Great Western Coffee Shop

I've been writing an "intelligent newcomer's guide" to finding the right fare - basically to help bewildered newcomers.  What have I missed?   What have I got wrong?   What have I over explained?  Examples, most of which will be TransWilts based, to follow in the full guide.

The most expensive ticket on which to make a train journey is likely to be ...

Any time
Any permitted route
Adult
With no railcard or concession
First Class
Single
For one person
Booked online by credit card and delivered by priority post

But you can probably make some big savings ^ let's look at each of those it turn.  Not all options apply in all cases, and the terms and conditions are just summarised here for your initial guidance.  Some options / concessions work together,  but with others you need to choose which is best for you.

Any time
* Anytime tickets let you travel at any time of day, but
* Offpeak tickets let you travel outside the rush hour, and any time at weekends
* Super Offpeak tickets let you travel at quieter times
* Advance tickets are bought the day before travel or earlier and for the train at a specific time
* Megatrain tickets on some routes are similar to Advance tickets

Any permitted route
* The "routing guide" defines the limits of "any permitted" and it can be quite flexible, but
* Tickets sold as ^via xxxxx^ or ^not via xxxxx^ may cost less
* Tickets sold as ^Particular train company only^ may cost less

Adult
* You can travel on an adult ticket at any age, but
* If you are aged 60 or over, a ^Senior Railcard^ may get you a lower fare
* If you are aged 55 or over, a ^Club 55^ promotion may be running and offer a lower fare
* If you are aged 16 to 25, a ^Young Person's Railcard^  may get you a lower fare
* If you are aged 5 to 15, you can travel on a child's ticket, usually at half price
* If you are aged under 5 (and reading this ^ you are very clever!) you can travel free with an adult

No railcard or concession
* You don't need a railcard or concession of any sort to travel, but
* If you are a member of HM forces, you can get reductions with a railcard
* If you are disabled, you can get reductions with a railcard
* If you are travelling in the South East, you can get reductions with a Network SE railcard
* If you are a visitor from outside the UK, you can buy BritRail tickets before you travel
* If you are a railway employee and / or family, you may get a concession on your travel
* If you are a railway employee at work (e.g. driving the train) you don't need a ticket
* If you are accompanying a visitor from outside the UK, you can get a residents Britrail pass
* If you are travelling to London for an international train or ferry connection, look at London CIV

First Class
* You can travel anywhere in the passenger area of a train with a First Class ticket, but
* If you travel standard class, closer seating & less extras included, it is usually cheaper
* Even with a First Class ticket, you can't travel on a special charter train

Single
* Tickets from "A" to "B" are available for almost all journeys in the United Kingdom, but
* If you buy a period return, it will cost less than two singles
* If you buy a day return, it will cost less that two singles (better discount than a period return too)
* If you are making multiple journeys on the same route, you can buy a season ticket
* If you are making multiple journeys in an area, look at Ranger, Rover and Freedom tickets
* If you are making multiple journeys and don't live in the UK, look at Britrail and Interrail passes

for one person
* Each person may buy their own ticket individually, but
* If you are in a group of three or more, look at ^Groupsave^ tickets
* If you are travelling with children, consider a ^Friends and family^ railcard
* If you are travelling with a friend, take a look at a ^two together^ railcard

booked online by credit card
* You can purchase online and get your tickets delivered to you, but
* Some online ticket sales companies charge credit card fees and others don't
* Some online ticket sales companies charge postage / deliveries and others don't
* Some Train Operating Companies give a web discount on some tickets
* If you buy online, you can pick up your tickets at a ticket vending machine (TVM)
* You will not be charged a credit card or delivery fee if you buy at the station / an agent
* You can also buy on the train if you join at a station where you cannot buy tickets

There are other ways to save too, for example
* If no day return is offered for your whole journey, you may find it cheaper to buy a day return to an intermediate station at which the train stops, then a day return from there to your destination. This can also help at the ^shoulder^ of peak and offpeak.
* If you are going for a few days, but no period return is offered, you may find it cheaper to but a period return to a destination station slightly further along the route
* If you have a trip that involves going to several destinations, you may be able to buy a ticket to the most distant and break your journey, rather than buying separate tickets.
* If something goes badly wrong and you are seriously delayed, you may be able to claim some of your fare back ^ usually in travel vouchers

And some useful add-ons too:

* You can add a sleeping berth on overnight services from London to Scotland / the South West
* You can add a travelcard for underground and buses to your ticket to London
* You can add entry to a tourist attraction
* You can add your ferry ticket to Ireland, Northern Ireland or Holland
* You can add a local bus journey in many towns
* You can add ^weekend first^ at weekends to upgrade to First Class

Everything mentioned above is legitimate provided that you stick to the terms and conditions of each pass and tickets that you use.  Good advise if offered on this forum, and I have tried to be accurate in this post, but I have had to simplify in places. It is your responsibility to check. Please remember that ticket conditions and options are complex, and that for some requests staff may not offer you the lowest price.

If you don't buy a ticket before you travel, when there's an opportunity at the station, or you travel on an incorrect ticket or do not adhere to the terms, you may be asked to pay the full single fare, you may be asked to pay a penalty fare, and you may be prosecuted.

Some thoughts:

1. Two adults who regularly travel together should consider a 'two together' railcard;
2. Even where a day return is available for the entire journey, it may be worth checking for a split - for example it is always worth splitting fares off the Severn Beach line at Temple Meads;
3. Do your research online - TVMs often offer more expensive options and can 'bury' more obvious cheaper routes (e.g. 'not via Birmingham' when travelling south from Worcester). If there's a queue behind you, you may get flustered and feel pressurised into buying an expensive ticket.

Edit: Missed the fact that you'd mentioned the 'two together' card...

The railcard for younger people is officially called the '16-25 Railcard' not, 'Young Person's Railcard'. This card may also be available if you are a mature student over 25, in full-time education.

I'm presenting this as reasons rather than loopholes ... new users  and things with known TransWilts examples ;) ... the objective of the final result is to help people find a good priced ticket and to persuade them to use the trains, and not to make them think "how silly" about some of the results of the system which - err - can be a bit silly!

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This can also help at the ^shoulder^ of peak and off-peak.
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This can also help in other circumstances, for example at the ^shoulder^ of peak and off-peak, or between different lines and/or train companies


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Do your research online - the lower cost options may be the less used and so less easy to find on a ticket vending machine, and indeed some options may be absent.  And you may do better research if you've not got a queue behind you.


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* If you are aged 16 to 25, a ^Young Person's Railcard^  may get you a lower fare
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* If you are aged 16 to 25, a ^16-25 Railcard^  may get you a lower fare ...
* and if you are a mature student (over 25), a ^16-25 Railcard^  may get you a lower fare

(but should that extra line go into "railcard and concession" as it's not really age based?)

I wouldn't say 'always'. Many Day Return fares from Severn Beach Line stations do not yield a saving when splitting at Bristol TM.

I thought maybe that 'always' was a hostage to fortune... ::) Just done a bit of furtling and I see that, as you say and very sensibly, there are some occasions where not only do you not pay significantly more for buying a through ticket, you actually make a saving. Makes perfect sense...

Always good to furtle.  ;D

I furtled too, just to make sure. There are some flows where a saving can still be had, coming off the SVB Line and splitting at Bristol TM, but there has been work done by FGW to reduce anomalies since the Severn Beach Line saw the introduction of the 'zonal' intra-line fares in 2007.

Isn't that called the Network card now? Network South East is no longer with us. Similar discounts can be got with the Annual Gold card which is a yearly season ticket issued from stations in the old Network South East area. Do stations outside the South East offer discounts on train tickets if you have an annual season ticket?

Dont forget the ^5 first class upgrade with an annual gold card.


Holders of Annual Gold Cards Season Tickets and Travelcards may buy a special First Class upgrade for ^5.00 (children ^2.50) when travelling on a Standard Class ticket which has received an Annual Gold Card discount.
This allows travel in First Class accommodation on trains within the Network Railcard area on for the date shown on the supplement ticket. If the return journey is made on another day, a further Supplement ticket must be purchased.
On Saturdays, Sundays and Public Holidays you may travel in First Accommodation by simply paying the supplement.
The Gold Card First Supplement ticket may be used in First Class after 1000 Monday to Friday and at any time on Saturdays, Sundays and Public Holidays. In addition, the Gold Card First Supplement cannot be used on journeys departing from any London terminal station or any intermediate journey between London and Clapham Junction inclusive between 1600 and 1900 (inclusive) Mondays to Fridays (except public holidays).
Gold Card First Supplement tickets are not valid for travel on services operated by CrossCountry, East Coast, East Midlands Trains (Mainline), Heathrow Express and Virgin Trains.

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* If you are travelling in the South East, you can get reductions with a Network SE railcard
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* If you are travelling in the South East, you can get reductions with a Network Railcard

Thanks

Thanks also for the Gold Card info, SDSPad; I think that was more in answer to Surrey455 than to my guide, right? 

P.S.

Of course, the Network Card is a frustrating for us who travel into London from places like Swindon, Chippenham, Melksham, Trowbridge and Westbury.    You can get a discount from the east of us, at Didcot.  You can get a discount from the south of us at Salisbury.  You can get a discount from the north of us at Evesham, and you can even get a discount from the west of us at Exeter ...

Grahame - when you write "intelligent newcomer's guide" do you mean 'intelligent railway' or 'intelligent man in the street'?
You are using words, titles, phrases that us lot will understand, but the non-railway user (and a number that do use the railway!) won't know.
Depending on the target market, it might be useful as a final step to hand it over to the aforesaid 'man in the street' to gauge reaction.  If you get a long blank look at the end of reading it, you'll know it needs rework!
PS: what it does demonstrate is how b****y complex our railway pricing is  ;) ;D

Another one,

If you live within Devon and Cornwall, and travel predominantly between stations in the 2 counties, a Devon and Cornwall railcard will save you money.


(It currently costs ^10, I saved in the region of ^100 last year)

There is one great advantage, though, of our local stations not being in the Network Railcard area, from a purely selfish point of view, a Senior Railcard can be used at any time, including for journeys to and from the Network area, whereas if the journey starts and finishes within the Network area time restrictions apply.

It's "Intelligent man in the street"


Probably to be followed up (on an online version) with links on each line.    One issue is that the man in the street needs to know the technical terms in order to ask for the tickets he needs / identify the right one on a TVM or web site, so I don't think we can avoid them, but they do need explaining.   Yet the more explanation you put into that original document, the less understandable it becomes.  So links, making it in effect a checklist for the more knowledgeable and an index for the newcomer is, perhaps, the way!


Indeed.

I will probably add something about other area cards, but to my knowledge (bearing in mind this is to be 'exampled' on TransWilts)  there are no such Wiltshire Railcards.    There was a Westbury to Weymouth experiment with senior bus passes - is that still running?

I picked up a leaflet on the Westbury-Weymouth bus pass discount recently (TWSW day) so I assume yes. 34% off Standard off-peak and anytime single and return tickets, 0930-2300 Mon-Fri, all day weekend's and public holidays. Journeys must start within these times.

Also available between Swindon-Worcester Foregate Street via Stroud.

Travel available with all TOCs on the routes concerned.

And applies to disabled as well as senior bus passes.

What a mine of information this site is!  I'm sure if I wanted to find a train (and appropriate fare) for a journey to a Beltaine Festival on a full moon with Sagittarius ascending, (when the cider apple fairies are performing their blossom dance) grahame would be able to  sort it for me!  Speaking of celebrating the coming of spring I have today ordered my Wrinkly's Railcard!  Oh, big deal, I hear you say.  Well, perhaps it is, for a self-confessed petrol-headed ex-rallydriving motorphile. 

My Senior Railcard has just come through the letter box; crikey, that was quick, I only ordered it yesterday!  Hope the trains on which I'm planning to travel are as prompt!  :D

I hope they are more prompt, we don't want them arriving the next day!  ;D

Oh I don't know - I miss the sleeper trains...  ;D ;D

Changing the subject slightly, but still within the bounds of this thread I think; what sort of ticket do I need? - at the moment, preferably a cheap one!  I logged onto FGW's site to explore my options for a quick outing on Monday, with which to Christen my new Railcard, and was horrified to see that it would cost me ^25.40 for an off-peak return to Newbury, compared to ^4.45 to Swindon or only ^9.65 to Oxford.  Why???  The possible time I'd chosen to travel would take me to Reading on a nice little circuitous route, although I noticed the Melksham-Westbury-Newbury option was the same price.  I asked one of the guys on the 'Live Chat' page why the fare was so expensive, which evoked a non-committal 'I couldn't possibly comment' type response. Oh well, as time is of the essence in my pre-op rusharound phase, I think I'll just trundle down to Trowbridge  for a couple of hours instead.  ^2 something-or-other; can't be bad!

If after, your trip to Trowbridge, you wished to continue to Newbury rather than go back to Melksham you can buy an Off Peak Day Return from Trowbridge to Newbury with with your railcard for ^10.55.  There are some direct trains from Westbury or you can double back via Reading.

Ok, thanks for that bobm, I will think about that possibility, but I am totally confused as to why it should only cost ^10.55 from Trowbridge to Newbury rather than the ^25 -odd from Melksham.  Was the fare structure as complicated prior to privatisation, I ask myself?

There are some dramatic differences between Melksham and Trowbridge fares when heading south via Westbury.  Some reasons:
a) You may be at the boundry of DAY return and PERIOD return
b) There may be a "via xxx" ticket from Trowbridge but not from Melksham
c) The fare setter may be SWT from Trowbridge and FGW from Melksham
d) The fare from Melksham may also be the Chippenham fare and date back to the 1966 - 1985 period when there was no service via Melksham to speak of.

Combine multiple reasons here and the results can be huge:
Trowbridge to Farnborough Main 22.90 superoffpeak return, 28.60 anytime return.
Melksham to Farnborough Main 38.50 off-peak return, 118.00 anytime return.
Look closer though, and you'll see the Melksham fares are period returns and the Trowbridge are day returns.
Again look closer, and you'll see the Trowbridge fares are via Salisbury, but no such restriction on the Melksham tickets.

You may also find cases where Melksham fares are much better value for your journey than Trowbridge ones.  You can take a day trip to Oxford on a Saturday or Sunday from Melksham for 14.60, but a ticket from Trowbridge costs 33.00 ... all fares quoted are adult, without railcard. Again - "day return" v "period return" and "Chippenha group" v "Westbury group".

Oooh, my head hurts....... ???