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All across the Great Western territory => The Wider Picture in the United Kingdom => Topic started by: inspector_blakey on December 14, 2009, 14:49:09



Title: British Airways Christmas strike set to disrupt 1 million people - Guardian
Post by: inspector_blakey on December 14, 2009, 14:49:09
http://www.guardian.co.uk/business/2009/dec/14/british-airways-christmas-strike (http://www.guardian.co.uk/business/2009/dec/14/british-airways-christmas-strike)

@rse.

All happy hints on how to get something out of the airline so that I don't have to spend mega-bucks (well, kilo-bucks anyway) on an alternative ticket gratefully received...


Title: Re: British Airways Christmas strike set to disrupt 1 million people - Guardian
Post by: devon_metro on December 14, 2009, 14:52:22
Cue Virgin/AmericanA/etc all raising their fares!!


Title: Re: British Airways Christmas strike set to disrupt 1 million people - Guardian
Post by: JayMac on December 14, 2009, 14:53:35
I really feel for you blakey. :( You were in my thoughts as I was about to post a similar link to the breaking news, but you beat me to it.

Where and when are you flying from?


Title: Re: British Airways Christmas strike set to disrupt 1 million people - Guardian
Post by: JayMac on December 14, 2009, 14:57:31
Quite some breakdown in industrial relations. An 80% turnout and a 92% vote in favour of action. Must be a record in the post Thatcher era?


Title: Re: British Airways Christmas strike set to disrupt 1 million people - Guardian
Post by: Mookiemoo on December 14, 2009, 15:00:16
Sounds odd - but try flying into one of the other UK airports?  Even if its from somewhere odd in the states e.g. Charlotte, NC to Gatwick is often really cheap in comparison - might keep the cost down.

Over the years I've discovered some really bizarre routes that cost a lot less when booking at last minute.

e.g. returning from Kansas in September on a Friday - cheapest route, i kid you not, was Kansas-Detroit-Miami-London


Title: Re: British Airways Christmas strike set to disrupt 1 million people - Guardian
Post by: IndustryInsider on December 14, 2009, 15:22:47
Over the years I've discovered some really bizarre routes that cost a lot less when booking at last minute.

e.g. returning from Kansas in September on a Friday - cheapest route, i kid you not, was Kansas-Detroit-Miami-London

My idea of hell! And demonstrating that the airline industry has just the same silly fare anomalies as the national rail network.


Title: Re: British Airways Christmas strike set to disrupt 1 million people - Guardian
Post by: inspector_blakey on December 14, 2009, 15:29:35
Phew!

Just spent 40 mins on the phone to BA's US office but the net result was that they've booked me onto the same flight I would have taken but two days earlier... Now to re-book my train ticket from Heathrow!


Title: Re: British Airways Christmas strike set to disrupt 1 million people - Guardian
Post by: Mookiemoo on December 14, 2009, 15:39:02
Phew!

Just spent 40 mins on the phone to BA's US office but the net result was that they've booked me onto the same flight I would have taken but two days earlier... Now to re-book my train ticket from Heathrow!

This could be the hard part!


Title: Re: British Airways Christmas strike set to disrupt 1 million people - Guardian
Post by: inspector_blakey on December 14, 2009, 18:30:54
A quick question about industrial relations law...!

My rescheduled flight departs on 21 Dec, but actually arrives in the UK on 22 Dec. Given that the strike is due to start on 22 Dec, could the striking cabin crew legitimately refuse to work it, or do strikes like this start on a "rolling" basis determined by the booking-on time of the shift? And would that booking on time have to be UK or US time?!


Title: Re: British Airways Christmas strike set to disrupt 1 million people - Guardian
Post by: welshman on December 14, 2009, 18:35:08
I'm pleased to say I don't give one.

I've managed to stay off aeroplanes for over 40 years now.  Last trip on a Cambrian Airways Viscount in January 1969. 

That's my contribution to green stuff.


Title: Re: British Airways Christmas strike set to disrupt 1 million people - Guardian
Post by: Mookiemoo on December 14, 2009, 18:46:43
A quick question about industrial relations law...!

My rescheduled flight departs on 21 Dec, but actually arrives in the UK on 22 Dec. Given that the strike is due to start on 22 Dec, could the striking cabin crew legitimately refuse to work it, or do strikes like this start on a "rolling" basis determined by the booking-on time of the shift? And would that booking on time have to be UK or US time?!

I guess they probably could but unless they are American if they dont work it, I suspect they will be spending Christmas in the states........can't see BA offering to fly them home with another airline.

Therefore I suspect on the grounds of common sense, they will work it.


Title: Re: British Airways Christmas strike set to disrupt 1 million people - Guardian
Post by: inspector_blakey on December 14, 2009, 18:48:26
I'm pleased to say I don't give one.

I've managed to stay off aeroplanes for over 40 years now.  Last trip on a Cambrian Airways Viscount in January 1969. 

That's my contribution to green stuff.

Thank you so much for your helpful contribution, welshman.

I guess they probably could but unless they are American if they dont work it, I suspect they will be spending Christmas in the states........can't see BA offering to fly them home with another airline.

Therefore I suspect on the grounds of common sense, they will work it.

That was what I was guessing - it's just that BA are saying you can rebook any flight that is 48 hours either side of the strike dates, which makes me wonder if said crew might refuse to leave the UK in the first place (don't think BA have any American flight crew, only ground staff)...


Title: Re: British Airways Christmas strike set to disrupt 1 million people - Guardian
Post by: grahame on December 14, 2009, 18:49:47
Phew!

Just spent 40 mins on the phone to BA's US office but the net result was that they've booked me onto the same flight I would have taken but two days earlier... Now to re-book my train ticket from Heathrow!

You done well ... they cancelled a flight on me in the lead up to Christmas a few years back (and it was a last minute cancellation - I actually got to Heathrow) ... and offered me the same flight two weeks later.   As a result, they remain my least favourite airline to this day.   Apparently, the reason for the cancellation was weather / incoming flight diverted and plane not at Heathrow, so they weren't liable and asked me what I expected on a cheap ticket.   What is their liability if the staff go on strike, considering that they must be responsible for one side of the dispute?

Good on you, Inspector_Blakey, for getting a fix which - I presume - works for you.   Advise to other who find themselves stuck - see if you can find an alternative airline and get BA to sign the tickets over.  That's what we did those years back ... we were only a day late with AA to LA but it didn't alf take a lot of assle.


Title: Re: British Airways Christmas strike set to disrupt 1 million people - Guardian
Post by: inspector_blakey on December 14, 2009, 18:51:21
Thanks - still not 100% convinced I'm out of the woods yet, but it's looking a lot more promising than it did this morning!


Title: Re: British Airways Christmas strike set to disrupt 1 million people - Guardian
Post by: JayMac on December 14, 2009, 18:58:53
A quick question about industrial relations law...!

My rescheduled flight departs on 21 Dec, but actually arrives in the UK on 22 Dec. Given that the strike is due to start on 22 Dec, could the striking cabin crew legitimately refuse to work it, or do strikes like this start on a "rolling" basis determined by the booking-on time of the shift? And would that booking on time have to be UK or US time?!

Maybe the cabin crew will withdraw their labour at 00:00 regardless of where the planes are. Could be problematic if you ordered a G&T at 23:59....... ;) :D


Title: Re: British Airways Christmas strike set to disrupt 1 million people - Guardian
Post by: Mookiemoo on December 14, 2009, 19:07:49
A quick question about industrial relations law...!

My rescheduled flight departs on 21 Dec, but actually arrives in the UK on 22 Dec. Given that the strike is due to start on 22 Dec, could the striking cabin crew legitimately refuse to work it, or do strikes like this start on a "rolling" basis determined by the booking-on time of the shift? And would that booking on time have to be UK or US time?!

Maybe the cabin crew will withdraw their labour at 00:00 regardless of where the planes are. Could be problematic if you ordered a G&T at 23:59....... ;) :D

And since they are integral to safety - not sure how the plane could continue to fly and if over the midatlantic, not sure where they could ditch it


Title: Re: British Airways Christmas strike set to disrupt 1 million people - Guardian
Post by: grahame on December 15, 2009, 07:26:25
Watching an interview with the chief executive of BA on the TV this morning ... he was talking about the future of the company, and the future of jobs for the staff with no mention at all of the passengers.  Now of course the news media may have snipped that bit out, but it wasn't exactly "customer is King" type talk.


Title: Re: British Airways Christmas strike set to disrupt 1 million people - Guardian
Post by: Chris from Nailsea on December 15, 2009, 21:48:32
From rail-news.com (http://rail-news.com/2009/12/15/virgin-trains-to-run-25-additional-services-on-london-%e2%80%93-scotland-route-during-ba-strike/):

Quote
Virgin Trains to run 25 additional services on London ^ Scotland route during BA strike

Virgin Trains is urgently firming up precise timing details for 25 additional services that it plans to run on the London ^ Glasgow via Preston route over the Christmas and New Year holiday period to help passengers affected by the proposed strike by British Airways^ cabin crew.

The extra trains will supplement the already advertised service of 26 trains daily in both directions between Euston and Glasgow.

Chris Gibb, Virgin Trains^ Chief Operating Officer said today: ^We will of course be busy at this time of year, but I am confident that with the additional trains being arranged alongside our scheduled services most of which have 439 seats, we will be able to carry all our regular customers together with those displaced by the BA strike whom I would like to welcome to our trains.^

Further details regarding the exact timings of extra trains will be available very soon.


Title: Re: British Airways Christmas strike set to disrupt 1 million people - Guardian
Post by: JayMac on December 16, 2009, 06:11:48
From rail-news.com (http://rail-news.com/2009/12/15/virgin-trains-to-run-25-additional-services-on-london-%e2%80%93-scotland-route-during-ba-strike/):

Quote
Virgin Trains to run 25 additional services on London ^ Scotland route during BA strike

Virgin Trains is urgently firming up precise timing details for 25 additional services that it plans to run on the London ^ Glasgow via Preston route over the Christmas and New Year holiday period to help passengers affected by the proposed strike by British Airways^ cabin crew.

The extra trains will supplement the already advertised service of 26 trains daily in both directions between Euston and Glasgow.

Chris Gibb, Virgin Trains^ Chief Operating Officer said today: ^We will of course be busy at this time of year, but I am confident that with the additional trains being arranged alongside our scheduled services most of which have 439 seats, we will be able to carry all our regular customers together with those displaced by the BA strike whom I would like to welcome to our trains.^

Further details regarding the exact timings of extra trains will be available very soon.

Good bit of opportunism from Beardie Rail, but where are they gonna magic up the rolling stock from? And the traincrews? And what about the paths needed on the WCML?

I'm thinking Virgin Trains know that BA's legal challenge to the strike will be sucessful, therefore they won't need to run what is a doubling of the service to Scotland. However I could be wrong and it will be great PR for the whole rail network if Virgin can pull it off.


Title: Re: British Airways Christmas strike set to disrupt 1 million people - Guardian
Post by: Chris from Nailsea on December 17, 2009, 21:03:59
From the BBC (http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/business/8418805.stm):

Quote
British Airways strike blocked by court

A strike by British Airways cabin crew planned for Christmas has been declared illegal in a High Court ruling.

The judge agreed with BA that the cabin crew's union, Unite, had not correctly balloted its members on the strike action. The injunction means that the 12-day strike cannot now go ahead.

Unite called it "a disgraceful day for democracy" and vowed to hold a fresh ballot of cabin crew if the dispute with BA was not resolved. "There is something wrong with the law," said Unite joint general secretary Derek Simpson. He admitted that while there would be "great euphoria" among the travelling public, the union would immediately put in place plans for a fresh ballot alongside its continuing negotiations with BA. "We'll see at the end of the day who wins this, we will see at the end of the day proper democracy, proper justice," added Mr Simpson.

If Unite does go ahead with another ballot, industrial relations laws would mean that fresh industrial action could not be announced until well into the new year.

The judge in the case, Mrs Justice Cox, agreed with BA that Unite's ballot was invalid because it included workers that had already accepted voluntary redundancy. She also poured scorn on the timing of the planned strike. "A strike of this kind over the 12 days of Christmas is fundamentally more damaging to BA and the wider public than a strike taking place at almost any other time of the year," she said.

Mrs Justice Cox also refused the union permission to appeal, but the union could apply directly to the Court of Appeal.

British Airways said the decision would be welcomed by "hundreds of thousands of families in the UK and around the world".

"There was never any need for a strike and we hope that Unite will take this opportunity to reflect before deciding its next steps," a statement from the company said. "In recent days, we believe Unite has formed a better understanding of our position and of the ways in which we could move forward. It has also become very clear that our customers do not believe that old-style trade union militancy is relevant to our efforts to move British Airways back toward profitability."

Mr Simpson and Unite's other joint general secretary, Tony Woodley, said the dispute was "far from settled".
 
"While we have never wanted this dispute, it is a disgraceful day for democracy when a court can overrule such an overwhelming decision by employees taken in a secret ballot," they said.

The original ballot saw 92.5% of those balloted vote in favour of industrial action.

Bob Atkinson of travel website travelsupermarket.com said the one million passengers booked to travel with BA over Christmas and the new year "can now breathe a sigh of relief and carry on with their travel plans".

"BA should now contact customers as soon as possible to confirm flights will be going ahead and normality has returned to the market," he added. "The threat of strike action has been hugely damaging for the British Airways brand and customer loyalty has been tested."

One BA cabin crew worker contacted the BBC to say she was "delighted" the strike had been stopped. "I voted for the strike but never dreamt it would be for 12 days over Christmas," she said. "I'm delighted it's been stopped, we have the upmost respect and regard for our customers and I'm glad we have the opportunity to show this over the festive season."


Title: Re: British Airways Christmas strike set to disrupt 1 million people - Guardian
Post by: super tm on December 17, 2009, 21:41:01
With a 90% vote in favour it will be interesting to see the sickness rate next week.


Title: Re: British Airways Christmas strike set to disrupt 1 million people - Guardian
Post by: JayMac on December 17, 2009, 22:01:52
The BA cabin crew are going to be earning every penny of their average ^29000 salary smiling through all the comments from passengers whose Christmas they very nearly ruined.


Title: Re: British Airways Christmas strike set to disrupt 1 million people - Guardian
Post by: Mookiemoo on December 17, 2009, 22:59:09
Now hear is the crunch - how many people are negative on the BA strike but would support a rail strike?  For whatever dubious reasons the unions cook up.  If the conditions on offer were so bad,people would just refuse to work since they clearly have a better option elsewhere



Title: Re: British Airways Christmas strike set to disrupt 1 million people - Guardian
Post by: Chris from Nailsea on December 18, 2009, 00:16:31
A rather nifty bit of footwork by Virgin Trains?  ::)

From rail-news.com (http://rail-news.com/2009/12/17/virgin-trains-to-help-rescue-air-passengers/):

Quote
Virgin Trains to help rescue air passengers

Virgin Trains is set to help air passengers affected by the collapse of Scottish airline Flyglobespan. The train company will run additional trains on its London to Glasgow route between the 22nd December and the 2nd January.

The extra trains, which supplement the already advertised 26 trains daily in both directions, had initially been planned to help air passengers who would have suffered due to the proposed BA strike but, although this strike has now been called off, Virgin will continue to run the additional trains.

The extra trains will operate at the following times, full details will be available next week on online journey planners.

Tuesday 22 December 2009 10:38 Preston to London Euston (calling at Wigan North Western and Warrington Bank Quay) 13:33 London Euston to Lancaster (calling at Crewe, Warrington Bank Quay, Wigan North Western and Preston) 14:30 London Euston to Glasgow Central (calling at Warrington Bank Quay, Wigan North Western, Preston, Lancaster, Oxenholme, Penrith and Carlisle)

Wednesday 23 December 2009 *08:30 Glasgow Central to London Euston (calling at Preston, Wigan North Western and Warrington Bank Quay) 13:33 London Euston to Lancaster (calling at Crewe, Warrington Bank Quay, Wigan North Western and Preston) 14:30 London Euston to Glasgow Central (calling at Warrington Bank Quay, Wigan North Western, Preston, Lancaster, Oxenholme, Penrith and Carlisle)

Thursday 24 December 2009 *08:30 Glasgow Central to London Euston (calling at Preston, Wigan North Western and Warrington Bank Quay) 13:33 London Euston to Lancaster (calling at Crewe, Warrington Bank Quay, Wigan North Western and Preston)

Monday 28 December 2009 10:38 Preston to London Euston (calling at Wigan North Western and Warrington Bank Quay) 13:33 London Euston to Lancaster (calling at Crewe, Warrington Bank Quay, Wigan North Western and Preston) 14:30 London Euston to Glasgow Central (calling at Warrington Bank Quay, Wigan North Western, Preston, Lancaster, Oxenholme, Penrith and Carlisle)

Tuesday 29 December 2009 and Wednesday 30 December 2009 *08:30 Glasgow Central to London Euston (calling Preston, Wigan North Western and Warrington Bank Quay) 13:33 London Euston to Lancaster (calling at Crewe, Warrington Bank Quay, Wigan North Western and Preston) 14:30 London Euston to Glasgow Central (calling at Warrington Bank Quay, Wigan North Western, Preston, Lancaster, Oxenholme, Penrith and Carlisle)

Thursday 31 December 2009 13:33 London Euston to Lancaster (calling at Crewe, Warrington Bank Quay, Wigan North Western and Preston) 14:30 London Euston to Glasgow Central (calling at Warrington Bank Quay, Wigan North Western, Preston, Lancaster, Oxenholme, Penrith and Carlisle)

Friday 1 January 2010 10:38 Preston to London Euston (calling at Wigan North Western and Warrington Bank Quay) 13:33 London Euston to Lancaster (calling at Crewe, Warrington Bank Quay, Wigan North Western and Preston) 14:30 London Euston to Glasgow Central (calling at Warrington Bank Quay, Wigan North Western, Preston, Lancaster, Oxenholme, Penrith and Carlisle)

Saturday 2 January 2010 *08:30 Glasgow Central to London Euston (calling at Preston, Wigan North Western and Warrington Bank Quay) 14:30 London Euston to Glasgow Central (calling at Warrington Bank Quay, Wigan North Western, Preston, Lancaster, Oxenholme, Penrith and Carlisle)

*The departure time from Glasgow is subject to confirmation and customers should confirm details next week with National Rail Enquiries on0845 48 49 50 or using the online journey planner at www.virgintrains.com.



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