Great Western Coffee Shop

Hi,

I renewed my Reading-Paddington season ticket (For 1 month 5 days) this morning but did not get the 10% discount that is normally applied.  Has the discount period now ended because FGW have improved their performance?

The only other reason I can think that maybe I didn't get it was because my last season ticket finished on Thu 5th Feb but I didn't renew it until today (Mon 9th Feb) - would that make the discount invalid because of the gap in renewing?

Thanks,

Boppy.

Yes it looks that way see
http://www.firstgreatwestern.co.uk/Content.aspx?id=265

Figures came out  31st Jan and there are no discounts on HSS renewals anymore

 :o Well I guess the figures speak for themselves!  Well done FGW.  Cheers for the link.

I just hope FGW are telling the whole truth this time, it might cost them more than ^29M if they aren^t.

http://www.firstgreatwestern.info/coffeeshop/index.php?topic=2348.0

A couple of other links regarding performance that others may have missed.

http://www.firstgreatwestern.info/coffeeshop/index.php?topic=4052.0

http://www.firstgreatwestern.info/coffeeshop/index.php?topic=763.0

I renewed my ticket from London to Reading and was told that there would be no discount.
So from paying ^332 in Dec-2008, I had to pay ^398 today! This is daylight robbery.
Also, on their performance page, it says that London to Thames Valley journeys still qualify for the 8% discount.
Isnt Reading in the Thames Valley?  ???

London - Reading is a high speed journey, so presume it uses that performance figure.

L&TV would be the stopping services from Paddington to Reading / Oxford and branch lines and the Reading - Gatwick Route Basingstokes etc..

Welcome to the Coffee Shop forum, by the way, ap00rva - and I'm sorry to hear about your lack of discount!  ::)

Renewed my season from Furze Platt to Zones 1-6 there was a 5% discount this year

Oh by the way not all Network Rail employees get free travel, we pay like everyone else

I'm another one on the Reading-Paddington highspeed service who's now paying ^398/month.  The 19-20% increase over December does sting, although I seem to remember the monthly prices dropped between 2007 and 2008 (^338 to ^332?), and an increase with inflation is valid (...I won't get into the 6% or 7% thing).

Clearly its good they're on time, but (prehaps predictably) in another way I feel a bit surprised, as I don't really notice the difference compared to my 2007 experiences.  I look at the "Passenger's Charter Performance Results" and it seems to say it only counts trains leaving Paddington between 1600 & 1900.  I don't finish work until 1830, so I'm never leaving in that window and yet I still get trains that are delayed (and still busy).  My other half said that, considering how much it now costs, maybe I should look into any compensation options for when things are delayed, but it turns out the compensation is only valid on journeys delayed by an hour or more - unlikely when its around 30 minutes to Reading...can't help but think (okay, 'wish'...) that were percentage-based instead.

mr.p

Welcome to the Coffee Shop forum, mr_p, and thanks for your comments.

I can only sympathise with all those who suffer such delays / fare increases on Reading - Paddington services: I'm rather embarrassed that my ^4 a day return daily commute is now so reliable, by comparison.  :-[

Clearly, FGW still have some work to do on improving their services east of Swindon!

You are looking at the wrong section.  The depart between 1600 - 1900 applies to stopping services in the thames valley.  As most reading to paddington journeys are made on HSS services then the HSS rules apply and all services are counted except sunday and the margin of delay allowed is up to 9 minutes.

Also compensation is not paid to holders of monthly or longer season tickets as you describe above.  This only applies to day and 7 day season tickets.

The comment about there not being much difference in the 2007 figures shows the problems you can get when compensating all people along a route for the delay / cancellations to the overall train service.  As Reading gets a pretty good service delays in one area will not necessasarily have much effect on your particular journey.  For example if trains are all delayed by 20 minutes  then at Reading you will not really notice that much as there are about 10 fast trains an hour in the peak.  However travelling from Chippenham for example with two trains an hour and you will not be happy.

Some years ago after the speed restrictions following the hatfield accident all annual season ticket holders had a cash refund for their journey.  It just so happened that that year I had bought my season ticket from a train station in London but did not actually use the train to get to work (bus and tube instead).  I still cashed the cheque  ;D but in reality I did not deserved to be compensated as i never used the train.

I believe in the future with smart cards etc holders of monthly and longer season tickets will automatically get a refund if their own train is late thus doing away with this anomoly.  When it is going to happen that is another question.

Crikey! I'll believe that when I see it! How on earth would you determine what train a passenger boarded? Unless the actual trains are going to have readers on them that ticket holders will swipe their tickets on?

This is a problem that LU have not adequately addressed with their pay as you go Oyster cards.  Off peak on the tube starts at 9:30 and you can legally travel on an off peak ticket if you pass through the gates at 9:28, buy a coffee on the platform and board the train at 9:32, but if you do that Oyster will charge you a peak fare.

When we have "smart" ticketing on National rail this will also be a problem.  I am sure that the TOCs do not want people quequing up blocking the gates and then all trying to touch in the second the peak ends and then running to catch their train which is leaving a minute later.   

The system for compensating monthly or longer period season ticket holders is to end and a new system called "Delay/Repay" will compensate holders for actual journeys taken only.  Quote from the dft:
This was in the new Cross Country franchise announcement.

Interesting stuff.  Thanks Super Tm and Zo^ for the tips.

This is not going  to change.  The time you touch in is the time which decides if your journey is peak or off peak.

I could just about see this being relaxed at outlying stations where the next train is not for 30 minutes. 

I would have thought they could start charging the off peak rate once the last peak trains his departed the station.

We don't seem to be able to design sensible systems anymore.

What you could do is move the smart card reader to the train and you touch in when you board. The TM or inspector would have a portable reader to check you'd touched in.

For intermediate journies you could touch out as well otherwise you get charge the for wherever the train is going. Which would be an incentive if its a Penzance train!

This is similar to the system in use on the continent where you buy an undated ticket and validate it on the platform or in the train tram or bus.

 

It would have to be the actual time, I fear ...
... what if the last peak train was delayed
... and what better way to get the higher rate from those not 'in the know' ("but you checked in at peak time, sir")

(sorry - I'm still very sore from the more that doubling of the fares from here for a day out in London, Saturdays excepted, and the selling of single tickets to my customers at one pound less than the cost of a return on more than one occasion!)

The peak at least at some stations though ends at the time the first off peak train departs, they are going to have to allow you onto the platform before this.

The ticket machines at Nailsea won't sell you an off-peak ticket until the machine clock gets to 0930.  Problem is, the first off-peak train from Nailsea departs at 0930 - so unless you can teleport yourself aboard, you just can't do it.

Perhaps that's why our local cheery chap with an Avantix machine has taken to posting a nice hand-written notice next to the ticket machines, inviting intending passengers up to his cabin - where he is happy to sell you an off-peak ticket for the 0930, at any time from 0900 onwards!

It's just not consistent, is it?  ::)  >:(

To be honest there isn't ever going to be a way of a perfect system. (yes I sound Pesimistic ::) )

For example, If you touch on at the Barriers at Temple Meads at say 8:20 Intending to catch an Off Peak Service at 09:00 How does the computer know that your not going to get breakfast at Bonaparts and wait for the 9:00 or maybe enter the First Class Lounge?? thus still leaving at Off Peak.

The other problem would be for example. A Stopping Train leaves London Paddington at 08:28 for arguements sake, this is during peak hours. Off Peak starts at 08:30 Anyone with the slightest common sense is going to board the Train at Ealing Broadway at say 08:38. This works on the buses with Bus Passes. If a Bus leaves a Bus Station at 08:54, you would go to a stop where the bus arrives at 09:00 normally a few hundred yards up the road which means it will be valid.

They could limit it so that the peak hours are set to when the train departs it's starting point. Take a 09:05 Departure from Weston Super Mare. This has departed for arguements sake during peak hours. Yet when it arrives at Nailsea & Backwell at 09:32 (during off peak hours) are you going to tell passengers that they cannot board the train with off peak fares because the train departed at 09:05 from it's starting point during peak hours. Can you imagine what trouble that would cause if it was 12:30 in the afternoon at Bristol, yet off peak tickets are still not valid because the train departed at 07:00 from Scotland???

Generally i'm not idea critercising. But as I work in IT you realise it's not always possible for a computer to do a humans job, simply because computers can only carry out what they are told to do, they cannot offer human discrestion. Which a human can ;)

I was thinking that if smartcard tickets were to be adopted as standard and paper tickets withdrawn there is the potential for unlimited travel season tickets to be withdrawn and passengers charged for individual journeys.

Returning to the original question, given that I believe that

1) Season tickets prices to Paddington from Reading are the same as from all intermediate stations to Didcot (eg Tilehurst etc)
2) These intermediate stations still qualify for a 8% discount
3) Season tickets allow you to alight at any intermediate station on your journey

Then you could change your season ticket to Tilehurst -> Paddington, still board at Reading and getting a 8% discount on your ticket price?

Welcome to the Coffee Shop forum, cholsey!

I'm not an expert on season tickets, but as you will have seen, we do have other members here who are - and I'm sure they'll be able to offer further guidance.  ;)

I can't comment on the route in question, but if you change any aspect of your season ticket, you don't qualify for a discount when renewing it. So if you had an annual from Reading to London, and changed it to Tilehurst to London, you wouldn't get a discount at the time of the change. It might be worth it for monthly tickets though, as you only lose the discount for a month.

Although with how performance is also improving on the LTV side, I would expect that the discount for that may go in a month or so.

If a delay to a peak train resulted on people being able to use off peak tickets on it then surely that is a good thing - lower fares for the passenger and an added incentive to the TOC to aviod delays

Talking about season ticket renewals, I got my six free tickets today. Curiously, you don't appear to have to carry your season ticket with you, with the result that the restriction about non transferability seems virtually unenforceable?

It says in the accompanying letter "You - or anyone you choose - can use these complimentary train tickets..." which makes it sound that they can be given away.

By the way, are these tickets valid in Weekend First with payment of the ^10 supplement?

Good point, which I hadn't noticed. Though I wonder then why they say on the back that they are non-transferable?

Mine are first class, but I'm sure the Standard variety could be used in Weekend First unless it specifically says otherwise on the tickets.

It's a shame Bank Holidays aren't included as well, but other than that minor gripe, I think it's an excellent initiative by FGW and one to be applauded.

This is very interesting, definitely worth trying. Thanks cholsey!

There is a bit of debate on the discount issue going on on the Charlbury town website, including an explanation of how the discount is now being calculated by FGW, at http://www.charlbury.info/cgi-bin/dview.cgi?thread=755 (http://www.charlbury.info/cgi-bin/dview.cgi?thread=755)

Why not try [url also removed: see grahame's post below]

Welcome to the forum, Mernolen, but alas I fail to see the relevance of this to season ticket renewals - was there a discount voucher for season tickets or any rail tickets at that site?

Please do follow up and let us know over the next day or two - otherwise one of the moderators / admin team will clean up these posts to keep us on topic  :D

For rail ticket, you can find at [url removed by moderation team]

Note - this appears to be a spam / advertising account.  I have blocked further posts from this user who, however, is welcome to read the terms and conditions that (s)he signed up to and explain how this post and his / her previous one fit within our user policy.  -- Graham

Seeing as this topic got raised, I figured I'd give you an update.

From Sunday 12th Feb discounts no longer apply to the LTV tickets, so this means FGW are now reaching all targets in terms of performance and no season tickets will be getting the passenger charter discount.

Cue local media reporting 'Rip Off Mid Year Unexpected Rise For Long Suffering Commuters'.

It's what has happened with other TOCs such as SWT when long term charter discounts stopped...

Paul