Great Western Coffee Shop

Bizarre. How on earth have London Midland got themselves into this mess and could it happen to other TOCs?
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/8239688.stm

I would say this is more a failure of and the incompetence of the companies management more than of its work force for not "volunteering" to work overtime

Point is - Sunday should not be on a volunteer basis in the 21st century in a 7 day a week industry

And I suspect the only reason it isnt is the same vile parasites that are the unions!  If they werent unofficially striking (sorry - en mass refusing to work overtime) then they would be officially striking over including Sunday.

So if unions are parasites, presumably managements are all saintly forces for good in the world, like the people running the banks who nearly destroyed the global financial system last year?

I don't pretend to know the ins and outs of the dispute at LM but I don't think the workforce would be doing things like this if they felt there was a constructive dialogue to be had - whether or not they are union members.

Similar problems on FGW at the end of 2007 were sorted out - by dialogue and negotiation, which does not mean telling people to sign or get fired.

I don't imagine you would sign up to a contract you objected to, so why should anyone else, individually or collectively?

Even the Tory MP says: "London Midland need to pay their staff a fair wage to work anti-social hours".
 
And you can't just sack lots of railway staff - many of the jobs are safety-critical and require thorough, detailed training over an extended period. If you did fire everyone, there wouldn't be any trains for a lot longer than one Sunday.

You're right, I won't - but what I do is walk away and find something else that I do not object to.  In doing so I weight my opportunities else where given the current climate - and at the end of the day, if I thats the best out there, I suck it up until the market improves.

Well said willc.

If the problem was simply the existence of unions, then surely this problem would be occurring throughout the network rather than just one company. If Sunday services are essential, then why are London Midland continuing to make them dependant on the goodwill of individual staff members? that's no way to run a train service.

Staff don't strike or work to rule lightly -- it hits their pockets hard (I find it extraordinary that so many people don't seem to realise this simple fact). Therefore they only ever strike or refuse overtime when their patience has reached breaking point. That doesn't mean every industrial action is justified -- but if it isn't, that's less to do with being a horde of evil parasites, and more to do with a misjudgement of what can be achieved by the action.

It was reported this morning that there was an agreement that Sunday working on LM attracted an enhancement on basic pay. This agreement expired at the end of August, and so only basic rate would be paid, i.e. a pay cut.

Same work, same hours, less money, what would you do?

I understand that the reason the agreement "expired"...more likely withdrawn, was that other Sunday staff (ticket office staff et al) quite rightly asked for the Sunday payment, presumably, negiotiated by the drivers.

Do other TOCS operate a 7 day week? or is Sunday still subject to additional payment. Do freight operators pay extra for night or unsocial hours? I just pose the question, not close enough to the industry to know!

They keep Sunday 'voluntary' so they don't have to employ more staff to cover the service properly...

You either have a system
a) where staff a rostered to cover the full seven days a working week with rest days that are never on the same day of the week every week for which you pay a higher basic rate for the normal week to compensate for the antisocial working, this system normally has a the same flat rate for working rest days
b) where staff cover Sundays and rest days voluntarily, in this system you pay an enhanced rate for working those extra shift to compensate for giving up your days off.

The choice LM staff made spend Sunday at home with family on a lovely summers day or work for money where most of it will be taken by HMRC in tax to pay the bankers bonuses, not a difficult decision.

The big key words in this episode is "Volunteer to work Sundays" to relay on providing a professional service on "volunteers" is fool hardy management (oh nothing wrong with volunteers providing a service as I am some one who dedicates a lot of my free time in voluntary youth work)

exactly the same for fgw sunday outside working week so you can opt out,ATW also the same i think it is common across all tocs.
not just with drivers some other departments have same conditions and some dont.
if sunday was included in working week more staff and pay will be required because under current conditions some drivers do not work sundays so the drivers that do cover them,far cheaper to pay the enhanced sunday rate.

Oh really ?  You're not Bob Crow behind that pseudonym are you ?  ;D

Good lord no ........ Tony Ben may be

True, but not exclusively so. Some driver depots require a driver to find a volunteer for their Sunday shift, and if they can't (and nor can Rosters through using up standby and volunteers) then technically they are 'obliged' to work. I say obliged, because it is a massive grey area within the industry as driver are rostered to work a weeks of varied hours, which fluctuates over a cycle of somewhere between 8 and 24 weeks to average out at 35 hours. So, Sundays are technically outside of that 35hr agreement - and surely it would be unlawful to MAKE them work?

I'm surprised such action as that taken by LM drivers hasn't been more common over the years. It's really the fact that the number of drivers who don't wish to work their Sundays is roughly level with the number who wish to work additional ones. That's the only reason the whole situation doesn't collapse. All it takes is for a depot of drivers who take coordinated action and all decide not to work and you get the situation that arose on LM. It's unofficial, but of course the Unions won't actively condemn it.

I think that Sunday's should be re-negotiated into the drivers contracted hours, but it's easier said than done.

Dead right there, especially when one side of the negotiating will be done by Keith Norman and Bob Crow.

Slightly off, but did anyone see "Mock the Week" last week talking about the strike and associated train stories?  Worth a watch on iPlayer for some rather amusing train stories  :D