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All across the Great Western territory => Active travel: Cyclists and walkers, including how the railways deal with them => Topic started by: grahame on February 06, 2015, 23:10:49



Title: Disused tube tunnels as cycle lanes?
Post by: grahame on February 06, 2015, 23:10:49
http://www.themovechannel.com/news/stories/abandoned-tube-tunnels-to-become-undeground-cycle-lanes-296/?

Quote
London's abandoned Tube tunnels could become underground cycle lanes, if the proposals from one architecture firm are given the green light.

There's Holborn Kingsway to Aldwych and Charing Cross to Green Park (covered by the article) - what more are there?

Only ones I can think of is the deep level District:
http://www.subbrit.org.uk/sb-sites/sites/s/south_kensington_station/index.shtml

and the London Bridge to King William Street:
http://www.abandonedstations.org.uk/King_William_Street_1.html


Title: Re: Disused tube tunnels as cycle lanes?
Post by: plymothian on February 07, 2015, 09:13:16
How about no.
If cyclists are unwilling to use existing facilities where they take a longer route, then why would they want to spend ages getting below ground and back up again adding to journey times?


Title: Re: Disused tube tunnels as cycle lanes?
Post by: devon_metro on February 07, 2015, 20:56:43
Green Park to Charing Cross isn't abandoned. Trains still use it, just not in passenger service. Not to mention the fact that it is deep underground!



Title: Re: Disused tube tunnels as cycle lanes?
Post by: ellendune on February 07, 2015, 22:14:35
So what is it used for then?


Title: Re: Disused tube tunnels as cycle lanes?
Post by: Brucey on February 07, 2015, 22:30:35
So what is it used for then?
Turning trains around at Green Park and for film crews who want a working/"up to date" platform etc.


Title: Re: Disused tube tunnels as cycle lanes?
Post by: JayMac on February 07, 2015, 23:02:42
The last Bond film, Skyfall, used the former Jubilee line platforms at Charing Cross. The stations in the film were Temple and Embankment, the former, in real life, having no deep-level tube lines. The stations were also incongruously coloured as Circle and District lines. Again, not deep level lines.

Charing Cross tube station since closure has also been used for the films The Bourne Ultimatum, 28 Weeks Later, Creep, as well as episodes of TV series Spooks and 24.


Title: Re: Disused tube tunnels as cycle lanes?
Post by: Cynthia on February 08, 2015, 13:09:32
Seems like a good idea in theory, and might attract cyclists who are nervous of riding in heavy traffic.  I'd be a bit worried on two scores though: Who would continue to finance the upkeep of abandoned tunnels, and keep them illuminated, and, well, just from a personal point of view, I'd find it a bit creepy cycling in an abandoned tunnel! :o


Title: Re: Disused tube tunnels as cycle lanes?
Post by: eightf48544 on February 08, 2015, 14:06:24
It's an interesting idea but not entirely practicle.

As has been mentioned you'll have to get your bike up and down which will take time. The lengths are relatively short so I would think you could do them on the surface as quick.

Then there are the maintenance and safety issues mentioned by Cynthia.

Good try C+.


Title: Re: Disused tube tunnels as cycle lanes?
Post by: Red Squirrel on February 08, 2015, 14:26:09
Seems like a good idea in theory, and might attract cyclists who are nervous of riding in heavy traffic.  I'd be a bit worried on two scores though: Who would continue to finance the upkeep of abandoned tunnels, and keep them illuminated, and, well, just from a personal point of view, I'd find it a bit creepy cycling in an abandoned tunnel! :o

In converting Combe Down Tunnel to a cycleway, most of the practical problems discussed here have been solved - plus they had bats to contend with, which may not be such an issue in central London. Combe Down Tunnel is 1672m long, has no intermediate ventillation, is bendy and has quite a restricted bore. However both ends are (now) at ground level - which really helps! - and it solves a useful problem of getting people out of Bath into the countryside to the south without needing to cycle over a big hill. Not sure that disused tube tunnels score quite so highly on the usefulness front.


Title: Re: Disused tube tunnels as cycle lanes?
Post by: Brucey on February 08, 2015, 16:30:27
I imagine the tunnels would be similar to the Woolwich foot tunnel (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Woolwich_foot_tunnel) and Greenwich foot tunnel (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Greenwich_foot_tunnel).

Neither are something I would now considering using alone.  I did start descending the stairs at the northern Woolwich entrance last year, but two things made me turn round: 1. the smell of urine, and 2. a very strange man started pestering me on the stairs about halfway down.  Immediately turned round and waited for the free ferry as I didn't want to be alone in the tunnel with some weirdo(s).

Personally, I wouldn't suggest anything else like this be built.


Title: Re: Disused tube tunnels as cycle lanes?
Post by: Electric train on February 08, 2015, 19:04:40
Think this is loony tunes thinking, cyclists just won't be bothered to go 60 feet down to cycle a mile and the have to com back up 60 feet.

Wheeled transport especially with pneumatic tyres belong on the road, not on a pavement or in a tube tunnel


Title: Re: Disused tube tunnels as cycle lanes?
Post by: stuving on February 08, 2015, 19:47:31
At first sight I though this was a student project. Maybe it is, since it won first prize at the London Planning Awards in the "Best Conceptual Project" competition. You can imagine, can't you...

Competitors had to submit three pictures, and fill in a form as follows:
Quote
This category is open to submissions such as masterplans, frameworks, concepts, planning briefs or
policy documents (not planning applications or unimplemented permissions). Please demonstrate how
the project fulfills the criteria below. You can use 150 words maximum to answer each criterion.
1. Is visionary and challenges the current status-quo
2. Addresses current local and strategic planning challenges such as housing, climate change, transport, employment and regeneration
3. Contributes to London^s world city status

The awards results page (http://=http://www.londonplanningawards.com/index.php/press-releases) includes a Guardian piece (among others) that concludes thus:
Quote
Personally, if I were trying to find a congestion-free way to reach the South Bank from Bloomsbury, I wouldn^t rent a Boris bike at platform level in Holborn station, cycle it five-odd minutes down a tunnel, dock it again and take a lift up to ground level, then rent another Boris bike only to be forced to wheel it across a bridge. It might look like fun for some, but the Underline is about as practical a way of clearing the roads as buying every Londoner their own miniature zeppelin.

Quite.


Title: Re: Disused tube tunnels as cycle lanes?
Post by: JayMac on February 08, 2015, 19:50:16
I'm not a Londoner, but where do I sign up for my miniature Zeppelin?  :P ;) ;D


Title: Re: Disused tube tunnels as cycle lanes?
Post by: Cynthia on February 09, 2015, 08:54:21
I imagine the tunnels would be similar to the Woolwich foot tunnel (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Woolwich_foot_tunnel) and Greenwich foot tunnel (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Greenwich_foot_tunnel).

Neither are something I would now considering using alone.  I did start descending the stairs at the northern Woolwich entrance last year, but two things made me turn round: 1. the smell of urine, and 2. a very strange man started pestering me on the stairs about halfway down.  Immediately turned round and waited for the free ferry as I didn't want to be alone in the tunnel with some weirdo(s).

Personally, I wouldn't suggest anything else like this be built.

Yes, Brucey, I would share your diffidence re personal safety, especially considering that there is probably no mobile signal in these tunnels?  All in all I think this idea's a bit of a non-runner.  (Or even a non-biker...)




Edit note: Quote marks fixed, for clarity. CfN.


Title: Re: Disused tube tunnels as cycle lanes?
Post by: basset44 on February 13, 2015, 09:56:19
Hi All,

Not a tube tunnel , but Wales are thinking about it has well

Plans to reopen abandoned Welsh railway tunnel described as an 'exciting opportunity' by Edwina Hart


http://www.walesonline.co.uk/news/wales-news/transport-minister-edwina-hart-describes-8632595

Basset


Title: Re: Disused tube tunnels as cycle lanes?
Post by: Alan Pettitt on February 13, 2015, 10:04:08
How about no.
If cyclists are unwilling to use existing facilities where they take a longer route, then why would they want to spend ages getting below ground and back up again adding to journey times?

Those stations that have a spiral emergency staircase could be great fun on a bike if they boarded over the steps.


Title: Re: Disused tube tunnels as cycle lanes?
Post by: paul7575 on February 13, 2015, 10:18:50
The Kingsway 'tram tunnel', which is of course nothing whatsoever to do with tube tunnels, would have theoretically made a reasonable cycle route, being originally cut and cover all the way from the entry ramp at Southampton Row to the embankment,  opening out at street level under Waterloo Bridge; however the southern section now contains the Aldwych underpass.  Its remaining length wouldn't benefit many.

(Ignoring my belief that cyclists would prefer to be on the surface.) 

Paul


Title: Re: Disused tube tunnels as cycle lanes?
Post by: Chris from Nailsea on February 14, 2015, 18:15:30
Hi All,
Not a tube tunnel , but Wales are thinking about it has well
Plans to reopen abandoned Welsh railway tunnel described as an 'exciting opportunity' by Edwina Hart
http://www.walesonline.co.uk/news/wales-news/transport-minister-edwina-hart-describes-8632595
Basset

Also discussed on the Coffee Shop forum, at http://www.firstgreatwestern.info/coffeeshop/index.php?topic=14989.0  ;)


Title: Re: Disused tube tunnels as cycle lanes?
Post by: grahame on February 14, 2015, 18:30:47
Interesting map from Transport for London showing where you can take your bike on the inuse tube:

https://www.tfl.gov.uk/cdn/static/cms/documents/bicycle-tube-map.pdf


Title: Re: Disused tube tunnels as cycle lanes?
Post by: ellendune on February 14, 2015, 19:15:13
Interesting map from Transport for London showing where you can take your bike on the inuse tube:

https://www.tfl.gov.uk/cdn/static/cms/documents/bicycle-tube-map.pdf

Basically not in the peak and not in the deep tube lines (presumably because of getting bikes up and down lifts and escalators). Though in that case I am not clear why Hendon Central to Collindale is excluded when you can take bikes of both neighbouring sections (so there should be no problems with either station). 


Title: Re: Disused tube tunnels as cycle lanes?
Post by: Adelante_CCT on February 15, 2015, 14:48:04

Basically not in the peak and not in the deep tube lines (presumably because of getting bikes up and down lifts and escalators). Though in that case I am not clear why Hendon Central to Collindale is excluded when you can take bikes of both neighbouring sections (so there should be no problems with either station). 

The reason for this I believe is because it goes through a long tunnel between Hendon and Collindale which for safety reasons cannot convey bikes on this section



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