Great Western Coffee Shop

Campaign for Better Transport has criticised MTLS , and says that the DfT is to blame for fare rises , not FGW (link below.)
http://www.thisisbath.co.uk/displayNode.jsp?nodeId=163490&command=displayContent&sourceNode=163316&contentPK=19169988&folderPk=89126&pNodeId=163037

Meanwhile it has called for the South West's MPs to intervene in what it says is a rolling stock crisis.

David Redgewell said Department for Transport decisions over how to allocate rolling stock had left FGW with a "diabolical" situation.

He said hundreds of passengers in the Bath and Wiltshire area had been left behind on platforms at the weekend because FGW could only run two-carriage trains.

Sigh, i do hope an enforcement happens this time, and they all end up coughing up 5k per head.

Why? Because they're refusing to pay the extortionate fares imposed by a company without considering the impact on it's customers. If an enforcement happens it will be publicity suicide for FGW.

i wouldnt call an increase of 30/60p (30p before the current drop) over the year as extortiante personally

If you go into a shop and see a bottle of wine that you think is too expensive then what do you do? take the bottle and refuse to pay because you think it's to expensive? I think anyone caught this time will be (and should be!) prosecuted and bear in mind they could face up to 3 months imprisonment and/or up to a ^1000 fine then is it really worth it? We just gotta face it, the DFT are responsible for these fare increases and nothing anyone does will change their mind!

The difference is you have the option to purchase the bottle of wine whereas many people need to use public transport in order to put food on their table. Furthermore the hypothetical bottle of wine wouldn't originally have been paid for with our taxes and our parents' taxes and our grandparents' taxes. The most First would dare give them is a penalty fare and to be honest it would cost them less to let people get away with it as it will provide MTLS with less press coverage which is the last thing First want.

So, going from the origional ^6.50 price it was before the price drop by 30p in september, commuters are loosing an entire ^75 a year (5 working days a week, 50 weeks of the year).

Theres far more pressing options than saving yourself ^75 quid a year quite frankly. and in fairness, if you commute, you tend to be in a fairly decent job. Which means your income goes up with inflation, which in turn means you can afford a MEASLY ^75 a year. Even i get more than ^75 wage increase per year in a dead end part time job stacking shelves.

I fail to see what you're all fussing about. There are more pressing issues on the FGW network that need resolving.

I do hope FGW enforce every penalty fare if a fare strike happens.

An interesting article from Bridgwater , where there will be a 9% rise on standard single tickets to Exeter and London , and a 9% increase on open return fares to London with seven-day season tickets to the capital rising from ^238.40 to ^261.70 (link below.)
http://www.rmtbristol.org.uk/2007/12/rail_fare_hikes_set_to_hit_tra.html#more

Andrew Haines :

"We are investing ^200 million in trains stations and customer services, and have spent over ^70 million in the past year."

"More and more of the revenue we earn is being returned to government year by year as national transport policy and payment for it changes."

"Our investment includes achieving major carbon footprint reductions through fitting brand new engines that reduce emissions by 60 per cent, more seats and new train interiors on high speed trains and refreshed interiors on local trains, as well as station improvements and more staff."

Bridgwater MP Ian Liddell-Grainger :

"The South West depends on good links with the rest of the UK and if we want to expand we need a good system, and this news will put people off."

"Personally I am horrified by the condition of the trains and the standards seem to be badly slipping so it's not as if we are getting anything back for our money."

The fare rises are completely the fault of DfT but I do support a fare strike even if it seems unfair on FGW.  If FGW had any balls they would be blaming DfT for the increases rather than waffling on about investment.  The last strike was a great success.  Very few if any people actually travlled without a ticket but the strike generated loads of adverse publicity for FGW.  This is what they are really scared of not the few quid that they will loose in fares.   If MTLS are able to genartae a load of press coverage over high rail fares again, by whatever stategy, then they will have done the industry a favour because high fares are a real problem and one that the government must be made to face up to.

The stealing the bottle of wine analogy doesn't work.  The fare strike is more akin to refusing to pay your council tax on account of an exorbitant rise.  It is still wrong and is still against the law but it does have a political element that shoplifting does not have.

You know FGW, aren't free spirits. I know FGW aren't free spirits. However they did take on the franchise, thereby accepting some repsonsibility, and moreover their mangement and publicity machines does themselves no favours. The public and media perception seems to be that they have a tendency to be ' accident prone' and more rapacious than other rail companies. I doubt that that perception is down to MTLS but if it is, then we're happy to take credit for that.
Publicity against FGW, the service providers generates an equal amount of publicty highly critical of the government, the DFT and the Franchise system. The press and medai have made the connection and if MTLS decides on further action, whih may or may not be a fare strike, then the DfT will be forced onto the back foot again. Every little but helps. We are just doing our bit.
The last thing we have any intention of doing is criticising individual staff who do a stressful job under difficult circumstances.

You do have the option here, train, bus, bike, car or walk, and as for tax then I pay tax which is spent on roads and Newquay airport but I don't drive or fly???? Also First probably would prosecute these people who want to break the law as it would show a hard line against protest's, and lets nort forget who is really to blame for these fare increases THE DFT!

Officlal stance coming in (I need to repeat this from time to time) ...  "The operators of this board do not condone the breaking of the law, nor incitement to break the law" and that has to apply whether or not we [the operators] consider the law and its effects to be sensible or otherwise.  That point is made with regard to fare strikes / travelling with intent to avoid payment for the services received.

Quite happy to discuss the system and whether fares are fair - indeed we have a separate board with that title!

well said graham, .....lets face facts here we do not have British Rail anymore , we have a privatised railway run by private companies who have shareholders who invest money and require a return. so the folk who are moaning about the 60 p increase is it from Bath to Bristol ,do the companies who they work for fail to raise there prices when fuel etc goes up, when wage costs rise.... i very much doubt it!!
Point is if you feel its too expensive Drive your car and spend hours in traffic jams, catch the bus or walk and if you want to be clever and not pay for your ticket expect to be prosecuted because you are breaking the law

Well said!!

Right Bristol to Bath is a round trip of 26 miles, and will take you half hour each way, according to google that  of course doesnt take into account being stuck from Brislington park and ride all the way to the centre and back again each day.
The cost of running a car is supposedly now 50 p per mile all in, so thats ^13 add to that parking which is about ^5 a day in the centre.
So we are looking at ^18 to drive your car { never used park and ride at bris so dont know that cost} even if park ride was free you are still paying ^13
so it makes the ^6.60 daily return on the train for a 20 min round trip with half hourly departures from BTM about half the price you would pay in the car, and i expect if you purchased a weekly or season ticket it would be a lot cheaper.
Have i lost the plot? or is this moaning for moanings sake...better get to tescos now and moan about paying ^1.03 p per litre of unleaded

The argument "only 60p a day and if you don't like it then drive" has several aspects that I disagree with. Firstly, for a lot of people, driving is not a realistical alternative, either due to personal circumstances, or the time that alternative modes take. Secondly,9.7% is a very big increase when considered against inflation. It may only be 60p a day, but that's ^3 a week or ^140 a year allowing for hoidays. That's a ^200 pay cut overnight when you take tax into consideration.

More telling, I've researched some similar journeys in terms of distance and frequency of service. These show that Bristol to Bath starts as the most expensive per mile (notwithstanding the fare cut earlier this year), and then has the biggest percentage increase added on top of that.

Comparisons are:-

Newport to Cardiff 11.75 miles, increasing from 3.40 to 3.60 (5.9%) . New rate per mile of 15.3p
Soton to Winchester 12.75 mls, increasing from 4.90 to 5.30 (8.2%). New rate per mile of 20.8p
Birm NS to Wolverh'n 12.75mles, increasing from 5.70 to 6.00 (5.3%). New rate per mile of 23.5p
Bristol to Bath 11.5 miles, increasing from 6.20 to 6.80 (9.7%). New rate per mile of 29.6p

Even if you assume that the Welsh rate is a bit of an anomaly, Bath commuters will be paying 42% more per mile than those travelling from Soton to Winchester in modern electrified trains.

So I for one can see why there is resistance to the increase. 
     

But cost's do rise, look how much fuel has gone up and FGW's trains don't run on fresh air!

So do every other TOCs' costs, diesel or electric. Still doesn't explain why FGW are most expensive. It's not the fuel, it's the premium FGW signed up to pay the DaFT.

Think you will probably find that all the premium franchises will need raise additional revenue through the fare box to pay The DFT....Its just another tax

There are very low rates in Cornwall - try Penzance to Plymouth for example. I presume this is also set  by FGW, so one can't blame the premium payments altogether.

This selective pricing was introduced well back in BR days. It can be called "what the market will bear" - and there are indications that the "market" isn't bearing the combined assault of higher fares and unreliable services.