Great Western Coffee Shop

FGW have come in for much stick in the press over the downgrading of the internals of the HST sets.  The ridiculously high unsprung seats set in toast rack style, the over tinted windows and the mega bright lighting.  But credit where it is due.  Class 158 multiple units in the devon area are appearing with comfortablestandard seats that are recovered in FGW wavy line blue.  I heard that the HST seats were as bad as they are due to health and safety demands.  If this is so why are there different standard for the multiple units.

Could it be that the arguement is spurious and merely covers the need to shoe horn extra seats into an HST by reducing passenger comfort?

Nothing wrong with Refurb HSTs....Hsts were constructed in the 1970s whilst 158 were built late 1980s early 1990s and thus are constructed to more modern regulations.
Hst seats are this style to meet  modern safety regulations, its personal preference if you dont like them ,........although try a 4 hr journey on a voyager for uncomfortable

To be frank, on a I went on a double Voyager Sunday, had a carrige to myself nearly and found the journey a lot better to that of the HST I had down!

A shame they don't think about doubling the things up on weekdays...

Actually I was thinking about this at Oxford the other day, very lightly loaded HST's terminate there, where as the Voyager behind them travelling up north is often rammed and standing.

I've often thought that a more logical idea would be to extend one of the Paddington - Oxford fast HST's all the way to Birmingham New Street, in place of the xx.40 departures off Reading, and use the released sets from this service to double up the Bournemouth services. In order to provide more seating capacity, and a faster journey time on the longer trips, the double voyagers could go via Solihull, whilst the extended HST could go via Coventry, where it will do a better job of taking the passenger loadings towards New Street than Voyagers. I realise that this may theoretically be impractical with regards to stock positioning, but would be a more suitable, as we are currently in a situation where we have lightly loaded 8 car HST's running around whilst, packed 4 and 5 car trains struggle. I've seen terminating HST's virtually empty whilst passengers have been told they are unable to board the Voyagers on a fair few occasions!

IC XC and Virgin used to provide Paddington - Birmingham services, so it wouldn't make any difference who ran it, be it Cross Country or Great Western. The only possible flaw might be the loss of a few through services to Manchester from Reading and Oxford, and an HST taking up a full platform at New Street.

BNS is already rammed as it is, before the improved VWC timetable in may, almost doubling the service.


I dont see the business sence in up there personally.

158's are, (I've been told) subject to lesser red tape than HST's as their top speed is below 100MPH.

Problem is though, when XC lose even more 5 car voyagers to Virgin, the Bournemouth services are going to be even worse! 4 cars will be totally unsuitable for that service, 5 cars can really struggle a lot of the time!

It might not make good business sense, as the passengers will always cram on like they do, but it's not a very pleasant trip, and it still seems silly that certain HST's run around virtually empty whilst these trains struggle with the passenger loadings. The feeling of XC crews on this route is that doubled up Voyagers (or the return of HST's) is required...

All Voyager transfers have been completed.

I'm looking forward to summer!

No, there are still 4 or so still to go in December IIRC.

Fortunately at the weekends we're pretty much getting double sets on every service after and including 1045 off Bournemouth.

By the way, glenno, welcome to the forum!

Good to see that you've started an interesting debate: thanks!

Chris  :)

Didn't know Barnes was rammed?  ;) ;D

Oh? I heard it was :P

Plus, XC will have 5 refurb'd hsts sometime this year, which will free up voyagers for them, unless they've been procured by virgin as well?

The Voyagers that are going, were always going to go.

The HSTs are additional stock for the Plymouth route.

Five Voyagers will run double on the Plym to Ed route from the Summer.

Single (5 car) voyagers will remain on the Bournmouth route.

I have to say, that running HSTs from BNS to Padd would be an excellent idea.

But why not run them to Moor Street (the new EMPTY terminal platforms)?

Will they now? News to my train diagramming buddies!

Unsure why Plymouth itself needs a boosted summer service?

Penzance/Paignton and Newquay trains are the packed ones.

Don't quote ME on that, but XC have said that they will introduce longer Voyagers (and the HSTs) on their main route Ply-Ed.

This may change.

That's more of a case the arm does one thing while the leg does another.

I believe the first additional HST for XC will come in in the next few months.

Probably that ex Midland Mainline one, as it is the only one which is configured for HST running. The other coaches have had to be rewired (ie will take months to do!).

The power cars have got to be muted yet!

It is likely they will not be for the sets that operate in summer, if the rumours are correct.

Which if it goes as quickly as 43002's and 43003's did won't take long.

Talking of extra HSTs, what is it like on the Adelante front?

Are we down to 3 units yet? I know that several have been going to Oxley each Monday for the last few weeks.

The 1606 Worcs-Padd was a 180 again today.  >:(