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Why do Plymouth services stop at Pewsy, Westbury and Castle Cary?

Hardly InterCity stations!

I can understand Exeter - London HSTs stopping.

Edit by Conner: This thread has been spilt and is for discussions on the London-West timetable and calling points.

They provide a useful link to Wilsthie often utilised by myself. Not everybody wants to go from a-b, some want to go from a-c!

Yes, but these stops have resulted in the end of the 3 hour time to Plymouth.

Have you seen the amount of people that get picked up at Westbury on services like the 15.05 PAD-PZ - there would an outcry to say the least.

Don't get me wrong, I (although do not know what the loadings are like) can see that the places warrant a frequent service.

But it is another eg of InterCity merging with local.

Westbury and stations (espec Pewsey) were always Intercity stations, to my knowledge.

If that's the case...... :P

No they have not!!

There are 0 services between London and Plymouth that take 3 hours. To achieve a 3 hour journey, then a service must ditch Taunton, Tiverton, Newton Abbot and Totnes. The Plymouth stoppers call at all of these so would be nowhere near 3 hours!

Castle Cary stops provide a connection to Weymouth which I recently used.
And it is quite a good connection.

Nothing else goes past Pewsey though.

Not sure if I understand you, biut Pewsey is on the mainline from Taunton-Reading

But just past the end of Local services to Reading and not between Castle Cray and Westbury.
Intercity trains are the only ones that go past to be able to stop.

What about local services from Exeter/Taunton to London (HSTs)?

Which were introduced in 2004/5.

Exactly. What about them stopping?

At Ivybridge?

What is the sence in that!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Pewsey is an Intercity station, always has been.
Exeter semi-fasts are not intercity, they have to slow journey times.
Pewsey stops have always been incoporated.
What is it with you and fast trains?
We like our trains to pick up people, so they need to stop at the right stations.
Penzance trains should be.
Penzance-St.Erth-Camborne-Redruth-Truro-St.Austell-Par-Bodmin Parkway-Liskeard-Plymouth-Totnes-Newton Abbot-Exeter St Davids-Taunton-Westbury-Reading-London Paddington
With Hayle, Saltash and Lostwithiel stops 3 times a day.
Morning and evening peaks should also call at Menheniot, St Germans and Devonport.

Plymouth trains should be:
Plymouth-Totnes-Newton Abbot-Exeter St Davids-Tiverton Parkway-Taunton-Castle Cary-Westbury-Pewsey-Newbury-Reading-London Paddington
Ivybridge should have a service 3 times a day.
Teignmouth and Dawlish should have one train a day.
The best 'tourist' train should stop at Slough if possible as well.

Er, too many stops at Westbury!! Also - all trains should stop Tiverton Parkway.

Yes. Also- Why do some trains skip Taunton (e.g. Cornish Riviera)?

;D ::) :P

I think every train ex PAD for the West of England after 16:00 calls at Newbury bar the 18:03 Golden Hind. This was far from the case years ago. Am sure this is to provide extra seats for the 'commuters' but most of these trains are already full with long distance passengers, its just a way of saying they are porviding more seats for the commuters when in reality they are making it a nightmare for both parties...

Pewsey was actually a Network Southeast station, it was the furthest West NSE station on the Western region I believe, or certainly on the B&H.

Tiverton Parkway was not included on the Penzance starters as they are going to be very busy by the time they get there and not that many people as many people will travel Tiverton-West of Plymouth than Tiverton-London.

I included Westbury in all services as it is a big link to Bristol, Portsmouth, Brighton, Weymouth etc. You can get to many places from Westbury, it is kind of where the Intercity and Local networks meet and a train every hour will improve connections for everyone.

Tiverton requires a service that equates to a train every 1-2 hours (think it's every hour and a quarter) on FGW IC. Unless you plan to run Plymouth - Paddington hourly (which you probably won't be able to anyway with stock allowances and formations) then some Penzance trains will HAVE to stop.

Besides does a Plymouth - London route really demand a service every half an hour in that respect (bearing in mind they'll arrive at Paddington/Plymouth 10 minutes apart really).

Thsi topic will be for discussions on the timetable for London-West.
I will be producing a timetable and publishing it soon and would like some views on it.

You simply can't drop Tiverton and add in Westbury!! Most people going to Bristol change at Taunton/Exeter anyway. Westbury doesn't need an hourly service, it adds more time to the journey than a stop at Tiverton and even if trains are busy, they are often full up to Taunton anyhow, so Tiverton is therefore a sensible stop!

I have got stopping points for London-West services but will need to do times.

PLY xx00
TOT xx27
NTA xx40
EXD xx00 (often xx02)
TIV xx16
TAU xx30
RDG xx50
PAD xx19

No, I think Bedwyn was the furthest west NSE station. That is why the Thames Turbo service terminates at Bedwyn.

That is also why there are few direct Pewsey to Bedwyn services.

Correct
 http://www.rodge.force9.co.uk/images/map.jpg

Thanks, Dm, for that very interesting map. i was surprised to see Exeter as part of NSE, and Birmingham/Worcester not in NSE!

Also interesting to see how today's "London and the South East" map relates.

Why did NSE stop at Bedwyn? Did it always? Why not Pewsey (which possibly deserves more local trains)?

There is a turn around facility at Bedwyn

How long will it take a HST to do Westbury-Frome and Frome-Castle Cary and returns.

NSE stops at Bedwyn because, well, NSE trains terminate there!

Exeter is on the map because Network South East operated there frequently.

As for Birmingham/Worcester, I think the official reason was that they were considered too far north.

Westbury - Frome is about 10 minutes, as is Frome-Castle Cary

Shut up!

Firstly learn to spell pewsey;

Pewsey has always been an intercity station, which I and hundreds of others use to get to london and the west country even as far as Cornwall.

Westbury and castle cary are always well used stations for intercity trains.

So these stops dont make a lot of difference to Plymouth services but pick up a number of passengers. You dont have a clue what ur banging on about.

Edit by GrahamE as administrator at 07:00 on 13th May. The above has been reported to the moderator team as a personal attack on another member.  I have asked the poster to modify this post and make other amends, but I got no response in the time given.   Most unusually (and with great regret) I have been left with little choice but to suspend the posting rights of this member.

Pewsey has always been an Intercity station too.

walrusthefirst, I agree with you and the timetable I am producing has incoporated many Pewsey, Castle Cary and Westbury stops to serve a large range of destination.

I would appreciate it if you were not as rude. >:( I am not familiar with this area - nor do I attempt to be.

*That's why some spellings may be wrong (although I do know how to spell Pewsey - it was a typo ;))
*That's why I did not realise that they were InterCity stations.

I have, by other friendly posts, learnt about the situation, and therefore my opinion has changed! I now understand why the calls are there.

So please think twice before personally attacking me again. The FGW area is large and "diverse" in services (if that's the best word). Most forum members know this.

Regards, Btline

In my view too, the post by walrusthefirst was well out of order, and that view is shared by the rest of the moderator team.  Walrusthefirst was asked to modify his post and make other appropriate amends within a certain amount of time, but failed to do so (or respond in any other way) within that time given, so his account has been suspended from posting for an indefinite period - read "for ever" if I never hear back.

It is with deep regret that such action was taken, and it's very unusual indeed for such a step to be necessary here; I think it's the first time I have ever written a post like this on "The Coffeeshop". However, the administrators (and I as site owner in particular) have some legal and moral obligations ... so let this be a reminder that we'll act if we have to.  Since the transgressing post has been quoted back in a later thread, admirably and by the member attacked, I have left the original in situ so that all members can read back through the full history.

I would just like to follow up a little bit aswell to point it back on topic.

My timetable is coming on nicely and I will be publishing it hopefully soon.

I would appreciate it if any further posts on this topic our on topic.

Anyway, I'm pretty sure Pewsey was an NSE station for a while as NSE used to run on to westbury, and if you look at the colour scheme at the station it is in NSE blue.

Perhaps he is on holiday........

I believe he actually had a valid point, and perhaps worded it harshly!

Edit by Grahame to add On the "railway" side, a valid point perhaps. On the "personal" side it was way out of order.  He has got back with me and stands by his attitude, suggesting that it was mild compared to his norm. On that basis, I have removed posting rights from his account.  Please excuse me adding this on to the end of your post - I really don't want to take the thread off topic any more!

IIRC NSE services never ran beyond Bedwyn, it is possible that BR ran NSE stock on Peak services to/from Westbury, prehaps Westbury is still painted in the old BR Provincal colours.

NB: When BR was sectorized, Pewsey had to be an Inter-City station (or a closed station) as only Inter-City services passed through, same as in the case of Lockerbie.

Also IIRC Cheltenham Spa was originally an Inter-City station, however it WAS the only station operated by Inter-City Cross Country so to close a small problem Cheltenham Spa was transfered to South Wales & West ready for the big  BR sell off, (some might call it RIP OFF).

D/m:

They would have had a valid point, had s(he) made it earlier. As I said before, I misunderstood the type of services running in that region and assumed that Pewsey would have additional local services. Just to clarify: I now can see that Pewsey is an InterCity station and needs  HSTs/180s. In fact, why not give them more?

And the spelling I have already explained.

------------

Back on topic: i was wondering why have not put in a reversal at Pewsey and extend the "NSE" service to there. I suppose:

*a - not enough Thames Turbos ::)
*b - Pewsey is more of a P&R station for long distance London travel

Any ideas?

I've used Pewsey - sporadically - over the years. I was even there in the late '60s early '70s when it had just 2 trains a day each way.  And I have seen it grow.  Yes, major traffic is London; yes, mostly park and ride (I've had trouble getting in to the car park at all) and it's good to see a healthy number of people boarding.  The catchment area is huge (geographically) and with a fast and regular/reasonably frequent London service and more parking I would expect it to continue to flourish.  I'll leave others to put specifics to "fast" and "frequent"  ;)

I think Pewsey is similar to Penkridge (between Wolverhapmton and Stafford on the B'ham branch of the WCML).

*Major P&R railhead for commuters.

*Gets relatively few trains (compared to those which speed through).

*The few trains are used well.

I looked in the timetable, and there are no "fast" trains to/from London in the peaks. Off peak, it is about an hour, peak it is longer.

NB: The only reason Penkridge remained open during Beeching, is that "Lord X of Penkridge" threatened to remove the rights for the WCML to run across his land if the station was closed!

Conner, I would like to see this timetable because I am doing one too. Maybe you could send it to me.

Welcome to the forum Adelante -or shall we call you 180?

Yeh, I will do that, it is not finished yet but please take a look.

And Welcome to the Forum, do you like Adelantes?

The 06.00 Plymouth to Paddington arrives in Paddington at 09.00(3 Hours)after calling Newton Abott,Exeter.Taunton and Reading and is aimed at the business market from Plymouth where it competes with air south wests early morning Plymouth/Gatwick hence the very tight timings required on this service.

Yes, but how often does it achieve an on-time arrival at Paddington?

[/quote]
The 06.00 Plymouth to Paddington arrives in Paddington at 09.00(3 Hours)after calling Newton Abott,Exeter.Taunton and Reading and is aimed at the business market from Plymouth where it competes with air south wests early morning Plymouth/Gatwick hence the very tight timings required on this service.
[/quote]

No contest in my mind. the ASW service departs at 0645, and anyone arriving later than 0615 is denied boarding. Realistically you need to be arriving at the airport around 0600 latest. It arrives at LGW at 0830, so the earliest plausible arrival at Victoria is around 0915. (Though it has a slight advantage in that Thameslink services can take you direct into the city.)

Or you sit and snooze on the train for 3 hours.

More proof the train is the way forwards...

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/cornwall/7453928.stm

Seems a curious time to cease the service, half way through the scottish school holidays. Suspect bookings have been much poorer than expected.

Routes where the train alternative takes 5 hrs plus probably have a place, but those where you can do the train journey in around 3 hours really shouldn't survive (eg Bristol - Manchester).

The 3hour 0600 Plymouth/Paddington was the result of pressure by the regions business leaders for a fast earlier arrival in Paddington than the "Hind".To achieve this FGW initially used 180s with their superior excelleration to keep to the tight timings.However I read somewhere on this Forum that FGW now use a high density 2+7 HST set on this service for the same reason.
 Also prior to the launch of the fast 0600, local airline ASW was claiming it could get you in London from Plymouth via Gatwick/Victoria earlier than the "Hind".Hence FGW launched the 3 hour 0600 Pymouth/Paddington service.

I know that. Besides, it used to be the 0548 PLY-PAD which arrived at 0848. Much better IMHO

Air South West recently launched new flights from Plymouth/Newquay to Newcastle/Glasgow
http://www.airsouthwest.com/news/shownews.php?ne_id=184
Will be interesting to see if they survive as well.

Coincidentally, John, a colleague and I were today invited to a meeting in Manchester in September.  Reading our e-mails, we both immediately said, 'Alright - but we'll go by train!'

 ;D

Good. I'm boycotting the promotion that I was invited to today (goodness knows why) by ASW and City Inn to promote ASW's new services from Bristol.

This service has the least amount of 'padding' in it throughout the whole of the timetable.  And trust me, we get serious grief from 'highers' if it arrives on time and is not out on-time (never mind the fact we got to get you peeps on board first  ;D).

I was once told that if it did not get out of Taunton as close to on-time as possible that there is a freighter service that gets in the way around Westbury that then causes delays (have no idea whether that is true or not though.)

I cannot remember whether or not the 2+7 set is on this service or not, but would make sense to axe the buffet to help the acceleration, as long as a decent trolley service was available. (Can+Worms=Open.)

Booked 2+7 no buffet. It overtakes a FGW HST at Westbury, which probably delays it. Arrived 6 late today.

Which surely goes to prove that the 0548-0848 timing would be better - unless the whole mental issue of leaving Plymouth before 0600 is the reason for its current timing.

It used to overtake the service at Westbury at Taunton, which waited at Taunton for around 15 minutes