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Has anyone got any more info about this 150 movement from ATW??  Seems absolutely crazy to me, when ATW need these trains for their newly introduced services. 

Surely ATW would be best to give some 158s up, which is the type of stock FGW really need, and ATW wont require so much if they get the 180s.

Is the movement to be a permanent one?

IIRC, all of the 158's are in traffic on long distance north > south services. (which 150's cant feasbly operate) most of them are being upgraded/refurb'd for the new signals trials on the cambrian line, before that get rolled out across the country.

So i'm farely sure these units arn't going ANYWHERE.

Also, nothings been confirmed by either parties. Until it get signed, sealed and announced. It's still only speculation.

Hi and welcome to the forum, I can^t answer your question directly but I^m sure someone in a better position will be along shortly. In the meantime there are probably a few threads here that may very well answer your question re stock allocation to different TOC^s, have a browse around.

But bear in mind that if the train stops in front of you at the time advertised with the same stock you travelled on yesterday and arrives at the your destination at the advertised time, then in all probability you are not in the FGW area, and in all likelihood not in the UK.

I'd say they are giving us more stock, perhaps as they are spare or otherwise in fairness as ATW probably run far more 4 car trains than FGW do!

Even if ATW do operate more stock as 4 car trains, thats hardly their fault that FGW didn't get things sorted first.  I fail to see how its fair that a TOC should pay for a refurb, then lose its stock weeks after. 

ATW refurb consisted of new seat covers and new marker lights along with a grotty livery.

Anyhow, theres still about 6 ex wessex ones.

I don't think its fair how we should be rammed into a carriage at the expense of Wales who have plenty of stock!

I do understand the point you make, but why allow the stock to go to ATW in the first place,for this to happen?? 

I hope ATW keep the 3+2 seating units, as these extra seats will be much required! 
The ex wessex 150s have all received a new livery with ATW as far as I am aware, and have started to receive new seat covers. 

Yes, but they're trying to run the railway for an entire country on just over the stock FGW have for a region.

I still don't think it's going to happen. As ATW are about to depoly the stock onto the valleys as iirc that platform lenghtening is now complete so they can do 6 cars instead of 4. (You think you get overcrowding in bristol, go try a peak valley line service...)

Go ask Northern for some stock, i'm sure they have plenty doing nothing out of there 281 Units (yes you read that correctly)

Why should wales suffer for firsts f**k up? It shouldnt. First have more money than they know what to do with, go order some new stock for gods sake!

I agree with Shazz And Rjames 87 I use ATW more than FGW We only have two FGW trains (I live in Kidwelly West Walesa) a one each way weekdays  So I have to use ATW before I can get any were near Cardiff  and its not very often ATW are late  they usually turn  and you can get a seat.  So because I have to go to Weymouth quit a lot its usaly then when the fun starts Cardiff Portsmouth or Parkway Weymouth I hope that ATW hang on to all their  stock if it ain't broken then don't fix it. I  used to like the journey from Southampton to Weymouth then some clown took the 442's  off some improvement.

But if the WAG has paid for the lease of the trains, then they not unreasonably expect them to run on ATW services. The problem is the contrast between one quasi government which sees the benefit in railways and sees overcrowding as unacceptable, and another which takes the contrary view.

iirc, the WAG funded these new trains from Midlands

Exactly, which is why I really dont understand the move!

But the Milford Haven to Manchester Piccadilly service which goes via Carmarthen, Cardiff, Hereford, Shrewsbury and Crewe, is 90% of the time a 175.  Also the Cardiff to North Wales service, and Manchester to North Wales services are 175's most of the time too.

I hardly ever see ATW running 158's these days - its always 175 or 150's mainly.  The Maesteg to Cheltenham Spa service is about the only service that uses 158's regularly as I think Ebbw Vale and Vale of Glamorgan lines are 150's and most valley lines are either 143 or 150.

The Cambrian Lines are 158s solely (unless this has changed in the last few months!).

Almost all of the trains to Holyhead are 158's and as thats a train every 2 hours, so thats easily eating 50% of the 158's ATW have

What shazz says is not quite right.

It is correct that 158s are largely the only trains running Shrewsbury to Aberystwyth - they are the ones which are having the radio-controlled signalling shortly.

As for everywhere else, the Valley lines are having (not all finished yet) platform extensions which enable 4 and in some cases 6 car trains to run - all 142/143/150.  If you travel at peak times on those services, full is not the word and train managers (horrible phrase) refuse to allow people to board sometimes.  They are also under instruction not to move down the aisle and attempt to collect fares on board unless they have a clear run to the rearmost carriage door in time for the next station stop.  (Question: why station stop?).

Cardiff Queen Street station, which is the sub-hub for the Valley lines - 5 routes pass through it, gets closed on international days because the platforms won't take the crowds.  Everyone has to queue outside Cardiff Central instead and they only get on the platform when their train's next.

As for fleet issues, ATW have 142/143/150/153/158/175.  For a while they used 37s with 4 carriages on the Rhymney Valley line at peak times.  Those got out of stations smartly!

When they took on the franchise, they had a plan to purchase 22 NEW train sets but WAG said no.  Instead, 22 tired old 150 sets were cascaded from First Scotrail.  And they've since been allowed a few more to run the Ebbw Valley line.

In broad terms, WAG have told ATW they have to make the Pacers last until 2018.  By which time the entire population of South Wales will be bobbing up and down rhythmically.

Welcome to the forum welshman. Some interesting insights into ATW's fleet there, particularly that WAG have told ATW to make their pacers last till 2018!  :o That sure is going to mean a lot of TLC from the crew at Canton for them to last that long. Guaranteed income for the companies who make spare parts for 142s and 143s! I understand that they are in much better condition than the fleet that FGW have trundling around Bristol and Exeter areas though.

Really? Im quite surprised at that as eveytime ive seen it its been a 175 and its supposed to be a 175 isnt it?   Occasionally the West Wales to Manchester is a 158 but 9 times out of 10 its a 175.   I remember only a couple of years ago all of them were 158's

From what i've seen, all but the early peak services at 158's

Are 143's aren't in that bad of a condition, OK they are horrible, but they have been recenltyish refurbished and will be again soon.

Interesting information there Welshman.

So basically its's

142/143's - Valley lines, occasionally on Swanline
150 - Valley lines, Ebbw Vale Line, Vale of Glamorgan Line, Swanline, possibly Heart of Wales line?
153 - Heart of Wales Line, Swanline, Shrewsbury to Crewe, Crewe to Chester
158 - West Wales-Manchester, Cardiff to Holyhead, Cardiff to Fishguard Harbour, Shrewsbury to Aberystwyth, Maesteg to Cheltenham Spa
175 - West Wales-Manchester, Cardiff to Holyhead, Manchester to Llandudno, Manchester to Holyhead, Swansea to West Wales??

I think Cardiff to Holyhead should be 175's as its one of the longest journey's ATW has - OK not as long as Milford Haven to Manchester, but certainly Cardiff-Holyhead is longer than Cardiff-Manchester.

I believe that the Conwy Valley Line services are generally Class 153 operated as well.

More Pacer refurbishments?

This is getting off topic but never mind. 

The theory is that all the south-north services - Milford/Cardiff/Manchester/Holyhead are supposed to be 175s.  I recently did Abergavenny to Manchester and back on a very comfortable and uncrowded 175 for one of ATW's special deals - ^10 each way.

Incidentally, the Milford to Manchester service has an ancient and honourable history.  Originally it was going to follow another route entirely but the engineers gave up - see  here  (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carmarthen_Aberystwyth_Line) about halfway down the page.

My father, who lived near where the engineers gave up and turned left at Strata Florida, said that the Carmarthen to Aberystwyth line was known locally as the M & M even though it never was.

I think we all might have missed something??? Arriva may have made the same mistake FGW made with the 158's, MAYBE, just maybe, some unit's leases were due for renewall this month and someone at ATW management forgot all about it and in the meantime FGW have sneaked in??? It happened to us!!!!

Thanks.  

Apparently they only have 8 153's though.  No wonder the Swanline is mainly 150's these days.

On the subject of ATW, anyone know how many of their 158's are in proper ATW colours? Most seem to be these days but we still have some in the silver Wales and West colour.  Most of the 175's still arent in the proper ATW colour, its feels like they are FGW trains!

Yes.  There are photos of 175s on the Heart of Wales line too.

And I forgot the bubble car! There's a 121 on the Cardiff Queen Street to Cardiff Bay service.

Thats what I thought which is why I was surprised most Cardiff-Holyhead trains are still 158's.

I often go from Cardiff to Manchester by train and occasionally its a 158 but mostly a 175 - I find them very nice and comfortable as well. And yes there are some good deals for tickets between South Wales and Manchester.

A 175 also did the Swanline (Swansea to Cardiff which stops at all the small stations like Skewen)  one day over the Christmas period I seem to remember. I was surprised as its hardly long distance and would be better off using a 158 on that service and a 175 on Cardiff-Holyhead.

All of our local fleet will be refurbished.
The 143's will have technical work carried out, a deep clean, re-upholstered seats, new seat covers, new toilet and a new colour sceme.

There was a 158 sat at Milford on Sunday lunchtime, unfortunately I can't quite remember if it was the new livery or not.