Great Western Coffee Shop

I arrived at Paddington this evening approx 21.23... More than enough time for the 21.27 for Maidenhead... you'd think?

Well.. when I got there with 4 whole nice long minutes to spare I realised it was platform 13 so decided running (although not safe but many many people each day have to resort to this) was best.. I got to platform 13 with loads of time to spare (well a minute or so) so slowed down a bit (mainly so I could breathe and also because there was another lady passenger further back than me so I thought that it would all be ok)... This was the point I realised the train wasn't just platform 13, but "in front of another train in platform 13".. so started running again and got to the train door (with the train despatcher watching me) and pressed the door button just after it had been locked (with the train despatcher still watching me) and the train left me and the lady passenger (who I mentioned before) behind... How nice that was...

My children who were on their own got to spend an extra half hour on their own as the next train (21.42) was very slow arriving at 22.30 instead of about 22.05...

Strangely enough the train despatcher person was nowhere to be seen seconds after the train was  alllowed to leave with people just about to get on.. I wonder why...

This is not good customer service... >:(

I think to some extent dispatchers are stuck between a rock and a hard place here... On the one hand they will quite possibly be on the wron gend of a management b*ll*cking for delaying a train, and if there is a straggly line of passengers running for a train there comes a point when you can't say "just one more" but the train actually has to leave. On the other hand they will get grief from those passengers who get left behind.

Having said that, I certainly have seen situations where dispatch staff have quite deliberately left people behind for "fun". The most obvious (because the dispatcher concerned and his mate had a good snigger about it immediately afterwards) was an HST at Oxford where a woman wanting to load her bike dumped it in a vestibule and was told, quite correctly, to remove it and stow it in coach A which was in its usual position somewhere near Jericho, miles beyond the footbridge. Then whilst she was running to the back the dispatcher and conductor cheerfully got the train on its way...

Although the staff had a good giggle about it it was pretty unprofessional - far better to be straight with her and tell her that she was too late!

The other thing is why is it necessary for the Reading stoppers (Taplow & Maidenhead) trains to leave from 13 at that time of night? 8 to 12 seem pretty empty at that time.

It's a pity you hadn't arrived five minutes earlier then you could have caught the 21 21 Oxford fast to Slough from one of teh mainline platforms.

For a better journey if you miss the 27 you could catch the 21:48 (Worcester Shrub Hill) fast to Slough and change there, although a it's usually a Turbo it can be crowded. Both come up on the National Rail journey planner.

Part of the reason was discussed recently here: http://www.firstgreatwestern.info/coffeeshop/index.php?topic=6316.0 (http://www.firstgreatwestern.info/coffeeshop/index.php?topic=6316.0)


The 21:48 is booked for a HST and is very rarely anything else except during bank holiday alterations.  It is possibly changing to a Turbo on Friday nights come the summer timetable change.

I hate to be the person who says this but there is a reason why larger stations have longer connection times (fifteen minutes in the case of Paddington). It is the amount of time allocated to get from one part of the station to the furthest point.
For the dispatcher to allow you on, he would have needed to speak to the driver (assuming the service was DOO, not my route) to get the doors open again and then repeat the whole dispatch procedure. I'm sorry to sound harsh but I would personally rather delay one person by half an hour than everyone on the train by two minutes. The last train of the day is an obvious exception, but there still has to be a cut off point.
The other evening at Reading I waited a couple of seconds for a last minute runner, only to find half way to Basingstoke that they were going to Wolverhampton.

In the old days didn't platforms have a gate at the concourse end? Presumably if you beat the gate being closed you got on the train. I appreciate this would be difficult for 13/14 but surely something like that would surely make sense.

Perhaps removing 13/14 trains from the departure boards 5 minutes before time?

Its probably fair to assume now that if its a local stopper it will be 13/14 so give yourself at least 5 minutes - if its platforms 8-12 that's a nice bonus.


Anyone also noticed the increased use of 13/14 in the morning arrivals?  Presumably this is following the redesign of the Circle line making the very modest "ticket hall" and access to 15/16 a very cosy experience in the morning peak.

Doesn't help Bakerloo line and bus commuters though.  I know, you can't please all of the people...


 

Strange then that one morning last week at Maidenhead, just as the train doors were locked, and someone who had just run up the stairs missed them, the doors were unlocked for them to get on, then locked straight after.. No delay to us, we were on our way..

Unless Paddington has totally different despatch procedures I guess..

But anyway in this instance.. being as they'd put the train as close to Maidenhead as they could physically get it whilst still being in Paddington, and being as they could see two people coming (it's quite a long way up platform 13 when there are two trains in it).. common sense could have prevailed..

The other lady was already unhappy with FGW and their connections etc... I don't think she was a regular traveller and therefore what happened was a very bad advert for FGW to her..

And yes thanks to eightf48544 for suggesting the 21.48.. I didn't think of that at the time..

This other lady and I thought did walk ALL the way back to the main concourse to wait for our next train to be announced.. You can only guess where it was.. Yes.. it was that lovely train in platform 13 that we'd run past earlier..

You couldn't make it up  ;D

It does, for Turbos at Maidenhead on plat 4 has CCTV for the driver to see what is going on so its possible for them to reopen the doors; at Paddington the platform dispatcher operates a switch which activates a "CD" close doors signal for the drive and then a "RA" right away signal, for the doors to be reopened the dispatcher would have to walk to the cab and ask the driver to open the doors, and the walk back to where the CD and RA switches are located.

Even for HST's at Maidenhead the TM can still re unlock the doors

Nice of them to operate the CD signal when they can see two people rushing for the train then when they know it's not easy to reverse it.. Ho hum... FGW get to take more of my time if I have to arrive there 15 minutes early (15 minute connection time mentioned earlier) just in case... ???

A lot has to do with the punctuality performance figures and the penalties that go with that, if the dispatcher delays the train departing that is a TOC causing the delay hence they have to pay NR.  We (the traveling public) are our own worst enemies we demand trains run on time yet expect them to wait for us

Ok.. but I've always understood that it is the final train destination that is the one that creates the early/late figures? although I may be wrong.. so for example Maidenhead trains might always be late.. but.. if they are travelling on to Oxford with lots of the usual timetable padding, then that doesn't feature in the late figures?

Please correct me if I'm wrong here..

We did spend a good two or three minutes sitting doing nothing at Burnham last night (and I only needed ten more seconds to get on the train at Paddinton) but I bet the train still arrived somewhere on time..

You are correct Jo, but hind-sight is a wonderful thing.  If a service leaves Paddington late and then gets caught (for whatever reason down the line) and was late arriving at that point, they could start allocating delay minutes to Paddington Dispatch.

How is the dispatcher to know what troubles may be ahead ?  Certainly "Well I held it for a minute because it will probably arrive on-time anyway" would not have been greeted very well by management.  (Network Rail will try and bounce any delay they can onto a TOC!!)

"TOC to advise"...?  ;)

Oh well.. as I said before.. I shall just have to spend a lot of extra time at Paddington in future by arriving extra early..

What didn't help us feel good about this incident was being watched hurrying up the platform by the train despatcher who gave no indication that she was going to press the despatch button just before we got there..

Usually there is lots of whistle blowing to hurry the last stragglers up to make them aware that they might miss the train if they don't go faster (which then becomes their choice).. The fact she was standing there so calmly watching us lulled us into a false sense of security.. And her disappearing act straight afterwards was second to none  ;D ;)

That's the one  ::) ;D


With respect, a couple of minutes will be sufficient i'm sure  :)

With respect, a couple of minutes will be sufficient i'm sure  :)
[/quote]

Thanks Donkey Guard.. It was kind of tongue in cheek.. Maybe I'll just pack my running shoes and practise running faster  (also tongue in  cheek)  ;D ;)

Sorry, on-line TIC is sometimes lost on me  ;D

Hmm.. your tongue in cheek perception is probably better than my ability to quote people on here.. I won't correct it though.. so people can see how bad I am at it  :D ;)

Funny thing I only ever notice when being dispatched by a FGW despatcher is that while the rule book (that mysterious excuse us industry people quote) says that the whistle is just a supplement to the handsignal (or in the case of DOO at PAD the CD/RA indicators), whenever I'm despatched at RDG any later than right-time then they will just use their baton / lamp and no whistle, no hustle for late comers.

In a way it's another reason to back guards on trains, as you've more chance of a local door still being open, granted on FGW turbos this is the back cab but I have been knows in my previous First career to let a latecomer making an effort through the cab. (Knuckle slap and a posthumous disciplinary from FSR probably, but then again the FGW managers they've bought in can't even open the doors on the right side at a platform (see other threads!) ).

While I was doing my (far too) regular run to the very far end of Platform 13 about 9.25 today, I noticed the complete lack of clocks once I was through the ticket gates.. There is no clock on platform 12 and both train departure boards (the one at the start of platform 12 and the one between platform 12 and 13), as far as I could see, also had no time on them.. This can't help people short of time to get to the end of platform 13, in knowing whether to jog, run or sprint  :)

Oh no, you mustn't run, FGW elf and safety police will put you on a poster!
"xx number of people were injured rushing at this station"

But how else will all the people get to the very very far end of Paddington before their train goes?  :D ;) :)

Are trains not announced on the boards in sufficient time to allow for a walk to the country end?

I suspect it is more a case of running to bag a seat......  ;) ;D

And then Paddington, like the platform 5 island at Reading, will be cursed with a sign containing a speaker that shouts  "May aaah hiv your attention please, thus us un iccident blickspot!" on a loop in a South African accent. Is that object still there or have the platform staff discreetly retired it?! Would drive me up the wall having to listen to it all day. It was bad enough waiting for ten minutes for a connecting train.


My experience of catching trains form Padd is not that extensive, but I've done it often enough and it seems like frequently things are cut surprisingly fine. I'm pretty sure Aunty Doris and her several suitcases would be hard-pushed to make it to her reserved seat in coach A on many occasions.

Fortunately it's been switched off for a couple of months now.  Hopefully permanently for the sanity of station staff and passengers alike!

Last time I arrived at Bristol International Airport, there was a yellow Dalek-like safety cone at the top of the stairs down to the baggage collection area, warning us to 'mind the step'.

I was sorely tempted to wait until all of my fellow passengers had safely negotiated those stairs, before wellying that irritating cone into oblivion.

Sadly, the omnipresent CCTV dissuaded me.  ::)

Isn't it amazing?
The passengers (not customers) complain when we don't hold a train for you.
The passengers complain when the train is late at your destination.

Simple, I leave on time and wait for no runners, normally pointing at my watch to show I'm on time.

You may call it bad (customer) service.
I call it good for the passengers who are sat down waiting for me to convey them to there destination.

So maybe some clocks along platform 12 would be good so we know how fast we have to run to not delay the train?  Currently the first clock after the mad 3/4 minute sprint has started is by the train on platform 13/14 itself :)

Scenario 1: I catch the 17:45 from Paddington to Swindon, with a view to changing onto the 18:44 Southampton train at Swindon.   But then the 17:45 gets held up by a few minutes ("goats on the line at Cholsey") and as I and others making the connection run from platform 4 to the bay at Swindon, the conductor sees us coming, shakes his watch, and closes the doors.

Scenario 2: I start to dash down the steps at the Hammersmith and Teacup platform at Paddington, but when I'm just a few steps down the doors are closed and the train departs.


I call your approach reasonable in Scenario 2.  But I accept your invitation to call it bad customer service in scenario 1 ... and I suspect that view would be shared by anyone who was on the train, realised what had happened, and realised the effect of saving that few seconds on passengers for Dilton Marsh (2 hour and 22 minute delay, and an extra change), Melksham (don't even ask when the next train is), etc

We're posting in the "London to Reading" section where trains are more frequent, so perhaps more "Scenario 2" stuff.  But I do think that people have every right to complain if they've been waiting on the concourse and not been given long enough to get to the platform.  If you can't avoid justifiable complaints, someone should look at fixing the system.

P.S. Once you chaps start running a proper TransWilts service - the extra trains as defined by Network Rail's GWRUS - then I'll say a big thank you and say "We are scenario 2 too now".  The EXTRA hourly service would mean that missing the 18:44 would simply drop us back to the 19:14 - not 22:01 at Dilton Marsh, but 20:10.

Connections are upto the conductor and control.
I just open the powerhandle when told to.

To catch the 1844 ex Swindon "connection" you should be on the 1730 ex Padd, not the 1745.

Absolute nonsense! It's an advertised connection in the timetable (Swindon arr 1838, dep 1844).

No its not nonsense IB.  If you travel around the railway and base your plans on "advertised connections" you must miss a lot of trains.  If I wanted to make sure I got the 1844 off Swindon I would be on the 1730 ex Padd. 

Just because FGW say there is a 6 minute connection doesn't mean it actually works on a regular basis. 

I stand by that comment. If you plan all your journeys on the basis of missing connections you'll waste hours of time. I always plan around the advertised ones and find that the vast majority of the time they work well.

As long as the connection is advertised, you have a contract with the TOC to get you to your destination. In the case of Melksham, seeing as that connecting service runs only twice a day, FGW either has to hold the connecting train for a few minutes or provide alternative transport for everyone off the 1745 ex-Padd.

One needs to apply some common sense here.  A 6 minute connection at Swindon with a change of platform and maybe quite a long walk (run!) and congested stairs etc?  To be avoided if possible in my view.  But a 16 minute connection I'd probably go for.

Yes, FGW may have a contract to get you from A to B, and no doubt if you miss the 1844 off Swindon there's another train an hour later. But wouldn't you rather make an effort to get the 1730 off Padd to give yourself some leeway for the 1844 off Swindon?  Do you really want to be on the 1745 Padd - Swindon looking at your watch all the time and wondering whether you'll make the connection into the 1844 off Swindon, or whether you need to walk through the train to be by the stairs, and how fast you're going to have to run?  If you're happy with that fine, but I wouldn't be. Better to get an earlier train and relax a bit.

Quite.

One does apply some common sense every time one travels. Stick to the advertised connections and you're usually fine. Given that many times I end up connecting two or three times en route (say, Oxford to west Wales) with most of the services involved running roughly hourly, I could allow myself an extra hour for each connection and double the length of the journey it's true. Why on earth I'd want to though I have no idea.

I can only go by personal experience where I have made many hundreds of journeys involving connecting trains en route - nearly always there has not been an issue; occasionally there has but the time that such delays have cost me pales into insignificance compared to the time I would have wasted messing about to ensure that I had half an hour between connecting trains!


Erm, putting things politely, that's something of a bone of contention for the resident of Melksham. There isn't another train until the following morning. In fact the poor service provided en route was one of hte original raisons d'etre of this forum!

Coming in as a Melksham resident ... and clearing up a couple of issues.

The train after the 18:44 is at 06:15 (If you travel from London on a Monday to Thursday) or at around 15:20 on Saturday afternoon if you travel on a Friday.   "Another train an hour later" is what the GWRUS says should be provided, but it's not there at the moment.

With such a sparse onwards service, I do always try to be on a service earlier out of Paddington.  However - if there are lower priced advanced tickets for sale, they will only be on that train with the shorter connection - so much as I would advocate common sense and allowing another 10 to fifteen minutes in Swindon, I can find myself penalised pricewise to do so.

And finally - let's be realistic.  We don't end up sleeping overnight on the platform at Swindon if the connection misses.  The staff at Chippenham are very good / professional / well practised in sorting things out for those of us who know our rights and where to find 'em.   And standing in the booking office asking in a loud voice "can you tell me the time of the next train to Melksham" often brings the offer of a lift from a sympathetic fellow resident who has driven up there to collect an otherwise-stranded partner.  Indeed - I have "picked up" people this way when I have been meeting people ...