Great Western Coffee Shop

Shouldn't First Great Western ticket holders between X and Y routinely be able to use First bus services between X and Y?

Graham you should know better!

Tickets available on both bus and Trains (plus trams and ferries) is a nasty European integrated public transport concept.

Can't have that. Bus must compete with rail and you certainly and you can't have First train passengers using their tickets on First Buses as that would be anti competitive.

60 years ago I could travel one way between Bridgwater and Taunton with either a bus or rail ticket and return by the alternative mode and this facility was well advertised but of course both rail and bus operations were nationalised undertakings, rail as BR and Western National as a state owned company.
It just goes to show that Britain's transport infra structure has become more and more disintegrated with rail becoming even more so in that with some TOC's tickets now you must use the TOC issuing the ticket both ways.

Of course in London where the Law is made and where there is full political control of trains and buses, the Oyster scheme ensures that passengers can travel with many forms of transport and private enterprise has an opportunity to make money through concessions.  However, for the rest of the UK (not Northern Ireland) we are forced to endure the downside of competition, deregulated services and nothing much on the roads outside urban areas after six in the evenings, rendering a day out on public transport difficult.  We have minimal democratic control over public transport policy locally, mainly because the local authorities have limited powers themselves.

First Group and Stagecoach Holdings being two huge conglomerates should be able to integrate trains and buses, but when I want to get to Yatton Station from Clevedon, the most convenient route is operated by an independent, so no incentive there to integrate. First do now run an hourly service in the day, but when I return on a Sunday or any late evening, I have to use a taxi or call out a friend.  Plus Bus is a good effort and works well in some places, but the main requirement for that is a bus!

I have still heard no satisfactory explanation why integration good for the capital city but not for us non-metropolitan types.

Some of you lot could find a problem for every solution, here we have a common sense approach to getting passengers to where they need to get to during disruption but that part has completely passed you by!

The counter-argument is that this may offer a better deal than was available when everything was "integrated": I have not done any research so I don't know if it's true, but it's definitely a possibility. I'm certainly more than happy to save myself money and accept the restrictions on a single-TOC ticket as long as they provide a reasonable service between my origin and destination.

Yes!!!!!! I've often said this... I don't know how many times...!

Sometimes my friend goes to Bath by Train, but wishes to return home by Bus to save the 1 mile up hill walk to his house. He gets "stung" for ^5.90 on the Train and ^6.40 on the bus.

However the downside to that is "if" there was such a thing as integration between Bus and Train. I have a concessionary bus pass, so would it be reasonable for me to expect it to be valid for free travel on the train provided I followed the validity restrictions of the 09:30 rule................ ;)

This is really an issue for our friends at SW Travel Watch to promote for us isn't it?  My ex-colleague Chris Irwin, and his trusty friends such as Gordon Edwards, have great energy in this sort of area.  Is anyone going to the meeting in March in Taunton?  I cannot, unfortunately.

In Thames Trains days, rail returns from Oxford to London were valid on the overnight X90 coaches. Supposedly this continued some time into the FGWL era - I presume it's no longer the case but haven't been able to find any documentation anywhere!

You're quite right, I had forgotten that. I would guess this came about because Thames Trains and the Oxford Bus Company (which operates the X90 bus service) were under the same owning group, Go Ahead. Ticket weren't valid on the rival "Oxford Tube" service operated by Stagecoach. Presumably once the trains ceased to be operated by Go Ahead this arrangement went by the wayside due to financial considerations?

Incidentally, and I'm sure I have said this before, I've never understood why Go Ahead is capable of running a truly excellent bus service, in the form of the Oxford Bus Company buses and coaches, but only ever managed a lousy train service when it was in charge of Thames Trains.

Simple... Go Ahead joined with Keolis and formed Govia ;)

Sorry to learn that you are not able to attend the TravelWatch SouthWest meeting in Taunton on Saturday 2 March, swrural.

However, I understand that I am likely to be joined by grahame, bobm, bignosemac, johoare, Ollie and probably a few other members of this forum in their various representative roles, so our voices should be heard!  ;) :D ;D

Gosh, a FGWCS reunion!   ;D

If anyone does pursue this theme, important to distinguish between local and long distance transport.  It is possible to make a series of bus hops from (say) Yeovil to Bristol but I suspect FGW will not be happy to support accepting a free pensioner bus pass between those locations!  (Mind you.....).  ???

Yeovil to Bristol can be done on a through bus service. Hourly throughout the day, with only the service number changing in Wells. Does take 2^ hours mind.

Yes I knew that, which is why I chose the example, thanks BNM.

My apologies. By 'series of bus hops' I thought you were suggesting there wasn't a direct bus service.

It's me that's confused BNM.  I started the posting thinking about 'legs', and then had the brainwave(??) that Yeovil to Bristol was a better example as it was a long way on one bus and not National Express, on which of course you cannot use the bus pass.  Thanks, once again.  ;)

This make me wonder, what is the longest west country journey you can do on a OAP bus pass?

I offer Poole to Exeter (X53) Jurassic Coast.  We use the service occasionally.  Getting out of the little lanes at Beer is sometimes quite exciting with the double decker, especially when meeting the dustcart half way.

But the main point is 'what is local transport'?  The GLA is self defining, although I understand the TfL wants to take over half the home counties.

Sorry swrural, Can I just ask you to clarify if I may. Are you saying that Bus Passes are not valid on National Express? Or not valid on the journey from Yeovil - Bristol with First Bus?

Ta.

You've picked the winner! Not only the longest in the West Country, but the longest, by duration, in England, coming in at 4h35mins.

http://leytr.blogspot.co.uk/2009/02/englands-longest-bus-routes.html

Second longest is, I believe, Stagecoach South's 700 Coastliner service from Southsea to Brighton at 4h14min.

I've travelled both, end to end.

Bus passes are also valid off peak on registered sections of National Express routes.

http://www.buspassheaven.co.uk/nereg.pdf

http://www.ageuk.org.uk/money-matters/consumer-advice/publictransport-and-concessions/

"Older and disabled people are entitled to a free bus and a minimum concession of free off-peak travel on a local bus anywhere in England.  Off-peak times are between 9.30 am and 11 pm on working days and all day at weekends and public holidays. "

So Newbury to Frome on the 402 is a possible journey daily.  Frome to Newbury is only covered on Saturday, Sunday and bank holiday.  And as I read it, you can't book free places ahead, so if today's coach turns up full at Newbury, your next opportunity will be tomorrow ... if there's space.

Grahame - yes and dare one try it seems to be the message!

These restrictions apply (thanks for the link):

' Free passes are accepted on a "standby" basis only. Priority will always be given to farepaying and pre-booked passengers i.e. if you will only be able to travel if there are spare
seats available.
It is not possible to book seats using free passes, therefore there is no guarantee that you
will be able to travel when you wish, or that there will be a place on the coach to take you
back!
Please bear in mind time restrictions when travelling in other counties. If you change
onto a coach / or return from outside your county, if you travel outside the time
restriction of other counties, your pass may not be valid for travel on Mondays - Fridays.'

 - make it almost impossible for anyone to gamble, especially an elderly person.

I suspect that it would be necessary for the ordinary routes and services to be spelt out, if such an initiative were to be introduced.  I presume that, at the moment, we are all in the SW essentially subsidising GLA residents.  I knew we were subsidising rail commuters into London anyway.   :(


 

Just a small correction to Grahame's blog senior bus pass validity. The start time of 09.30 is the latest start time. It can be earlier ifthe LA is prepared to pay thecost entirely. In Oxfordshire the pass is valid from 09.00.

Between Aberystwyth and Machynlleth, Arriva Buses Wales (X32 bus), Arriva Trains Wales and Lloyds Coaches (X28 bus) have/had interavailable ticketing. I've never tried to use it myself, but I believe a rail ticket's return portion was available on either operator's bus while a ticket bought on the bus was valid return by rail but not by the other operator's bus. Not sure if this inititive is still operational though, Arriva's X32 bus certainly isn't.

Additionally, in Wales we have Cymru Connect (http://www.arrivatrainswales.co.uk/210510ConnectCymru/). However, this is only available from rail stations I believe, and when I asked my grandmother to investigate at Aberystwyth the responce was confused, so maybe the staff don't know about the tickets in order to sell them.

A number of towns in Wales without rail links have been shown on the East Coast journey planner for some time (and the new FirstGW journey planner, which uses the same system), and are now complete with their own 3-letter station codes. Of course if you try searching for services to/from these places it will fail, now making CymruConnect tickets available through that system would be a great step forward.

In searching for something completely different (an Edinburgh Tram thread, as that's due to open on 31st May according to http://www.scotsman.com/news/transport/edinburgh-trams-to-launch-on-31-may-1-3396033 ), I came across this.

It's a small step ... but ... train tickets are now valid on the final 234 bus from Chippenham to Melksham and Trowbridge; a very sensible step which allows the traveller who's normal route is the train to have the re-assurance that he can still get home if the misses the 20:12 off Swindon (and with that reassurance to regularly use the train with a know safety net).  It also helps - in a little way - generate a bit of extra traffic on that 234 bus which usually has quite a few spare seats available.

When this came in a couple of months back, there was some concern as to whether the 234 bus drivers would be aware of the new facility as it's so specific and not exactly commonplace for things like this to happen.  So far, those fears have been completely groundless, but if anyone hears otherwise please let me know.  We have mechanisms in place just in case ...

This ended around 2008-2009 and was very useful.

Used it again tonight ... and ticket was accepted without question.  A second passenger using it was on his way from Bristol to Melksham, have travelled Melksham to Bristol all the way by train earlier in the day.   And he was extolling the virtues of the new service ... a non-driver who's found it makes such a difference to Brighton and Bristol.