Great Western Coffee Shop

Wasn't it about now that GWR were required to move to Delay Repay under their franchise agreement?

Yes, sort of.

The Franchise Agreement (https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/486668/red-fgw-franchise-agreement.pdf) says:


As per the Definitions in the Franchise Agreement:

So it looks like it was far from guaranteed as long as GWR showed the "intention" and "good faith".

Looks like they've had a few questions regarding this on Twitter too...




Quite how their "good faith" means saying no at this moment and writing it off as a possibility before the current franchise expiry are compatible, I'm not too sure. That third tweet response also looks a little close to distorting the wording of the Franchise Agreement...

It could still happen then....20th is this Tuesday

My late edit (I was a bit trigger happy with posting before I was finished) would suggest that isn't happening.

Is there anything worse than an organisation which responds to dissatisfaction by saying "We're sorry you feel this way" or "we're sorry you're unhappy with this" - in other words "We don't agree with you, and/or we're not going to do anything about it"- it's an unfortunate habit on the Twitter feed whenever anyone expresses displeasure.

It's a customer service "technique" to close down a conversation that most good organisations grew out of years ago..... ::)

So how would you answer it, TG? While remaining true to the company's decision, obviously.

Maybe the DfT didn't like the plan from GWR, for whatever their reason. Doesn't necessarily mean GWR didn't offer it to the DfT. the high numbers of high-level failures not caused directly by GWR might have needed subsidy to dnsure they weren't out of pocket, for instance?

Not specifically about delay/repay, just a general point.

Just explain the decision - you can't apologise sincerely for the way someone else is feeling unless you intend to do something about it.

A good example - I've seen responses to people expressing dissatisfaction about long journeys being ruined by extreme and dangerous overcrowding prefixed with "I'm sorry you feel that way" - it's patronising and just gets peoples backs up.

I have to agree with TG here having received several 'I'm sorry that you feel that way..' responses from FGW over the years - although mine were in letter form rather than Twitter.

What would I say instead? How about "GWR took this decision because of X and Y. If you wish to you can complain to A B or C."
Make it practical rather and factual - the people that are writing in are doing so because they have an interest and clearly have some knowledge and expectation or change.

As for the decision itself, it doesn't surprise me. The only thing that does surprise me is that the DfT left the gate wide open.

It's a way of apologising without admitting if your wrong or not. Most front line staff won't know if their company is at fault or not, and unless the issue is obvious then it's better than no apology.

It works both ways. Some feel it's patronising others will think you're being rude unless you apologise. Everyone's different.

It's also a question of training /supplying a never-ending supply of specific answers to their customer service folks (who might not even work for the TOC)

I think the main issue here, is the extremely disappointing news that GWR have managed to wriggle out of providing the much fairer delay repay scheme for the next few years.

I think you're being slightly unfair, and you're complaint ought (as is often the case) be fired at the DfT for allowing such wordage in the franchise document. It is entirely possible that GWR carried out its contractual requirement.

By using the word 'wriggle' I certainly wasn't removing the DfT from the blame.  The fact they were allowed to wriggle in the first place is no doubt partly due to the wording of that clause.  Had it been more specific there would have been no opportunity to wriggle.

One wonders what has gone on behind the seams?  FOI request anyone?

well volunteered, Sir!

A suggestion on another forum is its introduction has been shelved by other direct award franchise's as well.

We're sorry you feel that way  ;)

They should just be honest and say they'd be technically insolvent within months if they implemented it right now ;)

There is something worse. A GWR Communications Manager saying they'll get back to you ASAP with a company statement regarding the non introduction of Delay Repay, and then not doing so.

On 20th September I was told:


 ::)

I find GWR take around 8-10 weeks to reply to emails, so ASAP is probably 6 weeks  ;D

I now have the official statement (a reminder email did the trick) from GWR regarding the non-implementation (at this time) of Delay Repay:

Well this:


...sounds completely different to this:



I hope it's the former and not the latter!

The subtext in the official GWR statement I got from a Communications Manager, seemingly at odds with the Customer Services platitudes given via twitter, is either:

We'd like to introduce 'Delay Repay' but the DfT are dragging their heels over the cost implications to the Direct Award we've agreed, or;

The DfT want us to introduce 'Delay Repay', but we are dragging our heels over how it is funded, re: the agreed funding of the Direct Award.

Both sides seemingly happy to do nothing by using the woolly wording in the Direct Award franchise agreement of March 2015. It may be good faith on the part of GWR and the DfT in their negotiations but it certainly doesn't project good faith to the users of GWR services.

It won't necessarily benefit season holders. While everyone benefits from each delay that qualifies, the loss of the 5%\10% renewal discount could offer a bigger a bigger refund, the longer it is claimable

Indeed, although the only discount trigger currently being paid is the 5% to LTV season tickets, and whilst that is likely to be the case for some time (the MAA is currently 3.9% below the trigger threshold), it is also unlikely that any other discounts will be offered any time soon as all the other figures are quite comfortably above the trigger levels.

It is, however, a much fairer system which reflects the delays passengers experience.

Allegedly, DfT asked for the delay repay schemes to be introduced in response to "passengers" complaining that they weren't given enough compensation for specific journeys.  "Passengers" as a group cannot really have it both ways...

Paul

Good news for those who want more compensation for train delays.  I think I remember Taplow Green saying he thought delays of 15 minutes should be entitled to compensation (rather than the current 30 minutes) and someone up at the DfT was obviously listening:

https://www.gov.uk/government/news/government-announces-improved-compensation-scheme-for-rail-passengers

It will take a few years to filter through to the franchises, and of course GWR need to adopt 'Delay Repay'  in the first place, but it reinforces the scheme's benefits of being a much fairer compensation system than the current charter system that some franchises, including GWR, still follow.

I'm hoping the decision of GWR/DfT not to introduce Delay/Repay on the 1st anniversary of the Greater Western Direct Award is because this development - Delay Repay 15 - was in the pipeline.

That will be a more positive reason than concerns about costs to the TOC or DfT.

Wow.......not sure if it was me that mentioned 15 mins but I'm happy to take the blame if it was!!!

What would also be good would be GWR automatically refunding people for tickets purchased through their website - for example in respect of an advance ticket for a particular train which is then cancelled/delayed, rather than customers having to go through the rigmarole of claiming for it.

Listen out for this forum's very own bobm on BBC Radio Wiltshire tomorrow morning between 0800-0815. Discussing 'Delay Repay 15'.

I'm told he's super-sub for grahame who is unavailable.

Automatic Delay Repay is offered by Virgin Trains (West Coast) for Advance Purchase ticket holders who purchased from them online.

Smartcard users on c2c receive automatic compensation for delays too. Their scheme kicks in after just 2 minutes delay! 3p per minute for 2-29 minutes,  then standard Delay Repay rates from 30 or more minutes. Credited to your Smartcard account for use against future ticket purchases, or converted to cheque (£5 minimum) on request.

More like bobm knows the subject much better than grahame  ;D

I agree,  bobm the best man for the job.

I'd love the platform,  but it would be car crash radio.  :P

Personally, I don't think bobm should be allowed anywhere near a radio microphone, (nor the sandwiches, for that matter), but it's fortunately not my decision.  :P ::) :o ;D

Excellent, Bob ... came across superb and very well put and said.   100 miles a day ... wow

But then a Swindon to London commuter does 150 miles a day...

A word of thanks to bignosemac who confirmed some of my research.

Happy to assist.

Anyone wishing to listen to bobm's BBC Radio Wiltshire appearance can do so at the following link:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/p048c1yx

Available until 13th November 2016. Forward to the 01:38:40 mark. Just after 8am on the original broadcast.

bobm's responses and observations were spot on. I particularly like the light hearted final comment. ;D

You can tell he's comfortable in a radio studio.

My cheque in the post bobm?   ;) :P ;D

Yes (despite my previous very 'tongue in cheek' comment), I too was very impressed with bobm's professionalism in front of a BBC radio studio microphone.  Thanks for explaining these changes so clearly, for the benefit of the listening public, Bob.  ;)