Great Western Coffee Shop

Picked up a FGW leaflet the other day titled Train Times Online, A guide to digital sources of information. It repeats what is mentioned in the Easter services alterations brochure about "customer trends indicate that digital is best".

So the question I ask is this the beginning of the end of rail timetables even PDF versions online as there is no mention of this type of timetable as being available. Could it be that FGW have managed to get this requirement dropped from the new franchise extension?

I know I'm being a bit extreme but efforts by ChrisB to see PDF versions of engineering work timetables for the upcoming Reading works published online have proved fruitless which makes me wonder if FGW are dropping even producing electronic versions of timetables now.

How much longer before Network Rail manage to persuade Dft to drop the requirement to publish the National Rail Timetable?

I can accept stopping paper timetables (unless they can be sold commercially), but it would definitely be a retrograde step if there are to be no more .pdf timetables.  ^Digital is best^ may be true, but the fact is that a .pdf timetable IS digital, so ^digital is best^ is NOT a reason for stopping online .pdf^s.

So is FGW seeking to do stop producing any timetables on paper AND .pdf?  Will they continue to offer .pdf Personal Timetables?

As far as abolishing paper timetables goes, it is not something that we are currently aiming towards and we are committed to continue producing them for the foreseeable future . We are however looking into reducing the amount of material we print. So far this has been done by managing stock deliveries and reducing wastage but the other main factor has been the reduction in uptake for printed material which has reduced by half in 5 years.

In terms Engineering work timetable, we are no longer producing timetables for short-term blockades. The advantages of this is that we can point customers to sources where they will find the latest information and times rather than rely on a printed booklet which is only as reliable as the day it is sent to the printers. Short-term engineering work very often involves numerous late notice amendments which come too late to be seen in a printed timetable. However, we are open to customer feedback and are looking into producing online .pdf timetables which can be altered at relatively short notice.

I can't answer the question about when Network Rail will seek to abolish printed timetables. I will mention that Holland don't produce any printed timetables. I would love to see how they manage it and will encourage my manager to send me on a business trip to find out!

Regarding Gordon's questions, we are certainly not looking to stop producing any timetables on paper and .pdf. We are looking at reducing paper timetables but will certainly continue producing .pdf versions of timetables as well as offering Personal Timetables.

Hope that helps you both! Rob

Many thanks for your detailed reply Rob.

Couple of questions regards providing .pdf timetables for times of engineering work. How much work would it involve to produce .pdf timetables for work such as the upcoming work at Reading, Swindon and Bath over the coming months? Do you have to produce a timetable for staff use that could be adapted for publishing online?

I agree that printing booklets for short term work is not worth the expense anymore in this modern digital age, but if it were fairly easy to produce .pdf timetables it would enhance the information provided online by FGW at times of engineering work.

It is good to hear that you are reducing the amount of timetable wastage by reducing the amount printed at the same time continuing to produce printed versions. I'm sure the day will come when this will cease and maybe a trip to Holland to see how it's done may be in order  ;)

Producing timetables takes up a considerable amount of time. As said previously, we can get several amendments in the weeks leading up to major blocks which can sometime undo a lot of hard work! We're recruiting a new manager who will specialise in engineering work so hopefully that'll allow some us to look in to producing timetables.

We don't produce timetables for staff. We do produce guides for customers and colleagues alike but aside from the Tome, nothing timetable wise is produced especially for staff.   

Thanks Rob, I^m reassured by what you say.  I wonder to what extent the generation of .pdf timetables for short term engineering work etc could be automated, even if there were some compromises on style, formatting etc.

Rob - do I assume this post is still referring to Engineering work timetables, or the general timetable?

If the latter - you *do* produce a colleague guide all-FGW line timetable - I have the current one, for example (legitimately, I may add)

You assume correctly, although apart from the cover, they are exactly the same. However, I have a few ideas to help improve the colleague version so watch this space FGW friends!

The FGW all line timetable is an excellent publication as is the SWT all line timetable.

GWR's as-printed timetables are still pretty easy to find on-line, but I recently found VTEC's ones are not - best found using Google. But at least they, and paper ones, exist. In December, SNCF put a note on what was their "TGV timetables" page (http://www.sncf.com/fr/actualite/l-info-trafic-tgv) announcing the end of the timetable sheet (fiche horaire). This was not a real public announcement, but it was picked up in the press. It was not clear at the time whether this applied to printed timetables provided in stations too.

They were pushing their journey planner app as all anyone would need, as in :"With the SNCF app, all the information on your journey is in your pocket." So, unlike a paper timetable? From later comments, it does seem that the paper ones are indeed no longer being produced.

The transport user group (Fnaut) were understandably indignant, pointing out that 39% of the French don't have a smart phone and 23% don't even have internet access at home. They demanded (in a rather CGT or RMT-ish tone of voice) the government intervene, on the grounds that this was a statutory duty of SNCF's.

I did wonder whether the same would be true of local (TER) timetables too, and went to look - and failed to get any. But they are still there, if you can find them. I had two problems. Firstly, the TER sub-sites are hard to reach from other SNCF sites. Then the timetable download page doesn't work with Firefox - but does with IE.

Still, it does look like a trend - in both senses: statistical and "this is the kind of hi-tech business we think we should look like".