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Title: Aviation - Private Pilots Licenses and related discussions (split topic) Post by: Thatcham Crossing on April 12, 2013, 23:20:04 Must admit I hadn't looked at a METAR today but it felt like less than 20kts, although anything would feel light compared to the extreme wind chill we experienced whilst snow-mobiling up on a glacier on Wednesday.
It was blowing pretty-much straight down runway 01 though, no x-wind component to worry about today ;-) Title: Re: Aviation - Private Pilots Licenses and related discussions (split topic) Post by: TonyK on April 12, 2013, 23:26:25 Happiness is a limp windsock! I once flew in 20 knots, straight down 27 at dear old Filton. I went over the clubhouse rather than past it, did my fastest ever downwind leg, and landed almost as you would do in a Harrier.
Title: Re: Aviation - Private Pilots Licenses and related discussions (split topic) Post by: JayMac on April 12, 2013, 23:30:30 limp windsock! I get lots of spam-trapped emails that offer little blue pills to fix that. While we're at it. METAR? Title: Re: Aviation - Private Pilots Licenses and related discussions (split topic) Post by: TonyK on April 13, 2013, 21:02:24 METAR is one of Meteorological Terminal Aviation Routine Weather Report or Meteorological Aerodrome Report, depending on who you ask. It's a coded report to save time and effort, and so it can be broadcast using relatively primitive equipment. A METAR is a statement of the actual observed weather at an aerodrome, rather than a forecast. They are updated at intervals that reflect the importance of the airport involved, so hourly at Heathrow, less so at quieter places. They are collated by NOAA (National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration - an American agency), which makes them freely available, along with other weather information, here (http://www.aviationweather.gov/adds/metars/).
The current METAR for Bristol Airport is: EGGD 131920Z 18012KT 7000 -SHRA FEW002 BKN003 10/10 Q1007 This tells us that at EGGD (the ICAO code for Bristol, not BRS which is the IATA code), on the 13th day at 19.20 hours Zulu (or UTC, both of which are GMT) which is 20.20 hours BST, the wind was from the south (180) at 12 knots. Visibility is 7000 metres, with light showery rain. SHRA is showery rain, the minus sign signifies light, a plus sign would indicate heavy. There are a few clouds at 200 feet, with broken cloud at 300 feet. The temperature is 10 degrees celsius, with the dew point also 10 degrees celsius - that means the cloud base will be very close to the ground. The QNH atmospheric pressure, which is adjusted to give the sea level pressure even though Bristol Airport is 622 feet above is 1007 hPa (hectopascals - luckily equal to 1007 millibars). With altimeter set to this, an aircraft on the ground would show 622'. The other altimeter setting the pilot will be offered by the tower is QFE, which is the setting that would show his height above the highest part of the airfield - probably around 986 hPa. With the altimeter set to that, the pilot on the ground would see 0 feet. These numbers are vital, and need updating throughout a flight. The pressure in Tenerife tonight is 1018. Had a pilot not changed that on his approach to Bristol, he would be over 330 feet lower than he thought he was. All told, a murky old night at Lulsgate Bottom, with little chance of improvement over the next few hours. And possible work to do in the acronyms / abbreviations. Title: Re: Aviation - Private Pilots Licenses and related discussions (split topic) Post by: Chris from Nailsea on April 13, 2013, 21:14:52 Thanks for that very informative post, Four Track, Now! :D
However, I think we'll perhaps resist the temptation to add quite so many aviation abbreviations and acronyms to our list here on this generally railway-related forum! :P As an aside, here is an example of what can happen if things do go wrong - from the BBC (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-22134380): Quote All survive after jet lands in sea off Bali Indonesia An airliner has ended up in the sea off the Indonesian island of Bali after missing Denpasar airport runway, but all those on board survived. ::) Title: Re: Aviation - Private Pilots Licenses and related discussions (split topic) Post by: JayMac on April 13, 2013, 21:21:26 My thanks also for that detailed description of METAR.
My experience of flying aircraft starts and ends with Microsoft's Flight Simulator series of PC software. ;) Title: Re: Aviation - Private Pilots Licenses and related discussions (split topic) Post by: bobm on April 13, 2013, 21:22:09 Just for fun - here is the weather in Swindon thanks to my weather station.
(http://www.mbob.co.uk/weather/banner.php) Title: Re: Aviation - Private Pilots Licenses and related discussions (split topic) Post by: TonyK on April 14, 2013, 19:32:42 As an aside, here is an example of what can happen if things do go wrong - from the BBC (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-22134380): Quote All survive after jet lands in sea off Bali Indonesia ::)An airliner has ended up in the sea off the Indonesian island of Bali after missing Denpasar airport runway, but all those on board survived. I saw that, Chris. I've looked at the chart - Bali has a 3000 metre runway, with a modern ILS (Instrument landing system). It has very clear approach paths, all of which deliver the aircraft to 3000 feet at a point about 22 nautical miles from the runway threshold. There is water at both ends, and no obstructions to avoid, so final approach should be a doddle. There was light rain at the time. Boeing 737 is the most common aircraft type in the world - on average, there are about 1700 in the air at any given moment. A fully laden B737-800 should be able to land and stop in those conditions in less than 2000 metres, or around 2300 metres if autoland is used. The aircraft was virtually new, although I doubt they'll be mending it. It is too early to speculate on cause. Ladbrokes won't give me odds on pilot error, though. Excellent news that all got out relatively unscathed, though, which makes it a good landing in the normal parlance of aviation. A crash is a landing where someone gets badly hurt or worse. A landing is a crash where everybody walks (or in this case swims) away. As an aside, I have flown many times, as passenger as well as pilot. Unlike many on the aircraft, I listen to the safety briefing, check my two nearest exits, read the card, and feel under the seat to locate the lifejacket. Studies have shown clearly that people who do this are more likely to survive an accident to those that do not. My flying instructor used to call my pax briefings "scary" - "In the event of an accident involving a forced landing, get out as quickly as you can by any means possible. You can kick the roof off this plane, but please don't try it in the air. Get away as quickly as you can run - I'll be waiting half a mile away. Don't go round the front of the plane if the engine is running, because that propellor costs money, and is easily damaged. Sit back, relax, and enjoy your flight!" My thanks also for that detailed description of METAR. My experience of flying aircraft starts and ends with Microsoft's Flight Simulator series of PC software. ;) Mine started there, too. So that she could use the computer occasionally, and to get it out of my system, my wife bought me a trial lesson out of Bristol Airport. Later, I suffered a serious illness beginning with C. When I had recovered, I felt I was due a reward, so joined Bristol Aero Club at Filton. In total, I flew about 75 hours in Piper Cherokees, including quite a bit of solo, before a combination of changing regulations, closure of airfield, and the need to buy a new house grounded me again. It was the most fun I ever had in trousers, and I haven't ruled out a return to the skies. You can see me in my pomp here (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8KaLfjXGm2Y), filmed by Junior FTN. As a way of getting this on thread slightly, there's a nice overhead shot of BPW. And be careful with those blue pills. I knew a man who took too many. He died with a smile on his face, but the trouble they had getting the lid on the coffin... Title: Re: Aviation - Private Pilots Licenses and related discussions (split topic) Post by: Thatcham Crossing on April 14, 2013, 20:49:22 Back in the UK now 4 Track, courtesy of 2hrs 50mins in an Easyjet A319 between Keflavik and Luton.
I share many of your sentiments around flying - I got to around 275 hrs TT before I had to call a halt, mainly for reasons of financial priority, and continue to hold the hope that I will get back to it one day. I've been to Bali a couple of times, and Denpasar is a modern airport with a long runway and benign surroundings. Indonesia has long been a bit of an aviation black-spot though, and the national carrier Garuda (who I have flown with a few times) has only recently been granted permission to run flights in and out of the EU again, following a ban lasting several years. They are also notoriously slow at carrying-out and releasing the results of accident investigations, although the pressure will be on them in this case as Lion Air is a rapidly-growing carrier with mostly brand-new aircraft. Title: Re: Aviation - Private Pilots Licenses and related discussions (split topic) Post by: devon_metro on April 14, 2013, 22:31:06 They are also notoriously slow at carrying-out and releasing the results of accident investigations, although the pressure will be on them in this case as Lion Air is a rapidly-growing carrier with mostly brand-new aircraft. Ryanair of the East perhaps? Title: Re: Aviation - Private Pilots Licenses and related discussions (split topic) Post by: GBM on April 15, 2013, 05:09:39 Many thanks FTN for the aviation explanations.
No, they're not rail centered (but an adjunct to rail perhaps). Fascinating. :) Title: Re: Aviation - Private Pilots Licenses and related discussions (split topic) Post by: TonyK on April 15, 2013, 09:21:39 Indonesia has long been a bit of an aviation black-spot though, and the national carrier Garuda (who I have flown with a few times) has only recently been granted permission to run flights in and out of the EU again, following a ban lasting several years. GARUDA is one for the acronyms - Good Airline Run Under Dutch Administration. Competing at one time with BOAC - Better On A Camel, SABENA - Such A Bloody Experience, Never Again, DELTA - Delay Everyone's Luggage Through Atlanta, and AEROFLOT - An Exemplary Recurrence Of Forced Landings On Take-off. Garuda were at one time known for declaring fuel emergencies because of "unexpected headwinds". Other airlines have been known to do this as a matter of policy, including one with Irish origins that I shall not name, because it is cheaper. I think it was a Garuda flight that ran out of fuel on the runway at Heathrow, so having landed, it could not taxy to the stand. Airlines operating into Britain now fully understand that they cannot declare a fuel emergency, but should instead scream "MAYDAY! MAYDAY! MAYDAY!" (from the French "m'aidez" (help me)) to gain attention, with all the investigatory baggage that will follow. The aviation maxim is that you only have too much fuel if you are on fire, but captains always calculate their fuel uplift carefully, because unnecessary fuel adds weight which requires more fuel. So I always told the fuel guy "Tabs please" because in a PA28 there are metal tabs that show that there is 22 US gallons in each of the two wing tanks. I never flew with so many passengers (my maximum was always 3) or luggage that the fuel on board made too much difference. On a long-haul flight, though, the difference between profit and loss can be tiny. But for safety's sake, one should calculate the fuel based upon the weather, then plan an alternate airport, then add enough fuel for arrival at the alternate, plus 45 minutes spare. Another truism: You can make a small fortune from aviation. All you need to start with is a large fortune. Railways do figure in aviation, and are shown on maps. They are an excellent aid to navigation. One looks for three identifying features in a location, and the classic combo is a motorway, a river, and a railway. The tendency for the pilot is to make the ground features fit where he thinks he is, something that may explain the Bermuda triangle, or why I turned over the wrong Ross-on-Wye before approaching Filton from the wrong Thornbury. Pilots of light aircraft flying under visual flight rules (VFR) often follow railways, always keeping them off the port wing. With any geographical feature, the golden rule is "On the right, in the right". Title: Re: Aviation - Private Pilots Licenses and related discussions (split topic) Post by: Thatcham Crossing on April 15, 2013, 10:12:11 Quote I think it was a Garuda flight that ran out of fuel on the runway at Heathrow, so having landed, it could not taxy to the stand. Pretty sure this was actually Malaysian Airlines, I remember reading the AAIB Report, but you are right about the rest of it. Garuda used to operate into Gatwick when they last flew to the UK, and will be re-starting direct flights (using new 777's) to Jakarta from there later either later this year. One of my previous expeditions to Bali with them, back in 1995, routed Gatwick-Abu Dhabi-Bangkok-Jakarta-Denpasar, I think around 21 hours in all! Title: Re: Aviation - Private Pilots Licenses and related discussions (split topic) Post by: Chris from Nailsea on April 15, 2013, 21:35:43 Hmm. ::)
With respect, chaps, as these recent posts have strayed more than a little from the original topic of the Scilly Isles helicopter service, I'm rather inclined to split them off into a new topic of their own, if that's alright with you? ;) Title: Re: Aviation - Private Pilots Licenses and related discussions (split topic) Post by: Thatcham Crossing on April 15, 2013, 23:08:51 No worries, happy to stop the aviation-speak for now ;)
Title: Re: Aviation - Private Pilots Licenses and related discussions (split topic) Post by: TonyK on April 16, 2013, 08:44:14 Affirm ready for departure, G-FTN.
As anyone who has learnt to fly will know it is easy to drift from the intended course. Last aviation maxim: there are two types of pilot - those who have been lost, and those who will get lost. Title: Re: Aviation - Private Pilots Licenses and related discussions (split topic) Post by: GBM on April 18, 2013, 04:50:04 there are two types of pilot - those who have been lost, and those who will get lost.
Sounds like some of our rubber wheeled 'pilots' ;D :D Title: Re: Aviation - Private Pilots Licenses and related discussions (split topic) Post by: TonyK on April 18, 2013, 16:29:32 there are two types of pilot - those who have been lost, and those who will get lost. Sounds like some of our rubber wheeled 'pilots' ;D :D In a car, of course, you can pull over and ask directions, unless you're a man. Title: Re: Aviation - Private Pilots Licenses and related discussions (split topic) Post by: Chris from Nailsea on October 09, 2013, 14:43:07 From the BBC (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-humber-24457031):
Quote Humberside Airport emergency landing pilot dies (http://news.bbcimg.co.uk/media/images/70367000/jpg/_70367253_emergencylanding1.jpg) The plane was landed at Humberside Airport by a passenger under the guidance of two flying instructors A pilot who fell ill at the controls of his plane forcing his passenger to land the light aircraft has died, police have said. The man collapsed in the cockpit of the plane after taking off, leaving the "inexperienced" passenger to make an emergency landing. The plane landed at Humberside Airport under the guidance of instructors called in by air traffic controllers. Police said they were unable to confirm the cause of death. A spokesman for Humberside Police said: "The pilot of the plane sadly died last night. We are not treating it as suspicious and we are in a position whereby formal identification will take place later today." He added that a file would be prepared for the coroner. Police, fire and ambulance crews were called to the North Lincolnshire airport after a distress call was made from the light aircraft at about 18:25 BST. Two flying instructors were called in to advise the passenger, named only as "John", on how to bring the plane down and a RAF Sea King helicopter was scrambled to provide assistance. One of them, Roy Murray, said: "I think without any sort of talk-down he would have just gone into the ground and that would have been the end of it." The passenger and pilot were the only people on board the Cessna 172 aircraft, which had taken off from Sandtoft Airfield 25 miles (40km) away. It is believed the two men had flown to Skegness and were returning to Sandtoft when the pilot collapsed. Speaking at a press conference earlier Mr Murray said the novice flyer did four circuits of the airport before landing at about 19:30. He said: "The gentleman was called John, that's all I knew. We had to get him to do two to three circuits. The last one was not very good so we told him to go round again and on the fourth one he managed it. He did a beautiful landing in my opinion. He was calm. He was answering the calls I made to him quite professionally. I would not be frightened to fly with him." Eyewitnesses described seeing sparks as the plane landed. Stuart Sykes, who saw the aircraft land, said: "It came down with a bump, a bump, a bump, hit the front end down, I heard some crashing and it's come to a halt." Two incoming flights were delayed while the aircraft was removed from the runway. Richard Tomlinson, a friend of the pilot and his passenger, told BBC Radio Sheffield the passenger was "nothing short of a hero". He said: "For somebody who is not a pilot but has been around airfields and been a passenger on several occasions to take control is nothing short of phenomenal. The man is nothing short of a hero." Mr Tomlinson, himself an amateur pilot, said of the man who died: was a "very experienced pilot". He added: "He had been flying for many years. Only this week I was sat having a cup of tea and airfield banter [with both men]. They were both very funny gentlemen to have a conversation with. It is very, very sad news." Title: Re: Aviation - Private Pilots Licenses and related discussions (split topic) Post by: TonyK on October 11, 2013, 11:29:56 This is an amazing story, but my sympathies are very much with the family of the deceased pilot. They have asked to be left out of the media frenzy, a completely understandable stance. I think, though, that some comments may be made about the age of the pilot, and as this thread concerns licensing of private pilots, inter alia here is the legal position regarding medical requirements.
As a very minimum, a pilot over the age of 70 flying under a National Private Pilots Licence (NPPL) would have to make an annual declaration of health, to the effect that he satisfies the health criteria for DVLA Group 2 professional drivers (https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/232964/At_a_glance.pdf). This would be countersigned by his GP, who would not give false information. If flying under a JAR PPL class 2 or the newer European equivalent, he would have an annual (expensive and far-reaching) examination by a CAA accredited Authorised Medical Examiner, with an ECG under exercise bi-annually. Age is no bar to flying. The procedures to stop medically unfit people from taking the controls are, in this country, robust. Sudden illness can overtake anyone without warning, and unfortunately for this chap, he happened to be airborne at the time. The otherwise safe conclusion of this flight is an amazing feat by all concerned. I know how difficult it can be to master the art of landing. My instructor told me as we began the lesson (it took several before he let me go alone) that he couldn't teach me to land a plane, but could help me to learn, and keep me safe in the meantime. That a person with no experience can be talked down in the dark is nothing short of magnificent work on behalf of all concerned. I shall say no more for now. Title: Re: Aviation - Private Pilots Licenses and related discussions (split topic) Post by: bobm on October 11, 2013, 11:44:03 The BBC (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-humber-24465646) have posted a follow-up with an interview with the passenger
Quote A passenger who was forced to land a light aircraft after his pilot fell ill at the controls said he panicked and then just thought of survival. John Wildey landed the plane at Humberside Airport on Tuesday night, under the guidance of instructors called in by air traffic controllers. The pilot, who has since died, had collapsed in the cockpit. Mr Wildey, 77, told BBC News he "just wanted to keep going, to get down". 'Controlled crash' Mr Wildey is a flying enthusiast but has never had a lesson. He said he "had plenty of doubts [about whether I'd survive], because I just didn't know what was going to happen". "Luckily [the instructors] were talking to me on the radio all the time, so that was helping me. They gave me confidence." He described how he landed the plane with a "right bump", saying it was like a "controlled crash, really". Mr Wildey said the pilot, who has not been identified at the request of his family, was a "brilliant" man. "We had a good laugh and a chat going out there and coming back and then it all happened," he said. "I really feel sorry for his wife and his relatives, they're the ones that have actually suffered." Title: Re: Aviation - Private Pilots Licenses and related discussions (split topic) Post by: Chris from Nailsea on October 11, 2013, 12:03:07 Mr Wildey is indeed a remarkable man. Further quotes, from the Telegraph (http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/aviation/10368972/Plane-passenger-recalls-terrifying-landing-at-Humberside-Airport.html):
Quote Mr Wildey, a former RAF employee, was the only passenger aboard. He said: "I did a Mayday, Mayday, Mayday, and they got back to me from Humberside. I didn't know what I was doing...and at one point it stalled and that terrified me." Air traffic controllers asked Mr Wildey to head to Humberside Airport, north Lincs. He located the Humber Bridge and found his way from there. "We sort of did a hop and bump and a crash landing. I was terrified, to be honest." But Mr Wildey added: "I would love to go up again." Title: Re: Aviation - Private Pilots Licenses and related discussions (split topic) Post by: Thatcham Crossing on October 11, 2013, 13:19:39 FTN said:
Quote That a person with no experience can be talked down in the dark is nothing short of magnificent work on behalf of all concerned. Seconded, by this former driver of light aeroplanes. Agree with everything else you said regarding the fairly stringent medical oversight (on all private pilots over 40, by the way) and the fact that things like this can unfortunately still happen. Title: Re: Aviation - Private Pilots Licenses and related discussions (split topic) Post by: TonyK on October 11, 2013, 13:25:36 I didn't know what I was doing...and at one point it stalled and that terrified me." Hell's teeth, he recovered from a stall? FTR, I knew what I was doing when I first stalled an aircraft, and it still terrified me. In the right conditions, it's good fun. Title: Re: Aviation - Private Pilots Licenses and related discussions (split topic) Post by: Chris from Nailsea on August 06, 2014, 19:54:22 From the BBC (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-28674029), a video report:
Quote Emergency plane landing 'hero' meets instructors In October 2013, John Wildey was forced to land a light aircraft at Humberside Airport after the pilot fell ill at the controls. The 78-year-old had no previous flying lessons and relied on the instructions given to him by air traffic controllers and a helicopter which helped guide him to safety. Now Mr Wildey has met the helicopter pilot for the first time. Dan Johnson reports. This page is printed from the "Coffee Shop" forum at http://gwr.passenger.chat which is provided by a customer of Great Western Railway. Views expressed are those of the individual posters concerned. Visit www.gwr.com for the official Great Western Railway website. Please contact the administrators of this site if you feel that content provided contravenes our posting rules ( see http://railcustomer.info/1761 ). The forum is hosted by Well House Consultants - http://www.wellho.net |