I see so many similarities - places we and I have been and experience that may be the same (or not) across international boundaries.  With one exception in the four lines, I know enough about them to say that with more service, connections, promotions and information they could grow - with growth disproportionaly ahead of the extra increase in sevices.  They seem somewhere between neglected and tuned to fail at them moment, and once they're failed and lost it would be an almost impossible fight back.

Tomorrow morning at 08.00 Stena Line's new sailing schedule on the Fishguard - Rosslare route will come into effect. The new sailing times are as follows:

Ex Fishguard Harbour: 13.10 & 23.45 (currently 02.30 & 14.30)
Ex Rosslare Europort: 08.00 & 18.10 (currently 09.00 & 21.15)

This represents a monumental change as apart from changes of less than an hour the sailing pattern has been the same on this route for several decades.

The same ship, MV Stena Europe, will operate the route but sailings are being accelerated by a quarter of an hour to 3 hrs 15 minutes. The overnight crossing at 23.45hrs ex Fishguard is being slowed to take 4 hrs 15 minutes.

The change is being widely publicised and there was even an ad in the London Evening Standard a few weeks ago.

It is good to see an innovative schedule but it's a bit of a mixed bag for SailRail passengers.

Lets look at some of the issues:

At Rosslare rail connections have become very good  by coincidence rather than design as the train times are unaltered but perhaps Stena Line looked at how to best mesh with the existing rail service. Three out of four sailings will be rail connected year-round i.e.

04.00 arrival (05.35 M-F train to Dublin; 07.20 Sat; 09.40 Sun)
08.00 sailing (no train but Local Link bus connection from Wexford town and Rosslare Strand: link to t/table at end of post)
16.25 arrival (17.55 M-S train to Dublin; 17.40 Sunday)
18.10 sailing (lunchtime train ex Dublin reaches Europort circa 16.30 daily)

Incidentally Irish Rail have recently revamped their booking engine with single fares from Rosslare to Dublin from €12.99.

Will Arriva Trains Wales re-enable through ticketing to reflect this improved connectivity?

Will GWR mention the existence of Rosslare in their online and printed material? Airline partnerships to far-flung flight destinations receive a mention on their travel connections page so why the apparent aversion to Ireland?

At Rosslare bus connections to/from Waterford are poorer and the first bus from Waterford reaches the port at 08.20.

At Fishguard things the main issue for SailRail passengers is that the rail connection off the evening sailing from Rosslare will only go as far as Carmarthen. Ideally this needs to extend to at least Swansea and ideally the welsh capital. No long will the overnight journey from Ireland to London be possible (there is a waiting room on Platform 1 at Carmarthen but I doubt many will wish to spend around four hours there).

Could a bus be provided for the latter part of the journey if stabling/servicing/staffing requirements mean that the train can only go to Carmarthen?

A later train would serve a dual role - as well as serving ferry passengers it would permit domestic passengers to make later journeys between the key towns and cities of South and West Wales.

Local passengers in Fishguard, Goodwick and surrounds have lost their 23.45 ex Swansea and there appears to be noticeable disquiet about this. Boat trains will still run but the final 01.50 ex Fishguard Harbour will run tomorrow (Monday 22nd May, 2017). There has been a 01.50 night in night out for several decades - could it be the longest serving train departure time on the entire network?

The Stena Europe is going to be working flat out and daytime port turnaround times are reduced but I don't see this as an issue except in adverse weather delays may be easier to occur.

It would be good if passengers on the overnight crossing had an option of staying onboard till 05.00/06.00 or so (longer sleep)...

Coverage & references:
http://news.stenaline.co.uk/pressreleases/stena-line-refreshes-its-rosslare-fishguard-ferry-timetable-1893581 (http://news.stenaline.co.uk/pressreleases/stena-line-refreshes-its-rosslare-fishguard-ferry-timetable-1893581)

http://www.countyecho.co.uk/article.cfm?id=111025&headline=Stena%20Line%20announce%20revised%20timetable%20for%20ferry%20service&sectionIs=news&searchyear=2017#readComments (http://www.countyecho.co.uk/article.cfm?id=111025&headline=Stena%20Line%20announce%20revised%20timetable%20for%20ferry%20service&sectionIs=news&searchyear=2017#readComments)

http://fishguardtrains.info/ (http://fishguardtrains.info/)

Local Link route 387 bus timetable:
https://locallink.ie/wp-content/uploads/2014/06/March-2017Wexford-Route-387-6pp-DL-March-2017-FINAL-Web.pdf (https://locallink.ie/wp-content/uploads/2014/06/March-2017Wexford-Route-387-6pp-DL-March-2017-FINAL-Web.pdf)

Iarnród Éireann (Irish Rail) timetable: Rosslare - Wexford - Wicklow - Dublin line:
http://www.irishrail.ie/media/08_dublin-rosslare.pdf (http://www.irishrail.ie/media/08_dublin-rosslare.pdf)

I await an announcement (?) with bated breath.  Long overdue ... trains to connect with the boats.  There are trains to Rosslare Europort ... and to my untutored eye they have seemed designed in a Beechingesque way to fail.

OK - thanks for the update to your original post ... see it now.

South Wales and South and West England to Dublin and the rest of Ireland by public transport is a logical journey - and I'm a very occasional user - Melksham (of course!) to the Dublin area.  But only a very occasional user because the connections have been so crap that I usually take a deep breath and go via Holyhead.    Were the service to connect decently right through, I would be much more than just a very occasional user.

From England to Dublin, it now works.    Two sensible journeys per day.
07:49 Melksham / 12:30 - 13:10 at Fishguard, 16:25 - 17:55 at Rosslare, 20:44 in Dublin
16:37 Melksham / 22:02 - 23:45 at Fishguard, 04:00 - 05:35 at Rosslare, 08:46 in Dublin

Coming back, it's royally screwed.
I can leave Dublin at 13:36 and get as far as Carmathen ...
I can leave Dublin at 18:38 and get as far as Rosslare ...
Then both involve a hotel or a long wait at the port or station.  NO thank you!

The former return at 16:37 from Dublin would have got me to Melksham for 07:48 - 2 nighttime changes but no waits.  I now have to leave earlier (13:36 as against 16:37) and then spend those three extra hours in Carmarthen - the ex 01:50 from Fishguard now starting from there at 03:03

I am likely to use the route henceforth on my way to Ireland.  On the way back, I probably won't.

But take a wider look.   You have three transport providers making up the route, and for all three of them the through international public transport market has shrunk to the extent it's become insignificant.

The ferry company has used the speed of the boat, and perhaps the ability to turn around quicker, to remove the middle of the night arrival and departures at Fishguard - no bad marketing change for the leisure / car market who've probably not been thrilled with this timing on the end of a holiday.

Arriva Trains Wales appear to have removed one return trip to Fishguard Harbour (or have they just moved it earlier to match the boat?) - yes, it would have been perfect if it ran on - but to where, as services fade out at the end of the day ...

I don't think the Irish railways have changed much - if anything.  Just that the arriving boats now connect with trains. Pity the the only departing boat with a connecting train doesn't have a good connection onwards in the UK.

Conclusion?  None.  Bit surprised that if this happened with "only 2 weeks notice" that Arriva Trains Wales were able to make changes - I suspect they were pre-alerted ...

They have removed a service; I'm not sure whether to see it as the night boat train being removed or the last of the evening local trains introduced in 2011, but one has been removed no doubt about it. 7 trains per 24 hours has reduced to 6.

Your hunch is correct; when the changes first came to my attention I sent a Freedom Of Information request to the Welsh Government in the hope of extracting the 2011 contract for Fishguard's additional rail services to see if cutting back from 6 per day to 7 was a breach of contract (the 2003 franchise agreement, with just the two boat trains, is published online, and Arriva cannot possibly comply with it since Stena's timetable change as it requires connections with both a GWR service to London and the ferry, which simply isn't possible). Unfortunately my FOI request was refused, but I can tell you that Outlook.com is reporting that I sent the FOI request E-Mail on 20/04/2017. That means the new times (or a variation of them anyway) were already on Real Time Trains then, if not before.

Terminating/originating at Carmarthen would also be in breach of the 2003 franchise agreement, since it specifies that ATW must run to Cardiff or Swansea, but without the 2011 contract I cannot tell whether providing Fishguard with two Cardiff/Swansea services in each direction on the extra trains that don't meet ferries is enough to meet that requirement.

Extract from source at:
http://www.irishexaminer.com/breakingnews/business/iarnrod-eireann-to-refurbish-28-carriages-after-six-years-out-of-service-799559.html

Picture of 2700 class available at:
http://www.newstalk.com/Irish-Rail-to-refurbish-old-carriages-to-increase-capacity

Note: The 2700 class worked, inter alia, Rosslare - Wellingtonbridge - Waterford (until the service ceased in September 2010) and Waterford - Clonmel - Limerick Junction (until replaced by the 2800 class which were in turn replaced on this route by a 3-carriage InterCity railcar set).

Interesting to see that IE's annual passenger figures dropped massively by getting on for 20% between 2007 and 2012 following the global recession, whilst Britain's figures grew by roughly the same percentage during the same period.

Pleasing to hear they are bouncing back now.

Good news

I'm no expert, but I believe that until the economic boom, there was little rail commuting or business travel in Eire outside Dublin, and so part of IE's response to the loss of subsidies and declining ridership was to cull services, which didn't help passenger numbers.

Even now, long distance service density is pretty low, and services no faster than the motorway, so unless you are going city centre to city centre, it's probably faster (and more convenient to take the car). For example, Cork to Dublin (which is a bit further than Cardiff to London) is 2h15 at best, and mostly 2h40, with a roughly hourly service, although it's a snip compared to GWR at €70 return. Wexford and Waterford (roughly the same distance as Bristol to London) to Dublin are about the same timings, so not really commutable, even though they are even cheaper.

 

 

A new Irish Rail timetable comes into effect today Sunday 10th December, 2017.

In general only minor changes with a more comprehensive change scheduled for next year.

The 17.55 ex Rosslare is deferred until 18.00hrs arriving into Dublin Connolly at 21.00. Therefore a connection into the last Enterprise to Belfast (at 20.50) is no longer possible.


http://www.irishrail.ie/news/newtimetable2017 (http://www.irishrail.ie/news/newtimetable2017)

Thanks for the update ... it remains worse than Newquay with the first arrival at 12:25 into Rosslare Europort.

Remind me what time the boats leave ...

Due to the weather situation worsening in the Republic, Iarnród Éireann have closed their entire network for the rest of today 01-Mar-2018 and withdrawn all services tomorrow 02-Mar-2018. They hope to restart service on Saturday.

(Twitter)

I'm by no means an Irish Rail expert, but it does seem a little on the extreme side - Has this happened much in the past?

Large parts of the Republic of Ireland are under a red weather warning for snow until 18:00. Blizzard overnight, and continuing through the morning.

Last week, I was presenting a course in Ireland and I took the opportunity to sandwich it between some rail travel - taking a look at how things work over there.  Many experiences, much to learn and some I will share in due course.  Some things good, some bad.  Some would work in Great Britain and others would not.   But I look not at the trains - but how the public transport network works for the people.

(http://www.wellho.net/pix/ire_201806_01.jpg)

(http://www.wellho.net/pix/ire_201806_02.jpg)

(http://www.wellho.net/pix/ire_201806_03.jpg)

(http://www.wellho.net/pix/ire_201806_06.jpg)

(http://www.wellho.net/pix/ire_201806_05.jpg)

(http://www.wellho.net/pix/ire_201806_04.jpg)

A nice set of photos there - I see you travelled through Limerick Junction (fifth photo). There are plans for another platform there.

PS: for anyone who may be interested there is a project (and attendant consultation) underway to totally revamp the Dublin city bus network.

More info on Bus Connects:
https://www.busconnects.ie/ (https://www.busconnects.ie/)

A heads up that €4.99 web fares (adult single) are available from Rosslare Europort to Central Dublin stations (Pearse/Tara St./Connolly). Must be booked in advance.

The €4.99 fare is also available in the reverse direction and from Rosslare Strand and Wexford (O'Hanrahan) stations to Central Dublin stations too.

An ideal opportunity for anyone who yet as to travel or wishes to re-experience this highly scenic line.

www.irishrail.ie (http://www.irishrail.ie)

Ps: a SailRail ticket is available for travel from any National Rail station to Rosslare (including the Fishguard-Rosslare ferry which is another pleasant experience)

Apologies...this went unanswered...

The Fishguard ship sails from Rosslare at 08.00 and 18.10 (no connection into 08.00 except a Local Link bus from Wexford Mon-Sat) but daily train connection into the 18.10 (arriving Rosslare circa 16.30)

In the reverse direction the overnight sailing (23.45 ex Fishguard) arrives at 04.00 (05.35 train). The ferry terminal is open and warm even at this early hour so no need to wander out and walk over to the station till 05.15/20.

13.10 ex Fishguard arrives 16.25hrs (18.00 hrs train/ 17.40 hrs Sundays)

Sadly, no connection from Dublin into the 08:00 boat, and no connection to Swansea or beyond (train to Carmarthen only) off the 18:10 bus.  Net effect, no connections from Dublin to Swansea / Cardiff (let alone to Bristol or London).  All journeys require an overnight at some location.  Broken route for tourists.


Both work (relatively) well for tourist journeys.

The 22.14 train from Fishguard Harbour (23.03 on Sundays) runs to Swansea daily providing a connection out of the 18.10 sailing ex Rosslare (arrives Fishguard Harbour 21.25).

I sampled it a few months ago.

Myself and the two other passengers (both off the ferry too; none of us knew each other) were admitted to the waiting room at Swansea (the station shutters are closed for a period in the early hours). The staff encountered were friendly. We were able to board the 03.52 Paddington HST in good time which helped. I alighted at Cardiff - I believe the others were bound for London or beyond. The time actually passed quite quickly. But admittedly it is far from ideal. One wonders would there be merit in the 22.14hrs train (ex FGH) running through to Cardiff particularly at weekends. Of course in an ideal world one could have a slow overnight train the whole way through to Paddington!!! Perhaps not such an outlandish thought!

My error?   Not sure where I would have got Carmarthen - I tried looking it up for a journey a couple of months back.  Perhaps I was unfortunate enough to hit engineering works and rail replacement buses? 


The boat used to run later ... connection off the last train from Dublin, with the 03:52 from Swansea to London starting back at Fishguard Harbour to connect with it.    But with only three passengers, some bright spark would turn around and say "no demand", ignoring the current demotivational timing.   Alas, the train is no longer the key traffic for that boat, and the boat's timing is to suit the other (road) traffic of cars and lorries.

Two trains a day.  Out and back from Limerick in the morning, out and back in the evening. You may say it's a long way to Tipperary, but the lessons are here (or there) to share.

Article somewhat edited down as I quote it ...


Quoting (myself!) what I posted on the RailFuture Campaigners Facebook Group at ((here)) (https://www.facebook.com/groups/12135242142/permalink/10155919091177143/)

Picking up an old thread ... and noting that I used all four of the threatened services and was an interested observer of people off and on at nearly every station on that list.

On a more positive note, RTE News (https://www.rte.ie/news/connacht/2019/0605/1053658-western-rail-corridor/) tells us of an open consultation on extending the Western Corridor northwards from Athenry to Tuam and Claremorris where it would connect with the next Dublin Radial main line.    Sounds very sensible ... but there's a crying need to drastically enhance services on the rest of the western corridor route too.  The section from Rosslare to Waterford is "mothballed" and I don't know if even an engineering train could get through at present. Two further sections are in the "threat list' earlier in this thread, with the Limerick Junction to Waterford stretch having just 2 trains a day, and low passenger numbers caused not so much by lack of population but by lack of trains for people to use for their regular round trips.

It's ... not ... the UK.   It's not likely that the technology will be used in GWR territory ... but I can resists sharing this one.

https://ifiplayer.ie/along-the-line/

There's a diesel powered short demo track been recreated, I understand ... one of these years I'll find the time to visit.

Wow, thanks for sharing that Grahame! It had not occurred to me that there would be footage of the Lartigue in action.

Wow! I'm not entirely sure I understand why that was built, but wow!

Presumably some important authority was asked to help this new railway to choose between broad and narrow gauge, and said "I'd recommend sitting on the fence for the time being".

And current day ...

SHAMEFUL - the line is closed, cutting the trunk route from the post at Rosslare via Waterford and Limerick to Galway, with connections at Limerick Junction to Cork.

"Rails of Ireland" write


to accompany this video

Shame - I had my first trip to Ireland this year on the Fishguard - Rosslare route and thoroughly enjoyed it. Without the rail link to Waterford I didn't bother visiting anything other than the Rosslare - Dublin rail route. Absolutely crazy that you can't use rail to go cross country unless you go to Dublin and change there.

The sail - rail tickets are amazing value only cost me about £45 from Gloucester to Rosslare, and £37 Dublin - Gloucester. Great fun.

One of the things that was mentioned in the recent Irish talks between the Northern Ireland and the Republic of Ireland.

Was a fast rail link between Belfast to Dublin 166kms (100 miles) and

Dublin and Cork 254kms(160m)

Its a good thought,

but to the best of my knowledge there is no passenger service tracks between Dublin Heuston and the main line stations in the east of the City.
 

Trains could run from Dublin Connelly through Drumcondra and pick up the main line out of Heuston to the west before Park West & Cherry Orchard - but it's a painfully slow link, only used (at the moment) by a few peak hour local trains.   It passes very close to "Platform 10" at what's described as Dublin Heuston but in reality is a separate station, and currently closed, just off to the side of the connector.

The Dublin - Belfast, Dublin - Cork (and Dublin - Waterford) services are ridiculously cheap compared to English equivalents. The problem is that they are infrequent (the Enterprise is 2-hourly), there aren't many services early-morning and late-evening, and at over 2 hours, they are a bit too long to be a comfortable commute (I've got no idea of the reliability). 

I'd imagine that the cost of providing extra services to make them more usable, plus some modest linespeed improvements would be relatively modest, though not quite as exciting as new HS rails.

Looking at the airplane schedule for the whole of Ireland,there are no scheduled flights Belfast-Dublin -Cork.

So if the airlines can't be bothered,why should the railway?

Belfast-Dublin on the train is much the same price as the coach, much the same journey time, but less frequent.

From the Independent Westmeath (https://www.westmeathindependent.ie/2020/07/06/call-for-light-rail-link-between-athlone-and-mullingar/) (a publication I don't often read)


With a minister with a strong bias towards the green environment ... what else could we see in Ireland

Here are the 10 largest cities in Ireland: ( https://beef2live.com/story-top-10-largest-cities-ireland ):
1   Dublin   1,110,627
2   Belfast   579,726
3   Cork   198,582
4   Derry   93,512
5   Limerick   91,454
6   Galway   76,778
7   Craigavon   57,651
8   Waterford   51,519
9   Drogheda   38,578
10   Dundalk   37,816

I wonder if a truely green strategy forward for Ireland - part of the EU and direct ferry links from Rosslare to mainland Europe, with a ferry terminal sensibly close to a station, would be to look at reopening the "Engineer's siding" from Rosslare Strand to Waterford and to have each boat connecting with trains (an idea that seems to have bypassed the current generation of Irish transport planners) ...

1. Rosslare Europort via Dublin and Belfast to (London)Derry
2. Rosslare Europort via Waterford and Limerick to Galway
Those would provide direct trains to 8 out of the 10 cities. Cork would be reached with a change at Limerick Junction, and my geography of the Craigavon aree is too poor to comment - but it's close to where train no. 1 would pass.

Almost wonder if freight / containers could be handled the same way ...

Craigavaon is a 1960's new town built on existing settlements (just as Milton Keynes was in England) . Your Route 1 indeed passes through Craigavon which has two stations Portadown and Lurgan.

Interesting piece from the Westmeath Independent - had heard of the Killucan station reopening proposal but not about Athlone - Mullingar. Towns I'm reasonably familiar with. Originally double tracked one of the lines is in situ alongside the Old Rail Trail greenway.

Dunleer (between Dundalk and Drogheda) also merits reopening being within the Dublin commuter belt and on the Dublin - Belfast economic corridor.

In recent days a new Rosslare Europort website has been launched. Pleasingly the scenic rail route north to the capital through Wexford & Wicklow receives a mention. The port's Masterplan, launched around a month ago, is also detailed on the site.

If relocating the rail station to the ferry terminal is not feasible (the Masterplan talks of infilling the former rail alignment) a subway or courtesy bus is a must. A subway may be costly but we are talking about future-proofing the port for decades and big spending is proposed on port infrastructure. Curiously I never saw any planning permission record for the 2008 relocated station despite a trawl of Wexford Co Council records.

Brittany Ferries have launched a Rosslare to Bilbao and Rosslare to Roscoff route. The latter carries foot passengers too.

There is also a public consultation underway for the N11/N25 road to Rosslare. Given that the rail route between Rosslare Strand and Europort is subject to coastal erosion - though some works were carried out recently - a more easterly road alignment sharing a corridor with a re-aligned railway south of Rosslare Strand village to the approach to the ferryport could be evaluated.

https://www.rosslareeuroport.ie/en-ie/ (https://www.rosslareeuroport.ie/en-ie/)
https://oilgate2rosslareharbour.ie/ (https://oilgate2rosslareharbour.ie/)
https://www.independent.ie/regionals/wexfordpeople/news/report-calls-for-action-on-coastal-erosion-in-rosslare-37567964.html (https://www.independent.ie/regionals/wexfordpeople/news/report-calls-for-action-on-coastal-erosion-in-rosslare-37567964.html)

https://southeastontrack.com/ (https://southeastontrack.com/)

Our Mission

We campaign to reverse the unnecessary closure of the Wexford/Rosslare-Waterford rail corridor, and seek to improve public transport options across the South East of Ireland.
Goal One
Encourage Irish Rail and the National Transport Authority to explore restoring this vital rail link.

Increase rail services between Rosslare Europort/Wexford and Dublin and continue to explore ways of improving journey time.

Goal Two
After necessary upgrades, extend or alter existing rail services to include South Wexford and establish this as a viable travel option.

Improve journey times on both the Rosslare-Wexford-Dublin and the Rosslare-Wexford-Waterford-Limerick lines.

Goal Three
Engage in a multi-year process of improving services to make rail transport a successful transport option in the South East of Ireland.

The closure from Rosslare to Waterford ... at the very time that new international services are coming in to Rosslare and other parts of the line looping up via Waterford and Limerick to Galway are perhaps growing beyond ... seems odd to the extent of being perverse, and the service on the line towards the end looked to an outsider almost like it was designed to fail.

I know money was tight, I know that the train service was pretty close to useless, and I suspect the maintenance costs of the Barrow Bridge are not low ... I know that international foot passengers on ferries have offered very, very slim pickings indeed to the extent that even the Dublin trains don't connect any more ... and there is no longer any nice way from Dublin to - say - Melksham this way without a stop at a B&B in Rosslare, or being stranded in South Wales overnight.

Could the new government be swayed on this with the Greens now being in the coalition?

I don't know.

Very unusually, I have filled in the form on the web site in support even though this is 'out of area' and I know how diluting armchair support from distant places can be.

Except ... it's not been all that distant to me, and not just from my armchair.  I have been through Rosslare numerous times (often at some inconvenience due to the lack of decent through connections) and travelled to work in Cork and Limerick and Dublin, and for vacation to Tralee, Galway, Waterford, Killarney.  Never used the line in question, I will admit - even I have my limits as to just how long I will wait for the daily train, as was, when on a business trip.

The blue lines are boats - from Fishguard, from Pembroke Dock, from France, and (just starting) from Spain.  The red lines are rail lines usable from Rosslare ... to the north to Dublin and it heads north to Belfast.  The Yellow line is the missing link (there is a bus ...) to Waterford, and the red train lines I have drawn onward from there include Cork, Limerick, Galway, Mallow, Tralee, Killarney and even Tipperary.  The mauve line headed north is a proposed reopening which would bring in Westport and Ballina, and perhaps onward to Sligo.  Perhaps these latter places are best reached via Dublin, but then you're looking at capacity as you put long distance passengers, the DART commuter service, and significant freight too though the city centre two platforms at Tara Street, and along the single track from Greystones to Bray.

(http://www.wellho.net/pix/westwayireland.jpg)

for info ... I listened in (by invite) on a South East On Track zoom meeting last night - minutes not yet out, but the case seems good.  We are very much at the 11th hour, and perhaps the 59th minute of the 11th hour.   Happy to discuss / share thoughts and a letter of support I have sent with members with an interested via personal message.

Shared here ... with permission of the recipient group, written after a zoom meeting about a fortnight ago.   It looks like madness to loose the chance of relinking the connectivity - loosing a single piece from a jigsaw slashes the value of the jigsaw as a whole.   For sure, this one piece has fallen on the carpet and needs to be picked up - but that a darned sight better than having to get a special piece made at some date in the future, or indeed chucking the whole jigsaw out!

Sharing ...

---

Many thanks for inviting / including me in yesterday evening's Zoom meeting.

In my view, you have the framework of an excellent case for the re-opening of the Rosslare to Waterford Railway. This includes the provision of a passenger service linking major population, business and educational centres, and recreation and leisure destinations and transfer points, as well as long distance services linking through from Rosslare arrivals from other EU countries and the UK through Waterford to Limerick, Galway and connecting to Cork, Killarney and Tralee. It also includes significant freight / container traffic arriving into Rosslare destined for the cities of the west without the need to wriggle its way through Dublin, where frequent DART trains and longer distance services already competing on the single line into Bray, and through Tara Street.

The line from Rosslare Strand to the port at Waterford was built late in the railway age to a very high standard. The line is designed for fast running, much of it in cuttings through relatively flat country - not an interesting tourist journey in its own right, but an excellent connection to route EV1 for cyclists and walkers at both ends and intermediate points, and to other routes in the region that link it to Wexford.  There is potential to develop a further such route allowing greenway travel all the way from Waterford and New Ross to Enniscorthy and Wexford - another route with much of interest along the way and a far easier "sell" to tourists than a straight path with long sections in cuttings.

Regular services ceased on the line in 2010, but until this year it has been maintained in operational condition with occasional special and maintenance trains passing, and even at the time of writing a passenger service reinstatement would not be straightforward.  There are issues that would need to be considered such as terminal capacity was much reduced when the railway into the port was cut back, and at Waterford Station where the current setup is not conductive for handling passengers travelling east. Initial reversal of services at Rosslare Strand to provide a service to Wexford could also be considered (as in the longer term could a loop to complete the triangle) or perhaps service co-ordination could allow a train from Waterford to travel either to Rosslare Europort or Wexford, passing a train from Dublin or Europort to give passenger journey options to both Wexford and Europort.  With the European connection, you may have funding sources via the EU, to modernise facilities such as the level crossings along the way and the swinging span of the Barrow Bridge, all of which have significant operational (manpowers) costs in their current form.

You are at something of a key time.  If maintenance ceases for more that a few months, the line will rapidly become overgrown and the few cents saved by the withdrawal of this care would cost many more euros to restore.  Likewise, if the Barrow Bridge is swung open and fixed/disabled in that position, the relatively tiny saving made could well require massive funding to restore.  And you are looking here at both a service which would bring significant benefit to the region and provide a strategic link within Ireland too.  With climate change and the green agenda, with changes in travel patterns for passengers as a result of Coronavirus and for freight due to Brexit (which I very much regret), sustainable public transport connections through Rosslare and Waterford should be forming part of forward looking policy for the next 30 years, and should very much be something all your TDs and MEPs, and candidates, can put their names to irrespective of political allegiance.  It's a vote winner for them - with decisive action now before the bridge can be knobbled being more than returned to them at the ballot box next time.

You may well ask "So - what do you know, Graham" as I write this letter of support.

Ten years ago, my local station in England - serving a town of 25,000 residents - had only 2 trains a day - before dawn and after dusk, and only about 5 people arriving and 5 leaving by train a day, and those services were in question. Last year, we had 9 trains each way per day, with 75,000 journeys per annum at out local intermediate station, and around quarter of a million journeys "to, from or through".  Growth has been held back by the train becoming so full there was no room for any more passengers (we now have a longer train, and a longer platform too!) and this year by Coronavirus; prediction for next year is now 60,000 at our station, but rising to 250,000 (and that is a low estimate!) over the next decade. I have been one of the people involved right through the campaign - as President of the Chamber of Commerce I had the ear of many, and as one of the founders of our local Community Rail Partnership, have helped play the UK game of being in alignment with local and national policy. Several awards have come my / our way, but the biggest reward is standing on the platform as just about any train calls and seeing people in significant numbers getting off, getting on and just looking out of the window as they pass through. Not only has it done so much for our town, but for the neighbouring towns too.

My working career was in IT as a teacher / trainer - communicating ideas and concerns to others and having them make good use of those ideas and concepts, looking for and resolving issued to produce really effective solutions.  I turned that to rail, looking after press and publicity, online and traditional, with the Melksham Rail User Group.  So I have some experience of the sort of thing you'll be needing to do.  Much of my training was in Ireland, and with a need to carry equipment with me, I was a frequent user of the ferry into Rosslare - so much so that I got to recognising some of the crew members, and them me.  As equipment became smaller, I was able to switch from car to public transport.  A lot of work in the area around Dublin, but also journeys to and through Waterford, Limerick and Galway. And when making those journeys, I have taken the opportunity to observe and learn - in theory to pick up ideas of what will work (and watch for things to avoid) in our local work, but in practise giving me the experience that I feel lets me make a rather more useful contribution in this letter (and with some follow up) than you might expect.

Edit - tiny clarification and spelling correction

From the BBC (https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-55423267)


So what a STUPID time to close the line from Wexford to Waterford ...


A reminder - that from Rosslare, all of Ireland's (north and south) major urban areas can by reached by rail - but a half of them involve a congested dogleg through Dublin which the link that's gone/going would avoid.

Confirmation ... from The BBC (https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-55682597)



Sorry, but if I were running a business in Ireland with mainland Europe business, I would be looking at shipping products to and from my customers without having to go through two significant international trade borders - i.e. using direct services from Ireland to France.   And I would be very hard to win back when supposed "teething troubles" are overcome!

On the downside, for our (GWR area) travel to Ireland, a thinning out of ships across the Irish Sea from Fishguard or Holyhead is to be regretted - though if remaining services actually connected on both sides it would be marvy!   On the upside, it helps make an even stronger case for re-instatement of the Rosslare (Strand) to Waterford link as Rosslare gain in importance.

Sadly this looks like very bad news for Fishguard and Holyhead, for both of which I'd guess the Irish ferry trade and associated employment is very important. While it is many years since I have been to either, on my visits neither have looked prosperous even with this trade.

Forgive the "remoaner" comment (guilty as charged!), but remind me how Wales voted in the referendum.....

On another forum I subscribe to and occasionally post on, where the general congregation is rather ?Brexity? to say the least, the responses are becoming quite amusing:

?Good news for Wales ? less congestion?

?Just teething issues, nothing to see here? They?ll still be saying that in 2050...

?We don?t need the Irish anyway?

In the meantime, supermarket shelves are emptying in Northern Ireland.

Fishermen are complaining that their catch is going off before they can get it through border control and into the EU, a classic example if there ever was one of be careful what you wish for.

The return of? duty free? is being applauded by misguided individuals who never realised that what they were buying on the boats was more expensive than it cost in the shops in France and we now have duty free allowances back which is a definite downside to this version of Brexit, and we can all look forward to having our ham sandwiches confiscated by the Dutch Customs.

There are plenty of other downsides that people will find out about the hard way soon, not least being the electronic visa requirement that will be along in 2022

But never mind all that, we?ve taken back control. Rejoice brethren, rejoice!!!

[/Rant mode]

We certainly have. We are just not sure what we have taken back control of, nor whether we lost control of it in the first place.

Depends whose in control?

I've just read the papers. Apparently it's Boris ...  :-[

Depend what you mean by "in control".

I don't think he has quite reached Norman Lamont's description of "being in office but not in power". He would do well to avoid Julian Clary, just in case.

From the Nenagh Guardian (https://www.nenaghguardian.ie/2021/01/21/rail-group-welcomes-investment-in-local-line/)

https://www.facebook.com/groups/367387502018/permalink/10157684182557019

I will confess to being very keen on this one ... it strikes me amongst all the excellent proposals I hear about to be double or treble times excellent.

(http://www.wellho.net/pix/seot20210303.jpg)


Updates business case via https://southeastontrack.com/business-case (and I am mirroring it)


Reaching the Irish Parliament too.  Good.  Seanad Éireann debate - Friday, 26 Feb 2021
https://www.oireachtas.ie/en/debates/debate/seanad/2021-02-26/13/

Further article in the Irish Independent (https://www.independent.ie/regionals/wexfordpeople/news/its-now-or-never-for-wexford-to-waterford-rail-line-40120791.html)


A very different line to the TransWilts ... but I am minded how things turned around when we went up from two trains a day to a train every couple of hours ... took it up from 3,000 ticketed journeys at Melksham per annum (which is what the Office of Rail Regulation (ORR) told me when I asked about how busy the line way) to 240,000 journeys on the line in less than 3 years. And that was capped there was no more physical space to fit people on the train!


Edit: VickiS - Clarifying Acronyms 08:30

From The Waterford News and Start (https://waterford-news.ie/2021/03/11/proposed-waterford-to-rosslare-greenway-parked-as-rail-review-beckons/)

https://www.facebook.com/Wexford-Greenway-100479955490609

Common sense

(http://www.wellho.net/pix/wexfordgreenway.jpg)

From the Cork Commuter (https://corkcommuter.wordpress.com/2021/04/27/the-national-rail-network-is-failing-rural-ireland/amp/)


It's failing more that just rural Ireland - it's failing on just about any journey between cities the are NOT Dublin ...

Sharing from a public Facebook post ... a winding down and closure of many miles of railway lines in Ireland


A challenge to some of our members here - to accept the closure of railways, or to celebrate that they're no longer needed for their original purpose, which was far from climate friendly or sustainable.

I understand that some of the Bord na Mona railways are being looked at for cycleway conversion, as part of extending the Eurovelo 2 route from Athlone to Galway. Not necessarily the most stunningly scenic route, I'd have thought, but good that they might be remembered in some form.

From the BBC (https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-59028141)


Well ... to repeat what I wrote earlier this year, "of course - what did 'you' expect"

From the Waterford News and Star (https://waterford-news.ie/2021/11/04/barrow-bridge-decision-branded-a-big-mistake/)

The All Island Strategic Rail Review has been launched. Some interesting graphics which our contributors with more knowledge/interest in the area will make the most of:
https://www.infrastructure-ni.gov.uk/news/ministers-launch-public-consultation-all-island-strategic-rail-review (https://www.infrastructure-ni.gov.uk/news/ministers-launch-public-consultation-all-island-strategic-rail-review)
worth working through the links to get to the actual document
https://www.infrastructure-ni.gov.uk/sites/default/files/consultations/infrastructure/all-ireland-strategic-rail-review-consultation-document.pdf (https://www.infrastructure-ni.gov.uk/sites/default/files/consultations/infrastructure/all-ireland-strategic-rail-review-consultation-document.pdf)

Sadly, this story is from Ireland not the rest of the British Isles - see (here) (https://www.irishexaminer.com/news/arid-40868732.html)

Rather a contrast to the UK where fares are ever increasing, and often for a worse service.

The recent elections in NORTHERN Ireland showed increased support for leaving the UK and becoming part of a united Ireland.
This sort of thing will add to the views that the grass really IS greener on the other side of the border.

More news on the Rosslare - Waterford link, from RTE:

https://www.rte.ie/news/leinster/2023/0212/1356196-tensions-over-future-of-rosslare-waterford-rail-route/ (https://www.rte.ie/news/leinster/2023/0212/1356196-tensions-over-future-of-rosslare-waterford-rail-route/)


Although any lack of an administration in Northern Ireland shouldn't affect the Rosslare - Waterford link.

From The Irish Independent (https://www.independent.ie/regionals/wexford/wexford-district/rail-review-pushes-revival-of-rosslare-to-waterford-line-and-aims-to-shave-an-hour-off-dublin-to-wexford-commute/a26307786.html)


Good. A bit "left field" in looking to extend the Dublin to Waterford service to Wexford but it makes sense to me.  See upthread to see the insanity (IMHO) of letting the Rosslare Strand to Waterford rail link be lost for ever.

The idea that journey times between Dublin and Wexford could be "reduced by about an hour" seems rather optimistic to me. Current journey time via Wicklow is about 2:40. Current journey time to Waterford is about 2:15, though that does involve a reversal at Kilkenny.

I can see there being a Waterford - Wexford - Europort - Waterford triangular routing if the via-Waterford scheme came to pass.

2 hours exactly on the 16:15 Fridays from Dublin, calling at Athy and Carlow only and without the reversal, and 2 hours 1 minute on the 16:05  on Friday and Saturday from Waterford with a stop at Kildare too.

From the Irish Times (https://www.irishtimes.com/transport/2024/04/02/nta-considering-proposals-to-end-direct-rail-services-between-wexford-and-dublin/)


An interesting follow up to the old (nine year ago) story that the line was at risk.  Passenger numbers have grown dramatically and there's now a consideration of splitting the service at Greystones or Wexford - the idea being to free up paths on the suburban line into Dublin, and be able to run the diesel trains more frequently on the shorter part of the route.

Here is the current Monday to Friday timetable - Saturday and Sunday there are just 3 return trips each way

(http://www.wellho.net/pix/dub_ros_24.jpg)

The connections ...

05:30 and 17:30 arrivals in Rosslare from Fishguard
So that's the 07:20 train or the 05:35 next morning to carry on to Dublin

08:15 and 19:30 departures from Rosslare to Fishguard
So that's an arrival into Rosslare at 20:42 the previous evening from Dublin, or at 16:33

North of Bray / Greystones, into Dublin, the trains don't seem to have a regular in-the-hour pattern to them, and are (yes, I admit) a darned nuisance between almost clock face Dart services; they often seem to get stuck behind the Dart and the journey takes an age.

Unhappy senator https://www.rte.ie/news/ireland/2024/0403/1441381-dublin-rosslare-train/ (https://www.rte.ie/news/ireland/2024/0403/1441381-dublin-rosslare-train/)
I think this is not the last of this.

Ireland's all-island strategic rail review was published July 31st 2024 and is to be found here:
 

https://www.gov.ie/en/publication/cc8fc-all-island-strategic-rail-review/ (https://www.gov.ie/en/publication/cc8fc-all-island-strategic-rail-review/)

Mark

... includes case studies on the Scottish Borders Railway (page 70) and also Exeter's rail system (page 76).

Mark

I have mirrored for members the summary:
http://www.passenger.chat/mirror/all-island-vision.pdf

and the full report:
http://www.passenger.chat/mirror/e716ec64-4732-48ed-97cf-4395af2fb1f7.pdf

Well that’s quite something..!

What a refreshing contrast to what has gone before, and the attitude over here since 2016......

Nice to see a government investing in improved rail services https://www.rte.ie/news/2024/1029/1477875-dublin-belfast-rail/ (https://www.rte.ie/news/2024/1029/1477875-dublin-belfast-rail/)

The world's slowest capital to capital international express train.

Have you tried Budapest to Ljubljana?