Great Western Coffee Shop

I just had a look at some fares, Penzance to Edinburgh via London Anytime Return is ^500.  Would anyone seriously pay that?  It would be cheaper to get an all line rover.

Some years ago, whilst working for a Govt Dept, I had to justify the cost of flying to Glasgow rather than getting the train. I rang rail enquiries to get the cost of a First Class return from Bath to Glasgow - the response from BR ? " Good God, no one buys one of those !"

The point is that it's a bit stupid to offer such an expensive fair when others are available with the same if not more flexibility at a cheaper price.

:D I can believe that. Wouldn't happen now of course because all calls are recorded for training purposes! I suppose that would be used to train someone not how to answer a request for the cost of a ticket.

Guess its a case of you have to start somewhere when pricing something so you can offer cheaper alternatives or do special offers.

I think the "point" is similar to my own thinking recently in listing a book in the Amazon Marketplace for around ^1000. I don't seriously expect anyone to pay that sort of price (in fact, I don't even particularly want to part with the book, which sets me apart from your average TOC I suppose!) - but on the other hand, if some rich fool wants it badly enough to not bother shopping around and actually offer me a grand for it, then I'll gladly part with it once the cheque's cleared....

Firstly, the All Line Rover would not be cheaper if you weren't returning for more than seven days.

Secondly, no, no-one would buy that ticket, because the off-peak return at ^195 has almost no time restrictions: you can't leave KGX between 0645 and 0816 on the outward leg, and can't arrive there before 1020 on the return leg. Those are the only restrictions. Given that the 0505 PNZ-PAD doesn't arrive PAD until 1003, I wouldn't exactly call them onerous.

Would an off peak ticket be valid on the 05:05 from Penzance though as that is a peak train FGW train?

Aah, apologies, I fall on my sword...  :-[

Didn't read all the way to the bottom of restriction 5A. In fact you can't arrive PAD before 1039, so you could have a lie-in until 0541...

wouldnt it be much cheaper to go via birmingham
may take longer
i mean somebody with the money for that kind of train fare
youd surely think would have a passport to fly
lol

Depends if you want to spend 8 hours on a Voyager.

but through rough guess from past experience id say its 5 hours give or take 20 min, to paddington
then paddington kings cross (another 15)
then say wait 20 min...
by then its at least 6 hours.....

then how long to edinburgh 4 and a half hours?

so your looking at probably 10 hours going via london

From Penzance it's over 10 hours via Birmingham.

That is the main point of a timetable as well - something to base your delays on !

If someone said to me, go from Penzance to Aberdean and you can fly or take the train...! Train wins everytime, even if it does take over 10 hours to get there ;D

I disapprove of flying, What I like about trains is that you can walk to the ticket office, ask for a ticket, get on the train, and your all set to go ;D

Flying... Thats a different story. You have to go through security where if you make the slightest error like forgetting to declare your laptop and MP3 Player, you get jumped and interogated by 6 Security Guards!

I once returned from Spain where I went on holiday and I had a really stressful flight and was in no fit state to speak to anyone. Get to immigration in Bristol Airport... "Where have you flown from today sir...?" I could not remember :-X :o In fact, The last 4 hours of stress had completely thrown me and I couldn't remember a thing >:( Hence why I stick to trains ;D ;) :P However all was resolved and they let me on my way ;D

Depends on if its a one off or I do it every week

One off - train - every time

Do it to get to work - fly!  And stay over in a hotel mon-fri - as I did in Belfast recently.

Now - if someone could build a chunnel under the irish sea (ishunnel?) then I could be convinced in future

trout

trains are fine say on a paddington penzance at 11am getting in like 4pm
where you are probablygoing to have a relatively trouble free not very crowded long and peaceful journey
but this long journey we`ve been discussing crosses 2 peak time periods probably changing as well and maybe catching a tube if via london

in this case i definatly think plane even with boarding etc is stil the more comfortable option

Only reason I would ever take the train to Scotland if I had a First Class ticket valid via London. Preferably donated to me. Quite simply, Easyjet is far quicker and cheaper and so much more comfortable than being stock on a Vomit for hours!

Not many employers will give you that option though if it takes an additional two days of yours (= their) time.

[/quote]
Flying... Thats a different story. You have to go through security where if you make the slightest error like forgetting to declare your laptop and MP3 Player, you get jumped and interogated by 6 Security Guards!
[/quote]

In my experience your bag gets pulled over and you suffer the slight inconvenience of having to watch for a few minutes whilst they dig out the offending items, check that they work, and then watch whilst they put it all back again. Either you're unlucky or you over dramatise things that most of us take as part of day to day tedious life.

An interesting comment should we put up with things as part of day to day tedious life.

It's often said we don't complain enough so should we put up with high fares for flexibility and the numerous restrictions on travel on advanced and off peak tickets if you don't want to take out a bank loan to travel.

It seems to me a rebalancing by issuing more slightly dearer advanced tickets and less expensive walk on fares would encourage a lot more people to take the train.

I'm afraid that in my experience most of the airport so-called security checks are a complete waste of time. They rely on the terrorist being more stupid than the "security" officer (quite difficult at times !).
If you want to put a bomb in a radio/razor, etc it is not difficult to make sure that the item still works - having said that would a radio work in the middle of terminal x at Heathrow anyway ?.

I once carried a computer monitor back from Germany by air, after x-raying the box I was taken into a side room where the box was opened and inside was - guess what ? - a Samsung monitor - just like it said on the box ! I was then allowed on the 'plane, where the very helpful BA crew put it into the crew wardrobe to protect it.

I seem to be the only person on this planet who LIKES airport checks, and other security restrcitions.

They are there to prevent terrorism. By passing through thorough checks, I feel safe and re-assured that everything reasonably possible has been done to prevent a bomb getting through.

Yes - it's inconvenient that you can only take 10 ml of water past, that you have to take off your belt and shoes. But it's better than being a victim of an attack!

And don't blame the Police, or the Government for eroding your civil liberties. Blame the people who have resulted in these measures being taken in the first place!

Besides, the measures are actually there to PROTECT your civil liberty to life - the most important one of all.

Hear, hear! I usually make a point of making such a comment to security staff in the event that I get my bag picked out for checking, or one of the family fails to get through the metal detector without needing a search. It's always appreciated by the staff.

The only reason security is stressful is if you are late and in a queue, but not because of the process itself.

i wonder how many people travel from the southwest to scotland everyday on business, and how many would be willing to use a sleeper if it existed

I know somebody who frequently does. It's quick and cheap.

There was no evidence that there was ever a liquid bomb - only that in theory it was possible

It took top scientist six months to come up with one - and then it wouldnt be enough to blow a plane!

Having spent five months traveling twice weeklyu to Belfast I have two comments:

1.. Two security lines - one for those who dont have gels liquids or pastes cos we know better, know to take out laptops out and generally take seconds

2. The second security line for the occasional traveller or still thinks they have to turn their mobiles off - no just dont ******* use it in front of the security , who think a litre bottle with dregs in it passes, who despite being told three times they cant take XYZ get to security and still have it

To qualify for line 1 you pass a test and your passport is endorsed - first time you screw up, the endorsement is removed and you queue with the package holiday idiots

well the service from cornwall via devon to london and london to scotland exists woudl devon-scotland via say manchester work?

Hi

Well I dont do Devon to Scotland on a regular basis, but when I do, I'm afraid the train wont get me there in time for the onward connection from Glasgow.

I Hate Heathrow, and always prefer to travel from/to the closest airport, so on the occassions I do have to go the Head Office journey was...

Sunday. Bristol 07:05am- Glasgow Easyjet, (no option Exeter), Glasgow 11:15am - Iceland.
Relaxing afternoon/evening refreshing for work Monday-Friday
Friday night.... Iceland - Manchester, overnight hotel
Saturday Manchester - Exeter Flybe. home 10:00am and job done.

Taking the train on this simply would not be an option.... unless there was the overnight sleeper of course.  Also the cost is ^200 cheaper not using Heathrow.

Fecks

Nonsense. Hydrogen Peroxide (formula H₂O₂) looks like water, but can easily cause an explosion as it is a powerful oxidising agent. It is essential that checks are made on liquids - even clear ones.

You don't need to blow the whole plane up, just a hole in the side!


Good idea, but due to PC-ness it will never happen - more's the shame...

Agreed, Btline!

However, I do have a problem with the attitude of some staff on the security gates at airports, on this point.

A couple of years ago (in times of apparently heightened security), I went through the check-in and security procedure at Bristol International Airport.  In my hand luggage was an overlooked bottle of mouthwash - which was picked up on the x-ray scanner and challenged by the lad on security.  Fair enough, he 'confiscated' it - but his rather smug expression, as he hurled it, with reckless abandon, into the bin behind the counter would, I suggest, have been wiped off his face if it had indeed been a bottle of nitroglycerine (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nitroglycerin), or whatever.

 ::)

Yes - they should ask for an address for the "offending" items to be returned.

This reminds me of the probably apocryphal story of the postal bomber who put a return address on the package and allegedly got blown up by his own bomb (or "hoist by his own petard")

Hmm. Better declare at this point that I have a chemistry degree, as well as a PhD in cell biology... Hydrogen peroxide is certainly a strong oxidant (and nasty stuff...one of a relatively small number of chemicals that has me reaching for the safety glasses), but of itself it not spontaneously explosive (although it will give you lovely blond(e) streaks in your hair).

Anorak off now, I promise.

On a different note, how far off topic have we wandered that I've just posted that little chemistry lesson in a thread entitled "Expensive fares"  ;D

'Elementary', my dear James!  ;) :D ;D

Thank you - I was just about to point out that while it is an oxidising agent - its not going to blow a hole in the side of a plane!

OU - molecular science and fissix science student

Glad someone more learned than me stepped in

I can find many analogies to say - there was nothing at the time to say ANYTHING liquid would down a plane - the security services had to work real hard a long time to come up with something

If you fell for that - hope you have lots of wool at shearing time

The idea was to keep the populace scared and then bring in ever more draconian laws

mentos in diet coke? or brake fluid in bleach how did we get from stupidly high fairs to bomb making?

I believe that I am responsible for that Relex... ::)

I put in a post regarding my displeasures of Airport Security...!

Granted, it's there for a reason. But my experiences of Flying and Airport Security, were ones that I would rather not have experienced. Flying puts me under alot of stress, hence why I take the train simply for it's simplicity ;D

On my last flight back to England, It was so stressful that I wasn't exactly in the most "with it" sort of mood...! Get to Immigration... "Where have you flown from today sir...?" Due to the amount of stress I had been subjected to I could not remember... ::) However the situation was resolved and I proceeded to obtain my luggage ;D

But back to the topic in hand, I take the train because that is what I feel comfortable with, My job rarely requires me to go further afield, but on the occasions that it does, my employer sends me by rail ;D

...I wouldn't go that far  ;) It does bother me slightly when people automatically assume that I must be cleverer than them because of the "Dr" thing, which is why I try to avoid using the title (unless it's a shameless attempt to get extra respect with the bank/estate agent etc etc !)

The brake fluid and bleach thing sounds a bit iffy...two nasty corrosive chemicals, eeaurgh. I can confirm though that mintos and diet coke go like the clappers...

just be responcible for once dont play with bleach.. need the correct one (scientists will know what i mean), as for the mentos and diet coke... if your that imature (like me) its safe and fun!

To get back to the original topic.  Wouldn't it be sensible to cap the very expensive fares.  Hardly anyone buys them and they only generate negative publicity for the railway.  How about no standard class fare to cost more than ^300 and no firt calss to cost more than ^500.

And what about Network Railcards?

I don't see why people living in the South, South East East and Greater London should still have the benefit of being able to save 1/3rd off, not only for themselves but 3 other adults and 4 children!

I've just noticed the off peak day return fare from Taunton to Tiverton Parkway is ^8.10.  Does anyone know why this is so expensive compared to other off peak day return fares in the area?

There are two reasons:
1. It is just outside of Devon and Cornwall, where FGW significantly lowered Cheap Day Return fares, Tiverton Parkway to Taunton being the firs un-lowered fare.
2. It is a high speed route, the price has always been set by the Great Western franchise as opposed to the nearby fares being set by the local franchises. With the merger, and the service still provided by High Speed services it is still set at a higher rate.

There could also be another reason the TOCs don't want the car park and their trains filled up with locals going shopping in Taunton. So much for getting people out of their cars! Plus FGW needs every penny it can squeeze out of us punters.

 

I would think it would be quicker driving in all honesty!

Plenty of space now the second car park is open, havent seen it full yet!

At at ^4.40 to park and ^8.10 for the ticket, the M5 looks the better option for Taunton (even more so when the P&R at J25 opens)